Interesting failure to stop

Status
Not open for further replies.
P

p35

Member
Joined
Dec 24, 2002
Messages
999
Location
Puget Sound
This week I had to sit in on a trial involving a drug ripoff. The "victim" was in the driver's seat of an SUV and was shot through the thigh with a .45 Gold Dot from a 5" 1911 type pistol by a guy leaning over from the back seat. Don't know the bullet weight. The bullet went deep enough to touch his femur but glanced off without breaking it, passing out the back of his leg. He then intentionally rolled the vehicle hoping to get away from the robbers as he was belted in and they weren't. They got out and ran off.

Now the interesting part: When the cops got there a few minutes later, he was out of the vehicle walking up and down the road and not limping. He was more concerned about his head (they had whacked him in the head a few times with the .45) than his leg. In fact, neither he or the cops realized he was shot until the paramedics found the wound. He said he felt a burning sensation and that was it.

Four months later, the exit wound still hasn't healed completely. He says he learned his lesson about messing with drugs and quit, FWIW- he was one of these users who deal to support their own habit, not a heavyweight.

Anyway, I thought it was odd that someone could take a .45 Gold Dot through the thigh and not notice it. Says something about how effective handguns really are.
 
Thats why they preach shot placement. I remember when I was in Iraq we took in this Iraqi general and his wife who had been ambushed in their house. The wife took a pistol round (.25 0r .32 I think...might have been 9mm) through the neck and it exited the top of her head. She was walking and talking and didnt even really notice it. She also wasnt even bleeding all that bad. Her husband took a couple AK rounds to the back. He was in bad shape, but he lived.
 
Exactly, if it was PCP (I doubt it) he might have been able to kill all those people in his car after being shot in the chest. LSD is another one which is considered an analgetic. People on some drugs can do some amazing things.


Then again, adrenaline itself has been known to cause some pretty crazy things to happen.
 
The wonders of ballistics. You can never guarantee 100% what a bullet will do. Especially when you mix in the unknown factors of human anatomy.

Havings said that I will point out that this is unusual. I have been radiating victims for decades. Many of them GSW. We see a fair amount of 9mm, 380, 38spl etc. come into ER. We see a lot fewer people shot with 45acp, 12 guage etc. and those, as in this case were hit in an extremity. The last patient I had hit in the leg by 45acp had to have his distal femur reconstructed with bone grafts. The round had chewed the hell out of the bone just above the knee. This guy was beaucoup lucky he didn't end up
with a significant disability.
 
Thats pretty crazy - first that it didn't break the femur. But I'm not familiar with Meth having such a pain-killing effect. Its an effective stimulant, but not an anesthetic like PCP in any way. Maybe since it didn't actually break the femur and there was surely a lot of adrenaline flowing through him, there wasn't enough of a pain response, but still... interesting.

Yeah - definitely lucky it wasn't PCP he had sold them. Although I would be interested to see two people on PCP go at it haha. That drug is absolutely ridiculous for the effects it can have on the human body.
 
No drugs necessary, just a little panic and old fashioned adrenalin. One of my partners shot himself in the leg. The bullet entered his calf just below the knee and exited just above the ankle. His little boy was standing next to him and he snatched him up and checked him over and even had time to find the hole in the carpet before he realized he was hit! It was a 180gr 40 cal Gold Dot. It didn't expand.
 
LSD is another one which is considered an analgetic.
Click to expand...

The more common term is "analgesic." (interesting factoid: "analgetic" is a common descriptor used in gay dating sites... I get a strange vision of someone doing jumping jacks while... but I digress...)

And LSD is in no way an analgesic. If anything, it'd likely lead to a bit more of a freakout/adrenaline dump. Yeah, it messes with neuron function, but nowhere near what you'd really like to have happen in a trauma situation.

Remember - just because the nice officer has a DARE patch doesn't mean he knows that much about what he's talking about.

With PCP, you're basically dealing with an alien lifeform - none of the basic rules apply. As for meth - I've seen a guy walking down the street trying to hold his guts in... He was hurting, but he was also highly motivated... Personally, if I'm ever the recipient of a gunshot wound, at the earliest convenience of the responders, I want old-fashioned opiods - morphine or a reasonable facsimile thereof.
 
Took a 9mm through the leg right above my knee in a range accident , never noticed it until someone pointed out to me my leg was bleeding , but that was ball ammo tho ...:uhoh: It all depends on the person frame of mind and most importantly , shot placement .
 
Last edited:
Most likely shock.
I heard about (but never actually saw) a study done long ago that said other than BP drop due to traumatic injury or brain destruction, the single most important factor in dropping someone with a gun shot is the fact that they KNOW they were shot.
Years ago I was in a motorcycle wreak. I shattered the top of my tibia and broke my clavicle. I tried to stand, but fell back down and thought I banged my knee hard. I did get up and walk over to the sidewalk to sit down and wait for the paramedics to arrive.
When the paramedics arrived, I convinced them I was fine (I felt fine), but as they were just about to drive off, I felt my clavicle sticking up where it shouldn't be sticking up and had someone go stop them from leaving. At the hospital then said I would be going in for surgery the next day. "For a broken clavicle," I protested. Nope, had to put a couple of screws into my tibia (still there) to hold the the greater tuberosity together.
AFTER the surgury I felt the PAIN, oh boy did I feel the pain.
 
1) Call your local courthouse to determine when court (you likely want superior court or its local equivalent) will be in session, and what courtroom(s) will be occupied. Likely more than one, unless you live in a small town.

2) Leave all your EDC hardware save keys and ID in your car (or at home). Dress nicely, don't look like a thug-in-training.

3) Go to your local courthouse

4) Go to the courtroom

5) Go in and sit down

6) When the bailiff says "All rise," stand up. When everyone else sits down, sit.

7) Watch and learn. Beats teevee hands down. Remember not to laugh out loud. Sometimes it's hard to control yourself. Best of all there's no admission charge. Have fun!

lpl/nc
 
Shock and adrenalin could have done it for the lack of pain and still being
able to move.

As for not breaking the bone.

a guy leaning over from the back seat. Don't know the bullet weight. The bullet went deep enough to touch his femur but glanced off without breaking it
Click to expand...

Think about the angle, guy in the back seat, leaning from center (probably),
from his right side, reaching with an across the front of the driver angle. So
it was just a skimming shot.

I still would not want to get hit even with it missing the bone. He could have
bled out if it hit the large leg vein.
 
P32,

Handguns are kind of wonky it depends on the trauma suffered by the shot, shot placement, and the subject's physical condition at the time of the shot. Since the bullet obviously didn't cause any fatal trauma, the man who was apparently high was able to shrug it off and walk about. Very interesting.
 
Watching trials:

I started by going to law school, so it's part of my job. Anyone is free to sit in on a trial, but I have to warn you that it's about 100 times less exciting than it looks on TV.
 
In the video "Deadly Effects" there is a morgue picture of a man's back who had been shot forty three (yes 43) times with 9mm JHP ammo (that didn't expand).
(posting the picture probably wouldn't be THR)

Something over twenty exit holes can be seen in his back.
The man CONTINUED to fight until he was stopped with 2 (or 3) 12ga shotgun slugs. That also exited his back.

If this example is used, the 9mm has got to be the world's worst defensive handgun.

But they point out in the video that not one 9mm bullet hit a spot that would instantly put the man down.

And that guy had to be one tough SOB.:eek:


I recommend the videos "Deadly Weapons" and "Deadly Effects". Some of the info is a little dated now but still interesting.
"Deadly Effects" is very graphic.
 
Wow. Setting the 9MM lethality debate aside, forty-three entance and/or exit wounds and not a single vital organ penetration? I'd say that SOB had made a binding pact with :evil: .
 
Her husband took a couple AK rounds to the back. He was in bad shape, but he lived.
Click to expand...

I work with a Hmong (spelling) man, when he was 5 years old he took (from what he has shown) 3 rounds from an AK, one is right along his neck, not the first time he was shot either...

He's a tough little bugger!
 
Had a friend who was out in hunting season. driving his pickup down a dirt road he told me he suddenly felt this tremendous pain in his chest,and thought he was having a heart attack. turns out someone had shot a 30 caliber round right thru the door of his truck and the round continued on thru both his knees. he had his son and another friend with him and they got him to a hospital. my friend said after the intial chest pain he did not have any pain in his knees. This was 12yrs ago, he can walk but his knees are still a mess. so I think you can be shot and not feel it. I think the body has an automatic nerve shutdown on tramatic wounds.
 
This couldn't possibly have happened!:fire:

We all know from reading Jeff Cooper and Wiley Clapp said that if you place a .45 ACP within 6 feet of a person they die instantly from the shock wave!:p
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

S
  • Locked
Man Suspected Of Shooting Officer Released
2 3 4
Replies
81
Views
6K
cassandrasdaddy
C
G
  • Locked
Interesting story on cnn.com now
Replies
12
Views
1K
geophysicishooter
G
S
  • Locked
Man shoots his own hand, leg and a nearby home.
2 3
Replies
55
Views
3K
Robert
Robert
P
  • Locked
Motorist grabs gun, kills car-jacker
2
Replies
38
Views
2K
orionengnr
O
D
  • Locked
(S. Africa) "I didn't stop shooting"
Replies
8
Views
1K
Zoogster
Z
Back
Top