rickomatic
Member
I am confused with this statement. WHO is he talking about? Those who have rained scorn upon Zumbo aren't the "antigunners". I am confused.
However...if Dave Workman is onboard with Ted, so am I.
Ted Nugent needs some help...
- Thread starter HuntCast
- Start date
- Status
I am confused with this statement. WHO is he talking about? Those who have rained scorn upon Zumbo aren't the "antigunners". I am confused.
However...if Dave Workman is onboard with Ted, so am I.
I was mad too,
I was angry at Zumbo. Then amazed that he seemed unable to ''get it. ''
I also believe that he got what he deserved at the time. Now however, I have come to believe that many are still kicking a guy that is down, and out.
It is no longer my kind of fight, and I am out of it. I say, let Zumbo build whatever kind of reputation that he can re earn. If he rebuilds it, he WILL have earned it again. Watch his progress if you will, but at least only criticize him for anti-gun efforts. Certainly things he is doing now are not anti-gun.
We have bigger fish to fry, and all the battles take a lot of energy. Don't waste energy fighting one that is won. Find another that is more satisfying if victory is won. The battles are around in multitudes of numbers, we win a few due to the efforts of a small cadre of dedicated individuals.
We need to stop beating our chests here and get back in the real fight. Beating our chest is not a dignified behavior forever.
That is my opinion, and I know that a portion of posters agree, and posted similarly first. I salute their stance.
I don't say "forgive" him, but say instead, "let him have a chance to win his good name again." You all would likely welcome a reformed true anti, so why not give Zumbo a second chance to stay sane.
Having said all this, I want you all to know that I stand awed and amazed by the accomplishment that the guys who ousted Zumbo achieved. It is a message that will reverberate and not be forgotten. It is an achievement that says, "you can make a difference". lt is much more important than the ultimate fate of Jim Zumbo. I salute the ''let'em have it" crew.
I was angry at Zumbo. Then amazed that he seemed unable to ''get it. ''
I also believe that he got what he deserved at the time. Now however, I have come to believe that many are still kicking a guy that is down, and out.
It is no longer my kind of fight, and I am out of it. I say, let Zumbo build whatever kind of reputation that he can re earn. If he rebuilds it, he WILL have earned it again. Watch his progress if you will, but at least only criticize him for anti-gun efforts. Certainly things he is doing now are not anti-gun.
We have bigger fish to fry, and all the battles take a lot of energy. Don't waste energy fighting one that is won. Find another that is more satisfying if victory is won. The battles are around in multitudes of numbers, we win a few due to the efforts of a small cadre of dedicated individuals.
We need to stop beating our chests here and get back in the real fight. Beating our chest is not a dignified behavior forever.
That is my opinion, and I know that a portion of posters agree, and posted similarly first. I salute their stance.
I don't say "forgive" him, but say instead, "let him have a chance to win his good name again." You all would likely welcome a reformed true anti, so why not give Zumbo a second chance to stay sane.
Having said all this, I want you all to know that I stand awed and amazed by the accomplishment that the guys who ousted Zumbo achieved. It is a message that will reverberate and not be forgotten. It is an achievement that says, "you can make a difference". lt is much more important than the ultimate fate of Jim Zumbo. I salute the ''let'em have it" crew.
Joe the Redneck
Member
- Joined
- Aug 10, 2006
- Messages
- 249
OK, he's my 2 cents.
To my mind, if a man says something, receives a lot of negative feedback over it, and then changes his mind to the opposite opinion, somethings wrong.
This is the classic "Well, tell me sir, just when were you lying?" situation. How can anyone change their mind so compleatly and so quickly? When I form an opinion, I at least like to mull it over for a few days. Heck, if it's a real noodle scratcher, I may even break down and do a little research.
It reminds me of when some celeb makes some foolish remark about a religion, race, or orientaion. They go to a charity dinner, make a PSA, meet a leader from what ever community they offended, and volia! Suddenly they are a new person.
So what am I to think?
A) He thinks my "black rifles" are awful and I'm a monster because I own one?
B) At one time he thought my "black rifles" were awful and I was a monster because I owned one, but now he thinks they're nifty.
C) He believes the Second Amendment only goes so far. Some guns are too dangerous to be in the hands of the public. But because he is a weak willed person, he refuses to stand by his views because he caught a lot of heat over it.
I have more respect for Rosie. Even though I disagree with her on just about everything, at least she stands by her beliefs.
We don't need to worry about "forgiving" him. He doesn't need our forgiveness. He is either ill informed, a liar, or weak. Forgiveness will not cure any of the above three conditions.
That's just my take on it. To those who feel the other way, I respect your views. I simply don't share them.
As for Ted, the man is a walking image problem.
Joe
To my mind, if a man says something, receives a lot of negative feedback over it, and then changes his mind to the opposite opinion, somethings wrong.
This is the classic "Well, tell me sir, just when were you lying?" situation. How can anyone change their mind so compleatly and so quickly? When I form an opinion, I at least like to mull it over for a few days. Heck, if it's a real noodle scratcher, I may even break down and do a little research.
It reminds me of when some celeb makes some foolish remark about a religion, race, or orientaion. They go to a charity dinner, make a PSA, meet a leader from what ever community they offended, and volia! Suddenly they are a new person.
So what am I to think?
A) He thinks my "black rifles" are awful and I'm a monster because I own one?
B) At one time he thought my "black rifles" were awful and I was a monster because I owned one, but now he thinks they're nifty.
C) He believes the Second Amendment only goes so far. Some guns are too dangerous to be in the hands of the public. But because he is a weak willed person, he refuses to stand by his views because he caught a lot of heat over it.
I have more respect for Rosie. Even though I disagree with her on just about everything, at least she stands by her beliefs.
We don't need to worry about "forgiving" him. He doesn't need our forgiveness. He is either ill informed, a liar, or weak. Forgiveness will not cure any of the above three conditions.
That's just my take on it. To those who feel the other way, I respect your views. I simply don't share them.
As for Ted, the man is a walking image problem.
Joe
eoR
Member
Exposure said:
I guess great minds thi.... errr - I mean cannibalistic drunkass punk antigunner hippie turd chewin bubbas who're on the lunatic fringe think alike.
bogie
Member
Okay... Whatcha gonna do with the NEXT company who gets associated with Zumbo? What if it's SIG? Glock? Bushmaster? Colt?
You folks who won't let the past rest need to realize that we can get a LOT of pro-2nd mileage out of Zumbo. Into the hunting community, and into the mainstream media.
Or we can get a little, among our ourselves, and some of you can feel real good that you hurt someone even worse than he hurt himself, and this'll all be forgotten except when the Brady's trot out his stuff as an example, and we do not have a DAMN THING to throw back at 'em other than the same damn rhetoric we've been lamely using since 1968.
You folks who won't let the past rest need to realize that we can get a LOT of pro-2nd mileage out of Zumbo. Into the hunting community, and into the mainstream media.
Or we can get a little, among our ourselves, and some of you can feel real good that you hurt someone even worse than he hurt himself, and this'll all be forgotten except when the Brady's trot out his stuff as an example, and we do not have a DAMN THING to throw back at 'em other than the same damn rhetoric we've been lamely using since 1968.
countryrebel
Member
I agree,Dont kick a man when he is down,ya it's a crappy thing what he did but I think we made him pay the price for it.Only good need's to come from it now and he's trying to do that even if his apology didn't come out right.I dont think it did and I am still pissed but he is trying to redeem himself.Let the the man work for us instead of against us.
This isn't about Zumbo or Nugent
This is about a mob burning the town down that we all live in!
DPMS has done nothing but help the 2A movement. They make EBRs for heaven's sake. They support EBR shooting.
Now because they are peripherally associated with Ted Nugent who sees the value in having Jim Zumbo come back as a redeemed advocate of ALL of gunowners a bunch of Al Qaeida-like gun purists want to burn everyone that isn't a pure ideologue at the stake, and their cousins and friends along with them.
ARE WE THIS STUPID?!?
This is about a mob burning the town down that we all live in!
DPMS has done nothing but help the 2A movement. They make EBRs for heaven's sake. They support EBR shooting.
Now because they are peripherally associated with Ted Nugent who sees the value in having Jim Zumbo come back as a redeemed advocate of ALL of gunowners a bunch of Al Qaeida-like gun purists want to burn everyone that isn't a pure ideologue at the stake, and their cousins and friends along with them.
ARE WE THIS STUPID?!?
jcart
Member
This guy understands
I went to Ted's site and found this.Link:
http://nugeboard.tednugent.com/ubb/Forum12/HTML/000979.html
I don't hunt. Don't want to. That said, I support hunters because they've generally done more for land and wildlife management than most any conservation organizations I can think of. But I don't hunt. The rifles and pistols I own and that I intend to purchase are not to shoot deer with; they are intended, if it ever comes to it, to shoot dirtbags, those who would callously attack me or other innocents. My guns are intended to defend my life and the lives of others.
Because of that orientation, I had never heard of Mr. Zumbo, much less did I know who he was and is, until late last week. Since then, I have read his original blog post, his apologies and other comments, and many articles and forum entries by those who attacked him and defended him, who have forgiven him and who still refuse to. And in all those articles and entries, up to the original posting by and subsequent discussion of Mr. Zumbo's first entry here, I continue to see something which concerns me greatly.
What I saw originally from Mr. Zumbo and others and what I still see is a disconnect, a mental and emotional separation of what they consider a hunting or "sporting" weapon and, well, everything else. Even when someone talks of hunters and shooters, my overwhelming impression is that they refer to "sport" or competition shooting as opposed to shooting intended to train someone for defensive combat. This concerns me greatly, very greatly indeed.
Why? Because it offers me no hope that the majority of "sportsmen" will fight for my rights to keep my weapons. They're not hunting weapons, after all; they're not sporting weapons, after all. They're not OUR weapons, after all.
This worries me because even now, Mr. Zumbo and others posting here don't seem to understand that I AM THE CANARY IN THE TUNNEL. The liberals, the Democrats, they will start with me. "You don't hunt, you don't have hunting weapons. You must be dangerous to us!" Some of you will nod your heads and not protest; they're not going after the hunters, after all.
YET.
They'll take me first because I'm a small group compared to hunters and "sportsmen." That will give them momentum and set a precedent. That snowball will get bigger as it picks up power. They may not need as much to get me as they do you; they don't care. They'll get what they need, just like the Australian government did; just like the English government did.
Look at Australia. Look hard. Seen any guns? Rifles? Shotguns? Heirlooms? Anything passed down from father to son? They'll be hard to find; government picked them up and melted them all to scrap. INCLUDING HUNTING WEAPONS.
And I'd be willing to bet they lied to the hunters before they did it, too; just like the politicians are lying to you right now.
So, please, I beg you, help me to keep my defensive arms. Help me not because you like "black rifles", but because you like your scoped, bolt-action Remington 700; not because you're fond of AKs but because you like your Ithaca; not because you necessarily want me to keep my guns, but because I WANT US ALL TO BE ABLE TO KEEP THEM NO MATTER WHAT KIND THEY ARE.
So maybe you don't like the NRA any more. Well and good. Try the 2nd Amendment Foundation; the Gun Owners Of America; even Jews For The Preservation of Firearms Ownership (you don't have to be Jewish to join). By this time next month I intend to be a member of all of them--not because I agree with every line of their respective platforms, but because I know that a kind word and an active organization will get me farther with Congresscritters than a kind word alone. I invite you to join some of them with me. Please.
Don't do it for me personally. I'm just a canary. Do it for you, so the gas won't flood the mine and destroy you as well.
Read the reponse and his (CRW) direct post of Brady Campaign's feeling's about bolt action rifles.
Pay attention to the bigger picture, they want our rifles, shotguns, pistols and yes our 22's. Stand as one or fall divided. It is coming. Wake up.Articles on all of these were on the Brady's blog.
I went to Ted's site and found this.Link:
http://nugeboard.tednugent.com/ubb/Forum12/HTML/000979.html
I don't hunt. Don't want to. That said, I support hunters because they've generally done more for land and wildlife management than most any conservation organizations I can think of. But I don't hunt. The rifles and pistols I own and that I intend to purchase are not to shoot deer with; they are intended, if it ever comes to it, to shoot dirtbags, those who would callously attack me or other innocents. My guns are intended to defend my life and the lives of others.
Because of that orientation, I had never heard of Mr. Zumbo, much less did I know who he was and is, until late last week. Since then, I have read his original blog post, his apologies and other comments, and many articles and forum entries by those who attacked him and defended him, who have forgiven him and who still refuse to. And in all those articles and entries, up to the original posting by and subsequent discussion of Mr. Zumbo's first entry here, I continue to see something which concerns me greatly.
What I saw originally from Mr. Zumbo and others and what I still see is a disconnect, a mental and emotional separation of what they consider a hunting or "sporting" weapon and, well, everything else. Even when someone talks of hunters and shooters, my overwhelming impression is that they refer to "sport" or competition shooting as opposed to shooting intended to train someone for defensive combat. This concerns me greatly, very greatly indeed.
Why? Because it offers me no hope that the majority of "sportsmen" will fight for my rights to keep my weapons. They're not hunting weapons, after all; they're not sporting weapons, after all. They're not OUR weapons, after all.
This worries me because even now, Mr. Zumbo and others posting here don't seem to understand that I AM THE CANARY IN THE TUNNEL. The liberals, the Democrats, they will start with me. "You don't hunt, you don't have hunting weapons. You must be dangerous to us!" Some of you will nod your heads and not protest; they're not going after the hunters, after all.
YET.
They'll take me first because I'm a small group compared to hunters and "sportsmen." That will give them momentum and set a precedent. That snowball will get bigger as it picks up power. They may not need as much to get me as they do you; they don't care. They'll get what they need, just like the Australian government did; just like the English government did.
Look at Australia. Look hard. Seen any guns? Rifles? Shotguns? Heirlooms? Anything passed down from father to son? They'll be hard to find; government picked them up and melted them all to scrap. INCLUDING HUNTING WEAPONS.
And I'd be willing to bet they lied to the hunters before they did it, too; just like the politicians are lying to you right now.
So, please, I beg you, help me to keep my defensive arms. Help me not because you like "black rifles", but because you like your scoped, bolt-action Remington 700; not because you're fond of AKs but because you like your Ithaca; not because you necessarily want me to keep my guns, but because I WANT US ALL TO BE ABLE TO KEEP THEM NO MATTER WHAT KIND THEY ARE.
So maybe you don't like the NRA any more. Well and good. Try the 2nd Amendment Foundation; the Gun Owners Of America; even Jews For The Preservation of Firearms Ownership (you don't have to be Jewish to join). By this time next month I intend to be a member of all of them--not because I agree with every line of their respective platforms, but because I know that a kind word and an active organization will get me farther with Congresscritters than a kind word alone. I invite you to join some of them with me. Please.
Don't do it for me personally. I'm just a canary. Do it for you, so the gas won't flood the mine and destroy you as well.
Read the reponse and his (CRW) direct post of Brady Campaign's feeling's about bolt action rifles.
Pay attention to the bigger picture, they want our rifles, shotguns, pistols and yes our 22's. Stand as one or fall divided. It is coming. Wake up.Articles on all of these were on the Brady's blog.
Dave Workman
Member
Whoa! Waitaminute!
I know Ted, and I'm not sure if anybody can claim to be "onboard" with him.
Ted does his own thing and I simply report the facts, ma'm!
And one of us posts in fluent, easily understood straight English.
Ragnar Danneskjold
Member
Is everyone aware of the phrase "don't cut off your nose to spite your face"?
Welcome to THR jcart!
Our values are inside us. Freedom is a very high value to me and as I observe, many posters on this site. Perhaps freedom is only second to life itself for most of us in our value systems.
I think the offensive part of Zumbo is that, by his own writing, he does not share that value with me. The basis of the 2nd amendment is to confirm the value of armed people in the furtherance of freedom.
By now going out on a public relations stunt, and hunting with a black weapon in an attempt to show he is a good dude, he only tells me he still does not get it; I feel like he is scamming us. I am highly suspicious of the motive for his check to fight 1022.
The issue is not what rifles work best for hunting; the issue is that freedom, our natural rights, and the 2nd amendment demand that all arms be freely available to us. This Zumbo wanted denied to us if they were black, and more designed for defense than hunting. I think that the real problem is his black heart, not black weapons, and I do not see how he could suddenly have this great epiphany. To me it all looks like it is now over money.
I think the offensive part of Zumbo is that, by his own writing, he does not share that value with me. The basis of the 2nd amendment is to confirm the value of armed people in the furtherance of freedom.
By now going out on a public relations stunt, and hunting with a black weapon in an attempt to show he is a good dude, he only tells me he still does not get it; I feel like he is scamming us. I am highly suspicious of the motive for his check to fight 1022.
The issue is not what rifles work best for hunting; the issue is that freedom, our natural rights, and the 2nd amendment demand that all arms be freely available to us. This Zumbo wanted denied to us if they were black, and more designed for defense than hunting. I think that the real problem is his black heart, not black weapons, and I do not see how he could suddenly have this great epiphany. To me it all looks like it is now over money.
Dave Workman
Member
Evidently not.
CrazySpyder69
Member
Could someone give me a breif explination on what Zumbo did/said. Something other than "search NOOB". Because chances are if I did search I would just find ppl bashing zumbo and not really understand the real,truthfull explination of what he did.
HuntCast
Member
Exposure
Member
CrazySpyder69-
Zumbo is/was a magazine writer, he said that AR-15's were rifles used by terrorists, they have no place in the hunting world, and they should be banned.
The backlash was staggering.
He has now "seen the error of his ways" and is totally reformed and thinks they are great. He has changed his song entirely and is bending over backwards to try and save his career, it's too late. The truth was revealed in his initial statement.
Ted Nugent is endorsing him strongly and has forgiven all the damage Zumbo did with his stupid rant.
DPMS is now pulling their support of Nugent. Ted sees his free guns and advertising revenue going out the window and is begging for help.
My version of events is probably going to draw some fire, so be it.
Zumbo is/was a magazine writer, he said that AR-15's were rifles used by terrorists, they have no place in the hunting world, and they should be banned.
The backlash was staggering.
He has now "seen the error of his ways" and is totally reformed and thinks they are great. He has changed his song entirely and is bending over backwards to try and save his career, it's too late. The truth was revealed in his initial statement.
Ted Nugent is endorsing him strongly and has forgiven all the damage Zumbo did with his stupid rant.
DPMS is now pulling their support of Nugent. Ted sees his free guns and advertising revenue going out the window and is begging for help.
My version of events is probably going to draw some fire, so be it.
Pilgrim
Member
Zumbo's rehabilitation seems not too much different than a gun hating liberal who gets mugged and decides guns aren't that bad after all.
Do we embrace one and reject the other?
Pilgrim
Do we embrace one and reject the other?
Pilgrim
Zumbo needs to do a few things first.
# 1 not just appologize, admit he was wrong! Specifically admit that his comments can be used against us later by making it seem like the 2nd is about hunting only, and making it seem like the AR has no place in the sporting field
# 2 clarify that the 2nd amendment is NOT about hunting, it is about freedom
#3 clarify that the AR family can and does have a sporting roll, not just competition either, out in the field taking prariedogs or whatever.
#4 Admit that it is reasonable for us to be skeptical about this sudden change of heart or re-evalutation of his statement.
#5 Stop trying to cover up the mistake with comments along the lines of 'I have supported the 2nd for years, you should overlook those times when I don't' Which is what he is basically saying when he kept on pointing back to older comments when this firestorm hit.
# 1 not just appologize, admit he was wrong! Specifically admit that his comments can be used against us later by making it seem like the 2nd is about hunting only, and making it seem like the AR has no place in the sporting field
# 2 clarify that the 2nd amendment is NOT about hunting, it is about freedom
#3 clarify that the AR family can and does have a sporting roll, not just competition either, out in the field taking prariedogs or whatever.
#4 Admit that it is reasonable for us to be skeptical about this sudden change of heart or re-evalutation of his statement.
#5 Stop trying to cover up the mistake with comments along the lines of 'I have supported the 2nd for years, you should overlook those times when I don't' Which is what he is basically saying when he kept on pointing back to older comments when this firestorm hit.
Shootcraps
Member
- Joined
- Jan 18, 2004
- Messages
- 1,007
Email sent. I'm with The Nuge.
browningguy
Member
Somebody needs to learn how to read.
I said, I don't care if teddie wants to help Zumbo. What I do care about is being labled all the rubbish he decided to call anyone who disagrees with him. I don't hate anyone that I know of, in particular I don't think at all about Zumbo or teddie, except to ignore them for their rash statements and inability to think.
If you think Zumbo and crew want to help you, you're not paying attention.
CrazySpyder69
Member
WOW! Alot of quick replies.
What does DPMS stand for? Is that the magazine he was associated with?
What does DPMS stand for? Is that the magazine he was associated with?
browningguy
Member
There you go, keep to the high road.
Gotta love it.
plexreticle
Member
- Joined
- Oct 8, 2006
- Messages
- 1,240
I'm not gonna down Nugent for making nice-nice to Zumbo but I'm not gonna go write letters on his behalf either.
I don't think Nugent is doing himself or anybody else favors by name calling and finger pointing other gun owners. Talk about fodder for the Brady Bunch. WTG Ted.
I don't think Nugent is doing himself or anybody else favors by name calling and finger pointing other gun owners. Talk about fodder for the Brady Bunch. WTG Ted.
Lucky
Member
sent:
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