Ratzinger_p38
Member
The question I have about Thompson, wasnt he out of the Senate by the time the reauthorization of the PA came to a vote?
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Anyone else watching the GOP debate
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Titan6
member
Ratz- Absolutely. Fred was out of the Senate. Which is why to this day I am still in total shock that he would craft a strong letter of support and circulate it to get dozens of former house and senate members (among others) to sign on it. Then go to the floor and testify how neccesary the PA was even though it had not nabbed any terrrorists.
That is dedication above and beyond the call to the most troubling pieces of legislatation to come out of the congress in my lifetime. If he is that dedicated than he will never get rid of it. And for what? People control....
Stage2 - When we talked Paul two months ago I said we would see after the debates. After debate #1 there has now been a major shift in the polls and Paul is doing much better. Now I know how you feel and all but did you anticipate this or were you surprised?
Also Hunter looked pretty good. I read Him as kind of like GWB on steroids.
That is dedication above and beyond the call to the most troubling pieces of legislatation to come out of the congress in my lifetime. If he is that dedicated than he will never get rid of it. And for what? People control....
Stage2 - When we talked Paul two months ago I said we would see after the debates. After debate #1 there has now been a major shift in the polls and Paul is doing much better. Now I know how you feel and all but did you anticipate this or were you surprised?
Also Hunter looked pretty good. I read Him as kind of like GWB on steroids.
High Planes Drifter
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Weak format. Weak debate. Not everyone got the same questions. Next time they do this, they need to can Chris Mathews.
Boy is that a big +1. What in the world were they thinking when they asked him to do it in the first place? Bob Schiefer (sp?) wouldnt be a bad choice IMO, if he wanted to do it. He's done a few over the years.
Here is a video of Dr. Paul's responses:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Hfa7vT02lA
From my perspective, Ron is this nation's only hope - not for something as inane as "saving the GOP" - but for beginning the awesome task of reinstating a gov't limited to the Constitution and Bill of Rights; a much nobler goal in my opinion.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Hfa7vT02lA
From my perspective, Ron is this nation's only hope - not for something as inane as "saving the GOP" - but for beginning the awesome task of reinstating a gov't limited to the Constitution and Bill of Rights; a much nobler goal in my opinion.
Stage2 - When we talked Paul two months ago I said we would see after the debates. After debate #1 there has now been a major shift in the polls and Paul is doing much better. Now I know how you feel and all but did you anticipate this or were you surprised?
If you're speaking about the MSNBC poll its completely unscientific and probably sabotaged. I haven't seen anything from any of the formal polling organizations that suggests Paul is in a different position than he was before the debate.
What has changed is that Thompson has tipped his hat. When we talked originally, I felt that guliani was the only republican that had a chance of beating hillary. Since Thompson has suggested he is going to run, I think he could beat what the dems have to offer. His positions are solid, he doesn't have any dirt or drama that I'm aware of and he's been on TV and in movies for decades giving him notoriety with the public.
Either way I will still be voting repubilcan in the general election regardless of who it is, but if Thompson runs, he has my vote.
Also Hunter looked pretty good. I read Him as kind of like GWB on steroids.
I like him as well. He's a congressman here in San Diego and I've talked to him on a couple of ocassions. He's a stand up guy and actually believes what he says. His problem however is money and face time, and for these reasons unless something crazy happens I don't feel he's electable.
Titan6
member
If you're speaking about the MSNBC poll its completely unscientific and probably sabotaged.
Honestly, I suspect the same myself. Don't get me wrong I fully support Paul but unless there is more substantial evidence about I read there may be some kind of monkey works afoot. The MSM still ignores him to a great degree. Sooner or later he may become the elephant in the room.
I am thinking Hunter might get the nod for VP if the GOP believes he can deliver California. That is an awfully tall order but, if successful would nearly guarantee the Whitehouse to the GOP.
Ratzinger_p38
Member
Ratz- Absolutely. Fred was out of the Senate. Which is why to this day I am still in total shock that he would craft a strong letter of support and circulate it to get dozens of former house and senate members (among others) to sign on it. Then go to the floor and testify how neccesary the PA was even though it had not nabbed any terrrorists
I might still have to swallow that poison pill, that alone is not enough to make him worse than the hucksters currently the R frontrunners. IF he had allowed it once and then didnt want it renewed I would have been more forgiving.
Titan6
member
Well, for me that is the sticking point. Because of this I am down to one candidate, Paul.
Otherwise I like Fred well enough. He is also very electable. If he reveresed himself on this issue and admitted it was a mistake and promised to repeal it then maybe? Otherwise I like my Consitutition the way it was. The big irony here is the PA is full of things the left wanted for years and the right kept them from getting them...
Otherwise I like Fred well enough. He is also very electable. If he reveresed himself on this issue and admitted it was a mistake and promised to repeal it then maybe? Otherwise I like my Consitutition the way it was. The big irony here is the PA is full of things the left wanted for years and the right kept them from getting them...
TrybalRage
Member
Stage2, I can't even take your anti-Ron arguments seriously anymore.
You think that everything positive about him is faked, or forged, and that his chances suck so bad you might as well kick him out of the running now. The only people who like him in America are on this very board.
We get it.
You think that everything positive about him is faked, or forged, and that his chances suck so bad you might as well kick him out of the running now. The only people who like him in America are on this very board.
We get it.
Stage2, I can't even take your anti-Ron arguments seriously anymore.
Sorry to hear that, but don't not read these threads on my account.
You think that everything positive about him is faked, or forged, and that his chances suck so bad you might as well kick him out of the running now. The only people who like him in America are on this very board.
We get it.
No, I think that the msnbc poll is totally bogus, and many Paul supporters agree. I think that the msnbc poll for the dem debate is bogus as well. However the fact that Paul had to petition to be invited to the 2nd debate is telling.
pcosmar
member
STAGE 2
I believe that it was the many calls, letters, and E-mails that got Dr. Paul on the second debate.
http://www.opednews.com/articles/genera_alex_wal_070505_press_ignores_paul_g.htm
http://www.chattanoogan.com/articles/article_106825.asp
http://www.fxstreet.com/fundamental/market-view/merk-insights/2007-04-30.html
http://www.newswithviews.com/baldwin/baldwin367.htm
Your opinion. Ron Paul supporters do not agree.No, I think that the msnbc poll is totally bogus, and many Paul supporters agree. I think that the msnbc poll for the dem debate is bogus as well. However the fact that Paul had to petition to be invited to the 2nd debate is telling.
I believe that it was the many calls, letters, and E-mails that got Dr. Paul on the second debate.
http://www.opednews.com/articles/genera_alex_wal_070505_press_ignores_paul_g.htm
http://www.chattanoogan.com/articles/article_106825.asp
http://www.fxstreet.com/fundamental/market-view/merk-insights/2007-04-30.html
http://www.newswithviews.com/baldwin/baldwin367.htm
Your opinion. Ron Paul supporters do not agree.
I didn't say all, I said some, and there are at least 2 people in this thread that stated this.
I believe that it was the many calls, letters, and E-mails that got Dr. Paul on the second debate.
I never disputed that. I simply pointed out the fact that when you have to petition on your candidates behalf to get him invited to the SECOND of fifteen or so debates, thas not a good sign at all.
High Planes Drifter
Member
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- Feb 21, 2006
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- 1,204
I never disputed that. I simply pointed out the fact that when you have to petition on your candidates behalf to get him invited to the SECOND of fifteen or so debates, thas not a good sign at all.
You have a valid point; but consider that many of those folks may not have been Paul supporters before the first debate, and were impressed with him enough to petition for him afterwards. Just something to consider.
pcosmar
member
Of course it could b that the "powers that be" don't want Ron Paul, though the people do.
http://www.opednews.com/articles/genera_alex_wal_070505_press_ignores_paul_g.htm
http://www.opednews.com/articles/genera_alex_wal_070505_press_ignores_paul_g.htm
You really have to wonder why it is not The Headline.The headlines seen from a Google News search using the keyword “debate”, at the time of this writing show only this:
“John McCain Wins First GOP Debate” (Fox News)
“Who Won the First GOP Presidential Debate? (Answer provided in article: “Mitt Romney” - National Review Online)
"Republican Presidential Debate Gives No Clue on GOP Leader in Race” (Axcess News)
Apparently the Axcess News editors don't have a clue - unlike actual debate viewers.
A news search for the keywords “won debate” reveals this:
“Noonan, Pundits: Romney Won Debate” (NewsMax)
"Giuliani Wary of Repeal of Roe” (Washington Times)
No need to go any further with this. Only one outlet (Earth Times) showed a headline that Ron aul won - but it was just a reprint of the Paul campaign’s post-debate news release, not an actual valuation by a media outlet’s reporter or pundit.
Unsurprisingly, not a single report of the actual political news story of the decade, namely, that a virtually unknown “dark horse” beats even the media favorite Romney handily - and utterly crushes the rest of the field.
Ratzinger_p38
Member
Of course it could b that the "powers that be" don't want Ron Paul, though the people do.
Yeah because the "powers that be" want to continue down the path of endless interventions. Iran? Syria? How about Myanmar? Hell Mugabe is still in power! And if those fail, we can always start nuclear war with China and Russia.
What the GOP leaders fail miserably to see is that the current 'GOP' is so off base that the party looks like the Democratic Party of 1968 instead of the Republican Party of 2007.
Of course it could b that the "powers that be" don't want Ron Paul, though the people do.
Look, I don't care whether its the powers that be, the Democrats, republicans, space aliens, or little bunny foo foo, the bottom line is that for WHATEVER the reason Paul ain't going anywhere. Donate your 401K and spend all your time on a gun forum singing his praises and its not going to change anything.
You can call myself and others who are simply pointing out this reality as many names as you like, but that too won't change anything. Paul is a libertarian and he's unelectable. Thats just the way it is.
He's "unelectable" because of the defeatist attitudes of persons who should know better and for the apathy of many as well as the Corporatists who'd prefer it that way.
If you adore the status quo then throw your vote to whichever monster you choose. We understand.
If you adore the status quo then throw your vote to whichever monster you choose. We understand.
So what's really going on here and why are many falling for the "Mind Control" (accepting the propaganda)
Clear Media Conspiracy Against Ron Paul
By Carl F. Worden
5-8-7
... (The) conspiracy to ignore and marginalize presidential candidate Ron Paul is not a theory. In this case, a jury would have to conclude a conspiracy against Dr. Paul by the corporation-controlled media exists.
First, MSNBC reported that Ron Paul scored the highest positive votes in both Republican debates he attended. That means he beat out Romney, McCain and Giuliani. There was no mention of these poll results in the major media.
Dick Morris, political pundit and former Clinton buddy, wrote an opinion piece that appeared in many media publications 5/7/07, in which he claimed John McCain had won the debate, and I could find nowhere in his piece that Ron Paul had even attended.
CNN's Glenn Beck, an alleged conservative (my fanny) ran a tiny clip on his show that tried to make Ron Paul look like a blithering idiot. He then went on to ask, "How did this guy get in the debate at all"?
Even WorldNetDaily, a prominent, conservative Internet news provider, has largely ignored Ron Paul's candidacy.
When a candidate wins two debate polls in a row that are reported by the likes of MSNBC on its own web page, that is news, especially since the winner of both polls allegedly had no chance to win the nomination. The media normally jumps on that kind of news, because people in America love underdogs, but not this time.
No, this is a concerted effort.
Please review below what Representative Ron Paul stands for, and far more importantly, what he has done. Among other things, Ron Paul is the only congressmen who got up and demanded Congress declare war before attacking Iraq.
Carl F. Worden
About Ron
Brief Overview of Congressman Paul's Record
He has never voted to raise taxes.
He has never voted for an unbalanced budget.
He has never voted for a federal restriction on gun ownership.
He has never voted to raise congressional pay.
He has never taken a government-paid junket.
He has never voted to increase the power of the executive branch.
He voted against the Patriot Act.
He voted against regulating the Internet.
He voted against the Iraq war.
He does not participate in the lucrative congressional pension program.
He returns a portion of his annual congressional office budget to the U.S. treasury every year.
Congressman Paul introduces numerous pieces of substantive legislation each year, probably more than any single member of Congress.
Congressman Ron Paul (R-Texas) is the leading advocate for freedom in our nation's capital. As a member of the U.S. House of Representatives, Dr. Paul tirelessly works for limited constitutional government, low taxes, free markets, and a return to sound monetary policies. He is known among his congressional colleagues and his constituents for his consistent voting record. Dr. Paul never votes for legislation unless the proposed measure is expressly authorized by the Constitution. In the words of former Treasury Secretary William Simon, Dr. Paul is the "one exception to the Gang of 535" on Capitol Hill.
Ron Paul was born and raised in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. He graduated from Gettysburg College and the Duke University School of Medicine, before proudly serving as a flight surgeon in the U.S. Air Force during the 1960s. He and his wife Carol moved to Texas in 1968, where he began his medical practice in Brazoria County. As a specialist in obstetrics/gynecology, Dr. Paul has delivered more than 4,000 babies. He and Carol, who reside in Lake Jackson, Texas, are the proud parents of five children and have 17 grandchildren.
While serving in Congress during the late 1970s and early 1980s, Dr. Paul's limited-government ideals were not popular in Washington. In 1976, he was one of only four Republican congressmen to endorse Ronald Reagan for president.
During that time, Congressman Paul served on the House Banking committee, where he was a strong advocate for sound monetary policy and an outspoken critic of the Federal Reserve's inflationary measures. He was an unwavering advocate of pro-life and pro-family values. Dr. Paul consistently voted to lower or abolish federal taxes, spending and regulation, and used his House seat to actively promote the return of government to its proper constitutional levels. In 1984, he voluntarily relinquished his House seat and returned to his medical practice.
Dr. Paul returned to Congress in 1997 to represent the 14th congressional district of Texas. He presently serves on the House Committee on Financial Services and the House Committee on Foreign Affairs. He continues to advocate a dramatic reduction in the size of the federal government and a return to constitutional principles.
Congressman Paul's consistent voting record prompted one of his congressional colleagues to say, "Ron Paul personifies the Founding Fathers' ideal of the citizen-statesman. He makes it clear that his principles will never be compromised, and they never are." Another colleague observed, "There are few people in public life who, through thick and thin, rain or shine, stick to their principles. Ron Paul is one of those few."
May 05, 2007 Ron Paul Wins MSNBC Debate Poll
Highest Positive, Lowest Negative
In the MSNBC.com rating window of 72,419 votes at 8:10 PM EDT, Friday, May 4, Ron Paul not only had the highest positive rating:
32% Paul
30% Romney
26% Giuliani
21% McCain
14% Huckabee
9% Brownback
9% Tancredo
8% Hunter
8% Thompson
6% Gilmore
...but he also had the lowest negative rating:
29% Paul
35% Romney
37% Huckabee
40% Giuliani
42% McCain
43% Gilmore
43% Hunter
45% Thompson
45% Tancredo
46% Brownback
Posted on May 05, 2007 at 10:57 AM | Permalink
May 04, 2007
Press Release
Ron Paul Wins MSNBC Debate Poll
Ron Paul steps into national spotlight
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
May 4, 2007
ARLINGTON, VA * Congressman Ron Paul finished first in the MSNBC poll following the GOP primary debate last night held at the Reagan Library in Simi Valley, California. Dr. Paul received 43 percent, beating the second-place finisher by five points, and crushing the rest of the field.
"Last night, Americans met Ron Paul and loved what they heard," said Ron Paul 2008 campaign chairman Kent Snyder. "Dr. Paul's message of freedom and limited government resonates with Republicans hungry for a return to their party's core values."
"Ron Paul is the only true conservative in the GOP race. Americans saw that last night," continued Snyder. "The campaign looks forward to further debates and opportunities so even more Americans will discover Dr. Paul's message of freedom, peace and prosperity."
Clear Media Conspiracy Against Ron Paul
By Carl F. Worden
5-8-7
... (The) conspiracy to ignore and marginalize presidential candidate Ron Paul is not a theory. In this case, a jury would have to conclude a conspiracy against Dr. Paul by the corporation-controlled media exists.
First, MSNBC reported that Ron Paul scored the highest positive votes in both Republican debates he attended. That means he beat out Romney, McCain and Giuliani. There was no mention of these poll results in the major media.
Dick Morris, political pundit and former Clinton buddy, wrote an opinion piece that appeared in many media publications 5/7/07, in which he claimed John McCain had won the debate, and I could find nowhere in his piece that Ron Paul had even attended.
CNN's Glenn Beck, an alleged conservative (my fanny) ran a tiny clip on his show that tried to make Ron Paul look like a blithering idiot. He then went on to ask, "How did this guy get in the debate at all"?
Even WorldNetDaily, a prominent, conservative Internet news provider, has largely ignored Ron Paul's candidacy.
When a candidate wins two debate polls in a row that are reported by the likes of MSNBC on its own web page, that is news, especially since the winner of both polls allegedly had no chance to win the nomination. The media normally jumps on that kind of news, because people in America love underdogs, but not this time.
No, this is a concerted effort.
Please review below what Representative Ron Paul stands for, and far more importantly, what he has done. Among other things, Ron Paul is the only congressmen who got up and demanded Congress declare war before attacking Iraq.
Carl F. Worden
About Ron
Brief Overview of Congressman Paul's Record
He has never voted to raise taxes.
He has never voted for an unbalanced budget.
He has never voted for a federal restriction on gun ownership.
He has never voted to raise congressional pay.
He has never taken a government-paid junket.
He has never voted to increase the power of the executive branch.
He voted against the Patriot Act.
He voted against regulating the Internet.
He voted against the Iraq war.
He does not participate in the lucrative congressional pension program.
He returns a portion of his annual congressional office budget to the U.S. treasury every year.
Congressman Paul introduces numerous pieces of substantive legislation each year, probably more than any single member of Congress.
Congressman Ron Paul (R-Texas) is the leading advocate for freedom in our nation's capital. As a member of the U.S. House of Representatives, Dr. Paul tirelessly works for limited constitutional government, low taxes, free markets, and a return to sound monetary policies. He is known among his congressional colleagues and his constituents for his consistent voting record. Dr. Paul never votes for legislation unless the proposed measure is expressly authorized by the Constitution. In the words of former Treasury Secretary William Simon, Dr. Paul is the "one exception to the Gang of 535" on Capitol Hill.
Ron Paul was born and raised in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. He graduated from Gettysburg College and the Duke University School of Medicine, before proudly serving as a flight surgeon in the U.S. Air Force during the 1960s. He and his wife Carol moved to Texas in 1968, where he began his medical practice in Brazoria County. As a specialist in obstetrics/gynecology, Dr. Paul has delivered more than 4,000 babies. He and Carol, who reside in Lake Jackson, Texas, are the proud parents of five children and have 17 grandchildren.
While serving in Congress during the late 1970s and early 1980s, Dr. Paul's limited-government ideals were not popular in Washington. In 1976, he was one of only four Republican congressmen to endorse Ronald Reagan for president.
During that time, Congressman Paul served on the House Banking committee, where he was a strong advocate for sound monetary policy and an outspoken critic of the Federal Reserve's inflationary measures. He was an unwavering advocate of pro-life and pro-family values. Dr. Paul consistently voted to lower or abolish federal taxes, spending and regulation, and used his House seat to actively promote the return of government to its proper constitutional levels. In 1984, he voluntarily relinquished his House seat and returned to his medical practice.
Dr. Paul returned to Congress in 1997 to represent the 14th congressional district of Texas. He presently serves on the House Committee on Financial Services and the House Committee on Foreign Affairs. He continues to advocate a dramatic reduction in the size of the federal government and a return to constitutional principles.
Congressman Paul's consistent voting record prompted one of his congressional colleagues to say, "Ron Paul personifies the Founding Fathers' ideal of the citizen-statesman. He makes it clear that his principles will never be compromised, and they never are." Another colleague observed, "There are few people in public life who, through thick and thin, rain or shine, stick to their principles. Ron Paul is one of those few."
May 05, 2007 Ron Paul Wins MSNBC Debate Poll
Highest Positive, Lowest Negative
In the MSNBC.com rating window of 72,419 votes at 8:10 PM EDT, Friday, May 4, Ron Paul not only had the highest positive rating:
32% Paul
30% Romney
26% Giuliani
21% McCain
14% Huckabee
9% Brownback
9% Tancredo
8% Hunter
8% Thompson
6% Gilmore
...but he also had the lowest negative rating:
29% Paul
35% Romney
37% Huckabee
40% Giuliani
42% McCain
43% Gilmore
43% Hunter
45% Thompson
45% Tancredo
46% Brownback
Posted on May 05, 2007 at 10:57 AM | Permalink
May 04, 2007
Press Release
Ron Paul Wins MSNBC Debate Poll
Ron Paul steps into national spotlight
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
May 4, 2007
ARLINGTON, VA * Congressman Ron Paul finished first in the MSNBC poll following the GOP primary debate last night held at the Reagan Library in Simi Valley, California. Dr. Paul received 43 percent, beating the second-place finisher by five points, and crushing the rest of the field.
"Last night, Americans met Ron Paul and loved what they heard," said Ron Paul 2008 campaign chairman Kent Snyder. "Dr. Paul's message of freedom and limited government resonates with Republicans hungry for a return to their party's core values."
"Ron Paul is the only true conservative in the GOP race. Americans saw that last night," continued Snyder. "The campaign looks forward to further debates and opportunities so even more Americans will discover Dr. Paul's message of freedom, peace and prosperity."
daehawc
Member
paul
Those saying that Ron Paul is unelectable and we should just move on are missing the whole point. Regardless if he wins or not, America needs Paul in the debates as long as possible. The more we can put him in along side the other candidates the more his ideas have a chance to influence the mainstream. Few here disagree with him in respect to how far our nation has come from its founding document but unfortunately the vast majority of Americans have no clue how our country was designed to be ran. If nothing else Ron Paul gives the constitution the recognition it should get during any election and helps turn us down a path where the true United States can survive.
Those saying that Ron Paul is unelectable and we should just move on are missing the whole point. Regardless if he wins or not, America needs Paul in the debates as long as possible. The more we can put him in along side the other candidates the more his ideas have a chance to influence the mainstream. Few here disagree with him in respect to how far our nation has come from its founding document but unfortunately the vast majority of Americans have no clue how our country was designed to be ran. If nothing else Ron Paul gives the constitution the recognition it should get during any election and helps turn us down a path where the true United States can survive.
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