Are Gun Forums becoming P.C...

ARF15 and Glocktalk are the worst. They'll ban you for anything without so much as a warning just because you said something they didn't like even though no rules were broken. Apparently, there are some "sacred cows" over there and you cannot disagree with them on ANYTHING. That arrogant *******, the Rabbi, is the absolute worst.

Theakforum is bad, too. I posted some of those Sarah Palin photoshop pictures (they were even allowed/seen here) and was banned for two weeks without warning and I was in no violation of the rules. Heck, they even have a forum dedicated to full nudity.

"i personally don't care about offending people, on the 'net or in the real world."

Response #1. What do your friends and family think about your offensive behavior?

R#2. Is that why you don't use the Shift key? Sticky Keys is available for those who only want to, or must, type with one hand.

John

Sticky Keys is available for those who only want to, or must, type with one hand.

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I only really spend time on THR.

Can you point to specific things that make you think that THR is becoming more or less "PC" and if that's good or bad?

Honestly, I think THR has a defined purpose and PC has nothing to do with it other than keeping the bickering down that often happens with political discussions.

What is PC on a gun board? I would think anything about guns is PC as long as the comment supports 2A rights. IF I say I hate EBRs and they should be banned, everyone will jump down my throat and hope I die a slow death.... Not PC HERE, but in the rest of the world, it is a PC comment to many. If I said that at another forum, I might get treated like one of the family.

I see few real changes in topics and the quickness that individual threads are locked is related to content mostly.. topic covered with perhaps some low road comments.

Political threads have always been a problem here and elsewhere. The part I don't understand is that politics are such a HUGE aspect of gun ownership. Saying that we can't discuss them on a gun forum is beyond me.

However, I don't make the rules here, and don't have control over the all mighty "delete" button. So, I do my best to abide by the somewhat irrational norms.

AD/ND? Who cares what you call it? The problem is that the bullet isn't impressed by any term.

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That one gets my vote for line of the day.

I run a firearm board. And I have to wonder what the poster's point is. I've been doing this forum thing for a LONG time and seen a lot of threads locked, people banned, forums come and go, etc... But the one thing that seems to be constant, is the charge of an owner/admin being PC when they won't allow certain rhetoric on their boards.

I'd say, most commonly, this rhetoric hinges around certain current foreign policy issues and a related religion. Lots of owners and mods feel that such rhetoric detracts from the mission of firearms discussion.

"YOU WON'T LET ME CALL ALL MUSLIMS BLOODTHIRSTY BABYKILLERS! YOU'RE JUST BEING P.C."

"YOU CLOSED MY THREAD WHERE I SAID ALL Democrats ARE BEDWETTING LIBERAL COMMUNIST GUN COLLECTORS! YOU'RE BEING P.C."

Yeah... I can see some mods/admins/owners getting called PC for shutting down stuff like that. Have seen it. Repeatedly. I've shut down threads like that on the forum I manage. That junk does NOTHING to advance second amendment rights, nor our acceptance among the general population of voters. In fact, I think it's probably damaging.

If getting called PEE CEE is the price for keeping things on track, I imagine most mods/admins/owners whose interest actually lies in the advancement of firearms knowledge and rights, will be just fine with it.

I'll explain it with a question. "Where is the forum for political debate and discussion on this website?

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It was removed because people couldn't manage to politely discuss political topics without engaging in personal attacks on people with whom they disagreed. If you don't like it you're free to start your own discussion board, manage it, host it, pay for bandwidth and hardware, and run it any way you please.

I also think poltics plays a very important role in general firearm discussions and should be considered pertinent to gun forums. Here APS is set aside for this purpose, but I gather few really go there. I know I don't.

I think anti-2A comments should be allowed and generally they are. Why? Because they make people look at their own beliefs and ultimately firm up support for the Second ammendment gun rights overall within gun boards. BUT, the comments generate such a firestorm of criticism (often much of it personal) that if you believe such things you're better off just keeping those thoughts to yourself as a member of THR or most other gun forums.

I haven't looked today, but when Putin shot that lion with a tranquilizer dart to reportedly save the camera crew... that was a topic that merited discussion and I never saw one thread. But it borders soundly on politics and one's feelings about Putin specifically as opposed to what he reportedly did.

Yes.
Because we are trying to not give the Anti's ammo.

PC on the board

The gun boards are getting more people from the left side of the political spectrum, so they are going more toward the middle.

However, I would not equate that with "Political Correctness".

Let's be honest, "Political Correctness" is about promoting a narrow political view wheter it is right or left.

This board probably attracts primarily a mix of Conservatives and Libertarians with a few liberals to boot.

What all of us must remember that if we look at our core values, we probably will find most of us have more in common than we think.

Yes, we have differences, but if we focus on what we agree on, I bet that we will find that many of our differences just aren't that important.

There will always be no win issues, and for most of those, I agree to disagree.

Nicki

For future reference, try to be less of a cretin.

Thanks.

-Mgmt

"YOU CLOSED MY THREAD WHERE I SAID ALL Democrats ARE BEDWETTING LIBERAL COMMUNIST GUN COLLECTORS! YOU'RE BEING P.C."

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Are you suggesting Democrats aren't bed wetting liberal commies?

That seems more like a post that is just rude rather than PC. Civility is a good idea.

It all depends on what you consider PC

Not PC seems to be PC. How many times have we all seen somebody ranting about something at some site and start off with a remark of how independant a thinker they are and how proud they are to be not politically correct? Then they going on to say something that most of the people they are talking to would agree with and the poster knew that to start with.

My problem with most gun sites and "PC" question is how everybody seems to fall into line, maybe without realizing it, and all regular "members" seem to accept some unstated agreement on the correct attitude on a certain collection of topics particular to the individual site. And if anybody who has some different opinion shows up..... he better be prepared to defend himself. The anointed will gather to execute him with words quickly and without mercy.

What is PC for one gun site is often not PC on another. Take on the Milsurp sites, some are "no bubba's allowed to talk about sporterization" and others were actually started to be sure that "sporterization" is a forum topic to itself. Take a contrary opinion at a site that holds the other view and it will be the last time you do.

Everybody has to find the sites he feels comfortable enough with without feeling like a whore in church for posting on them.

No, I don't think they're more "politically correct". However, if you want the right to call people derogatory names based on ethnicity, religion, or gender, this is not the place for you.

And thank you, Oleg and moderators, that it isn't.

We are a VERY diverse bunch, we gunowners, and firearms ownership is about the only thing we are going to agree on. It is common sense to be polite and avoid being inflammatory and derogatory. What some call PC is nothing more than good manners, refraining from starting fights in what is essentially somebody else's house (in this case, Oleg Volk's). There isn't a person here, I'd bet, who doesn't self-censor when he's around his or her boss, grandmother, children, or others. Why complain, then, about not being able to write anything you please, regardless of how offensive, with the concomitant whine about mods being PC?

We already pick and choose our behaviors in the real world, based on what's appropriate for the setting. Why, then, this insistence that EVERYTHING is appropriate because it's on the web?

If you want rough-and-tumble, it's out there. Have fun when you find it. But don't complain because some sites want polite and reasoned discourse instead of a verbal barroom brawl.

My highly overinflated $.02, of course worth what you paid for it.

Springmom

Compare today's forum membership and their postings with those of a few years ago. Now there are lots more people on the internet, and they have a wider range of opinions, styles, interests, etc. A few years ago, some of the gun boards I sampled seemed to be small groups of highly opinionated males who were in lockstep on most things and like to keep reminding each other of how absolutely right they were. About the only differences of opinion they tolerated seemed to be which powder to use in what calibers. Any other dissent was grounds for cussing, swearing, banishment and occasionally outright threats or harassment.

Compare that with THR here and now. People here are generally very civil and respect each other as individuals with something to say. They really listen to each other. This requires attitudes and manners which are often similar to those which a truly 'politically correct' forum might impose by force, but here seem to be natural elements of the forum's culture. That says a lot about the members and administrators of this forum.

The PC movement as such has its linguistic origins in the APA guidlines for using gender inclusive language in publications and papers issued about 1977/78. It was an attempt to 'neuter' pronouns commonly used as generic when refering to both sexes and related things. A poor solution to a non-problem that has had snow-balling cultural effects and limits authorial rhetorical choices.

From where I sit, THR (I know we aren't JUST talking about THR) insists on a ceratin civility and politeness. That is partly why I hang out here and not a forum moderated by squirrel monkeys.

But THR is FAR from 'PC' in the sense that opinions rendered respectfully aren't condemed even if they are fairly out there and marginal. Sexism and serious rauchiness isn't seen much here, but again--that comes back to good manners.

I know this one is.

I once cited some statistics about violent crime percentages broken down by race and the thread was very quickly shut down.

I once cited some statistics about violent crime percentages broken down by race and the thread was very quickly shut down.

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You mean like the FBI stats that say that 13% of the population is responsible for 65% of violent crime and if you break out the segment of the 13% that are responsible it's like 3% of the population is responsible for 65% of violent crime.

Stats like that?

Truth is not a defense - don't you know that? That's what PC is all about - quelling hard truths that some just don't want to have to deal with. Say something isn't so long enough or make enough people afraid to speak the truth and the truth is not the truth anymore.

Funny how that works...

I don't see a drastic shift toward being "more PC". I *do* see consistently less chest-thumping, profanity and general incivility here than I do at some other places. But that's the way it's always been (as far as I know), and that's why I like THR. It's not "PC" to ask people to be civil. Unfortunately, some people (not implying the OP) seem to think that if they can't spout off whatever they want, the mods are being "PC" or "liberal" or "censors" or whatever.

If you're interested in a site that's not PC at all, go over to Glocktalk.com. I just got done leaving a thread where most people were arguing that using deadly force to protect property of any value (even a Happy Meal) is justified. I disagreed not so politely. The site owner gave me an infraction. Cool beans, I told him his site does not resemble reality. He got more pissed...lol

The PC movement as such has its linguistic origins in the APA guidlines for using gender inclusive language in publications and papers issued about 1977/78. It was an attempt to 'neuter' pronouns commonly used as generic when refering to both sexes and related things. A poor solution to a non-problem that has had snow-balling cultural effects and limits authorial rhetorical choices.

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I agree with this post by NeoLuddite. This is PC. From where I sit I see PC as a way to be sure no one is "offended". Unfortunately, being "offended" has become not being able to speak out against anything that someone else doesn't agree with. Hate crimes are the perfect example of PC. No person's lifestyle, race, or gender is to be valued more than anyone else's. It is a crime, period.

PC is about silencing discussion. THR is a forum that generally permits discussion.

I once cited some statistics about violent crime percentages broken down by race and the thread was very quickly shut down.

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That doesn't mean that they Mods didn't like the topic; it means that they didn't like the, ah, broad range of rhetoric that was sure to follow. Past experience in topics dealing with race, religion, and poly-ticks has shown that a board of this size and with such a broad range to participants is not likely to keep such discussions civil for too long.

is not likely to keep such discussions civil for too long.

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So...

When did the right not to be offended become the theme of the day?

That seems to me to be the crux of PC and why it is - well - just WRONG!

We spend so much time and effort trying not to offend, spinning things in a positive light, calling dung plant food that we end up not being able to say anything of real substance because it's just too hard and time consuming to do so.

There is no right to not be offended or at least there didn't used to be.

More's the pity - our society tries so hard to be PC that it has become blind to reality. AND that's gonna have some really bad ramifications in the future.