Light .38s in a .357

Light weight .357mag loads have a rep for cracking forcing cones in S&W K-frames.

I wouldn't worry with 110gr .38spl though. it's not nearly as fast as the magnum loads. I wouldn't think it an issue in ANY .357 mag revolver.

What bullet weight is considered "light" in .357? I've been using 158 grain rounds in my Model 13, so I should be okay, right? I'm a revolver noob and have plenty to learn, so any help is appreciated.

What bullet weight is considered "light" in .357? I've been using 158 grain rounds in my Model 13, so I should be okay, right? I'm a revolver noob and have plenty to learn, so any help is appreciated.

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158s are considered optimum for K frame .357s.

What bullet weight is considered "light" in .357?

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As I heard it, the rumor originated with the LAPD's training guns. This, according to the Smith and Wesson factory rep to whom I talked.

The LAPD had gone with the model 19 as their official gun. So they had 19s designated as training weapons. They were also using 125 grain bullets/magnum loads.
One can only imagine how many rounds would be fired through such a gun.

Some of those guns developed forcing cone problems (as mentioned above) as well as top strap cutting. By the time this phenomenon made it to the main stream media, the 19 was tagged as being unreliable with magnum loads and light (125 grain or less) bullets.

The 19 was never intended to digest a steady diet of lightweight bullets/magnum loads.

The truth is no single shooter can possibly shoot as many rounds as the LAPD revolvers and therefore won't damage his 19.

IMHO

I'm pretty sure the 125 gr. .357s were the "culprits" re: cracking the M19 forcing cones. They're more violent than the 110 grainers, in my experience.

I treasure my old M19 service revolver, and limit my target & IDPA shooting to ".38 +P" level handloads in .357 cases (158 LRNs at approx. 900 fps).

harmonic, Deanimator et al.

Thanks for the info.

I wasn't aware the LAPD ever used a gun chambered in .357magnum.

Personally, I am convinced that the culprits are 125 grains loaded to a nominal 1450 fps from a 4 inch barrel and 110s loaded to 1500+ fps from a 4 inch barrel. I cannot believe that current common 110 grain cartridges loaded to a nominal 1295 fps from a 4 inch barrel are a problem since they are really no more than a warmish 9mm and produce similar pressure. I haven't heard anyone complain about 9mm revolvers being unable to stand up to 9mm loads. 1500+ fps might be another story.

Good point. I never tried any +P+ 9mm ammo in my 9mm revolvers before though.

With all that is said,.... what is a good self defense load for a .357 magnum? I always thought it was the 125 gr.

The LAPD has NEVER used the S&W model 19, nor did they ever issue any revolvers that were chambered for the .357 magnum. At one time, officers could carry their own personal .357 mag revolvers, but that was halted in the mid-1970's.

I have heard that the 110- and 125-grain bullets were problematic in the model 19. Also, the FBI came up with the idea of using .38 special casings, with 125-grain bullets, and loaded to what was designated as +P+L velocities. Agents were issued the +P+L .38 special ammo (made by Federal) to use in their model 19's and other .357 mag revolvers....until there were several KA-BOOMS (mostly top strap damage, but also several forcing cone cracks). The +P+L ammo was just too hot to shoot....I've heard that it was 1,700+ FPS, but unable to verify that.

Having been an avid revolver shooter for nearly 50 years, I don't consider myself an "expert", but I have never come across ANY .357 magnum revolver that can be fed a steady diet of magnum velocity rounds without some type of adverse problem coming up....usually frame damage.

The 125-grain 357 loads were the ones that caused all the problems, there was even a recall of certain S & W revolvers (M-66 among others) because of the hotter 125-grain Federal ammo tying the guns up. I think my 686 was also recalled for the same problem, to replace the firing pin bushing. The ammo was so hot the primers were flowing back into the firing pin hole and tying up the cylinder. Lots of PD's issued that ammo, mine included, so a lot of guns went back to the factory.

I don't recall any specific problems with the 110-grain loads, but the lighter bullets with a case full of ball powder were blamed for forcing-cone erosion and topstrap cutting. All I shoot these days are moderate 140-grain loads, and hot 158's.

PJ

Obviously light bullets such as the 110 and 115 grain bullets have less inertia than a heavier bullet, and therefore pick up more speed inside the cylinder before smashing into the forcing cone. This is obviously one of the causes of cracked forcing cones, but there is one thing I haven't heard mentioned before...the amount of freebore between the bullet and the forcing cone. Freebore is simply the amount of free space between the bullet and the forcing cone.

Since the 110 and 125 grain bullets are very short in length compared to say 170 grain bullets, these lighter bullets have a huge amount of freebore! Especially in factory ammunition where the bullets are seated all the way down to the crimp groove. Try loading a cylinder with some factory 110 grain cartridges and look at how much space there is from the tip of the bullet to the end of the cylinder. With all that room to accelerate it is no wonder why 110 and 125 grain bullets are to blame for cracked forcing cones. I personally believe the excessive amount of freebore is to blame instead of the light weight.

I am willing to bet that if a .357 Magnum revolver was available with a shortened cylinder, which allowed 125 grain bullets to be seated right to the end of the cylinder, you would not have any problems with cracked forcing cones. Even with full-bore magnum loads.

Jake H

110gr 38

I have shot many 110gr federal hydrashoks thru my ruger 357 not a problem

We've been discussing this issue in other forums and as yet there have been no personal accounts of this phenomenon documented. I wonder just how many rounds fired before this forcing cone problem is seen? And can it be credited directly to the use of 125 & 110 light weight bullets. I can see the free bore being a major accomplice to this problem, but never have I heard of someone claiming damage that used 38spl exclusively. There are so many non-issues proclaimed on the internet as major evils, that I feel this may never be a problem for the 'average' shooter.