Pistol-caliber carbines

they're just plain fun!

I have a 9mm AR. w\sten mag block.

cheap to shoot,indoor range friendly.

what's not to like?

clown

PCC's fill another niche, too...

Some folks just are not effective with handguns, and cannot handle the recoil/muzzle blast of say a .30-06/.308/7.62x54 or 12-Ga shotgun.

So, a PCC would probably work very well for them.

i'm probably the only person in the world with this problem, but my local range is "non-magnum handgun ammunition only"- the only allowable calibers are 22, 38, 9mm, 40, 45. that's it, not even 357mag. what that means is that if i want to shoot anything even resembling a rifle that isn't a 22, it's gotta use a pistol cartridge. limited options!

And that, children, is why we don't make our shot traps out of eggshells.

what that means is that if i want to shoot anything even resembling a rifle that isn't a 22, it's gotta use a pistol cartridge.

Click to expand...

I'd be careful with that, a 9mm out of a carbine probably has more energy than a .357 Mag out of a handgun.

I had a Ruger PC9 and didn't like it and now have a Marlin .357 and love it. Ergonomically its only equal among my rifles is the cz carbine. Fun to shoot, cheap with .38 spcl. I regard it as my primary home defense gun as well.

do i hear pistol ammo fed carbine?

I suggest lever action, you gotta love lever action
Marlin make good models especially the cowboy models and since i couldnt afford one i got a rossi puma for half the price, it has the sick octogonal barrel and all i'd ask from the marlin guns, i have yet to find why its half the price!
i shoot 357 and 38

The closest thing I have is my M1 Carbine. That thing is tremendous fun.

I have both Marlin Camp guns, the 9mm and .45acp and have got fairly good at hip and/or 'point' shooting with them - undeniably lots of fun. I go shooting with a buddy that has the Marlin lever .357 that thing is impressive at 100 yds and iron sights. he also owns a Kimber .45acp and keeps trying to get me to trade - I tell him he won't give me enough boot! I have a Colt 1911 .45acp also.
I installed a heavy Wolff recoil spring in my Camps and shoot +P in them. the .45 makes a satisfying 'whack' on steel discs at 100 yds.
PPC's would do as a 'bugout' gun but there are better choices IMO. for HD use they are great choices - particularly if a person lived in the rural area and may have to go outside the home. as good as a shotty IMO.
I took a feral/wild hog with my Camp .45 and hot loaded Golden Sabre - shot above the eye took off a big hunk of skull. at about 40 paces. down and thrashed for a minute or 2 but it was 'lights out'.

My 45 Colt Rossi can be loaded pretty darn stout. I'd hate to shoot some of the Ruger/TC loads I've made for it in a handgun. It's brutal enough on the shoulder of an 8lb rifle.

I need to chrony that load sometime to get an idea what kind of energy we're talking.

Will jump in here just to pass along something the fans (I'm one) of .357, .41, and .44 magnum rifles might enjoy.... because it simply shows how even the best of "experts" can develop a myopia about rifles, calibers and shooters.

Couple thousand years ago when I was actually a boy I wrote a letter to my hero, Jack O'Conner - The King Arthur of Hunting - and my question was why didn't someone make a rifle in .357 magnum. His response back to me was polite enough but clearly conveyed the message that a rifle in .357 would be pointless, no one would buy it and thus no manufacturer would ever make one. Just a few years later Marlin brought out their lever guns in the handgun calibers and the Public has since turned the .357 and .44 mag. rifles into a major hot commodity.

Methinks it's a very good for us mortals to remember that not even the great O'Conner was right all the time !!!

An AR-15 would be better for home defense. Don't consider one of these. The .223 does not have good penetration through walls yet it's still enough to stop a bad guy. Plus, it's a lot more intimidating.

For plinking, the pistol carbine could be alright but I'd go for the best for self defense. For now, save the money that you would have spent and get a nice AR.

I would say the dramatic availability of AR-15s in a variety of prices has severely encroached upon the pistol caliber carbine's former range.

I'm sure that someone will be along with a link to box o' truth pointing out that basically any gun will shoot through a rather large number of interior walls as well. The practical difference in overpenetration between 5.56x45 and 9x19 is less than you might think.

Remember, all you Elite Team Players out there, bullets go through walls!

My Hi-Point .40 carbine is so much fun, my grandson is now wanting his own for Xmas. Think I'll get him the 9mm with a red-dot scope, he's a good kid. And there's the ATI stock for the 9.

To me pistol caliber carbines are a minor force multiplier. They add range but specifically long range accuracy to a pistol cartrige, not to mention adding some velocity (read power) to a cartridge, extending it's effectiveness. Unfortunately, this extension is only minimal compared to a full rifle situation.

Up to 75 yards, Carbines are king in my mind. With a good 9x19 cartridge, you can do some serious damage to a target while maintaining accuracy (less collatoral damage, spelling?) with less stray shots. It also keeps the round's effectiveness longer as the more velocity added. The power your 9x19 pistol maintains at X yards is now X+Y.

They have a place, but it is VERY limited. We arent allowed SMGs (unless you are class 3) so volume of fire isnt even an option. Carbines dont add volume, but more precision and range of fire, not to mention compatibility. A CX4 matched with a Beretta 92 makes for a good urban SHTF loadout. Both have the same mags and the CX4 20 rounders available make for an awesome package, sort of a modern M1 carbine.

I have a Ruger PC4 (40SW), and I love it, its one of my HD guns. I live in a neighborhood where the houses are basically about 15' apart, so in defending my home, I would want to minimize over-penetration of walls, so I think its better suited than a rifle caliber. If you run out of ammo (or I suppose if it jams, but its never done that), its very solid and fairly heavy, so it would make a great club!

Several people have mentioned that pistol caliber carbines aren't any good out to 100 yards... that's not surprising, but I don't think that makes them useless. In HD situations, for instance, my whole property isn't even 50 yards long. I did actually scope it at one point, and depending on the ammo the bullet drop at 100 yards was 5"-8" (IIRC), and the groups (for me) were right around 4", just as a side note.

I also have a Marlin 1894C (.357m), and while the round has a lot more punch and useful range, I don't personally find a lever action to be a good HD gun. I want to be able to load it quickly in the dark, and unload it easily before I store it -- nothing like magazines for that.

I've got a couple of SMG's so I guess they sorta count as pistol caliber carbines. I enjoy them, they're fun to shoot. Some (like the MP5) are quite accurate out to a decent distance. I've hit stuff out to 200-250 yds just goofing off with the H&K but I wouldn't make bets at that distance. Thompsons are a lot of fun as are pistol caliber lever-carbines. I've owned a couple of Marlin Camp carbines, one in 9mm and a suppressed .45... I regret to this day selling the suppressed one. It sounded like a Red Ryder; the big 230 grain ball hitting the target was SIGNIFICANTLY louder than the report (and even the breach pop). I've never messed with the Ruger carbines or the Hi-Point or any of the others. I've got a 9mm upper for an AR/M16 and it's certainly fun as are the Calico 900-series. I had a 950 back in the mid-90's and other than loading that friggin' magazine it was fun to shoot.

But, for practicality's sake, I've never really been that struck by them. A 9mm pistol cartridge is moderately more effective in an SMG or carbine length bbl., it does have the benefit in the case of an SMG of multiple hits in rapid succession... Now, my MP5 weighs right at 7 lbs... Coincidentally my shorty-M4gery with a bunch of crap hanging off of it weighs just over a 1/2 lb more and is a helluva lot more effective as a weapon system. But, in the realms of plinking they are a helluva lot of fun!
-J.Burnett

As I've stated before, Pistol caliber carbines are a lot of fun to shoot. I own several, and have owned several others.

They have a niche. That niche is a urban and suburban environment. I would choose a pistol caliber carbine over a riot gun these days. I have sever friends that own gun for self-defense, but are not "gun people". They don't want a bunch of different guns, calibers, and magazines. For them a carbine in the same caliber and taking the same magazine makes a lot of sense. The longer barrel and stock increases the "effective" range of a pistol round to approximately the 100 yard mark.

HOWEVER when you compare the size and weight of a pistol caliber carbine to that of a intermediate caliber rifle / carbine, the pistol caliber comes up lacking. There is a reason our Spec-op troops now use the M4 over a sub-gun.

If you can afford both, by all means get both. The pistol caliber carbines are a hoot to shoot. If you ever let your wife shoot it, you will need another one. (This is experience talking. )

But if you can only afford 1 long arm, make it a real rifle caliber.

"If you ever let your wife shoot it, you will need another one. (This is experience talking. )"

Boy that's the truth... When my wife and I started dating she'd never shot a gun before. The FIRST gun she ever fired was the MP5... RUINED...RUINED I TELL YA!!!
-J.Burnett

I have a Marlin Camp 9mm, Marlin Camp .45ACP, ActionArms/IMI Timberwolf .357/.38 SPL and an H&R Reising Model 60 .45ACP. Having shot all of them fairly extensively, I would confidently say that I wouldn't be embarassed to use any one of them for Home Defense or in field self defense. Accuracy/Hit potiential and cartridge power increase with carbines over pistols/handguns in the same caliber are great.
My experience is that 75 yards is about the maximum effective range for any of these, although heavier weight .357 slugs will still give 3" (combat acceptable) accuracy out to slightly over 100 yards. People here in Eastern PA take 200+ lb whitetails with .357 Magnum revolvers - don't see why a carbine in that caliber (which will increase muzzle velocity by 125 to 200 fps depending on the ammo) can't be used for hunting such critters.

I'd go with an AR15 over a pistol caliber carbine, much more effective round.

44 Mag,.45LC ruger or .454casull over the little 5.56 NATO against bear any day! Or tweeked out drugged up two leg...

Multiple targets? As has been said here earlier,practice.Check out the Western 3 Gun folks then tell me a leveraction is slow! Also with one rnd of magnum out of 16-20" carbine is good for 2-3 5.56.

Wanta B

I've wanted a Sub 2000 in Glock 17 configuration for a while now, but just haven't found one yet. I think it would be great fun at the range, but it would not be my first choice for home defense. When things go bump in the night I just prefer a pistol. I want one of these strictly for plinking, and the fact that it uses magazines that I already have makes it very practical.

Pistol caliber carbines are a good thing. I have a Marlin 1894C as a companion to either my 5" Model 27 or my 4" model 19 Smith & Wessons. For example, take a look at a 158 grain .357 Magnum fired out of a Marlin 1894C and compare the ballistics with a 30-30. Just might surprise you. When I am walking in hawg or B'ar country, I tote a Ruger Alaskan in .454 Casull / .45 Colt revolver and pack a 5# stainless steel 16" barrel Puma Model 92 chambered for same. The Puma is a great "Thumper" for brush country. Comes with High Viz sights and is a pleasure to carry, but you definitely know that you touched one off . Will also handle .45 Colt. Had a John Wayne large loop lever installed and I can spin cock this sucker like Rooster.

I take a Henry .22 Magnum rimfire carbine when packing my Ruger Single Six or S&W 351PD in the woods. When taking my 617-6 or my 317 Kit gun, I pack a Marlin 1897 CB or Ruger 10-22. Do not write off the pistol carbines. They can reach out there when neededand are more accurate than the hand guns by virtue of the extended sights.

One combo I do not have yet is a .45 ACP carbine to mate with my S&W 25-14 Classic revolver. I have been eye balling the Beretta Storm for this application. Would also go well with my Springfield Armory .45 ACP pistol.

Crowman

take a look at the mechtech carbine uppers. they will use your 1911 frame and magazines, and have a good trigger you are already used to. with an EO tech on top they are quite fast for close range work.

gunnie