Changing My Stance On Open Carry

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Treo

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I'm about to get flamed, hard

When the O.C. debate first started becoming prevalent around THR I was pretty much against it, and for all the usual reasons.

It draws unnecessary attention, people that do it are trying to cause a scene. It makes you a target for police harassment, Yada,yada,yada.

But the more I read stories of total overreaction by the police, and the more I see THR members dog on the O.C. crowd. The more I have to ask myself; If we don't defend the ground we hold how in thee Hell do we expect to gain any new ground? ( Ask Robert E. Lee how that fighting a defensive war worked out for him)

In most of the United States no permit is required to lawfully carry a fire arm. No permit, No classes, No ( monetary)cost.

I have been open carrying recently, haven't had any problems but I do want to get a suitable holster to use.

Even if some of use choose not to open carry we all need to present a unified front to the antis.

We have two threads going right now discussing how 2 people were harassed for doing something that is totally legal in their respective jurisdictions
When some thing like this comes up we (IMO) need to clearly express our displeasure to the offending agency or retail outlet.

We have to defend the ground we have before we worry about taking more (IMO)

[/RANT]
 
Even if some of use choose not to open carry we all need to present a unified front to the antis.
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Thanks for supporting OC. Gun owners need to stand together and support ALL of our rights. If they take away OC, guess what...CC is next.
 
Agreed. I find it silly at best and destructing at worst when people drop by PTK's thread simply to mention how foolish or abnormal he must be to want to carry three pistols with him when he's out and about. Who the hell cares how many he carries? If it's really that important to you, carry whatever you're comfy with and roll on.

Ugh. Anyway - I totally, completely, 100% agree with you, Treo. Whether we personally agree or not, we've got to find ways to come together on these sorts of issues.
 
I strongly agree with you that we need to maintain a unified front to the anitis.

It's the same as hunters talking trash about ARs and the like. Or shotgunners dissing pistol grip only shotguns. The comparisons are almost endless.

Like grandma said "Your grandpa and me have had arguments, just never in front of the kids."
 
I have no desire to OC but will defend the right of those that do. One loss leads to another and I'm tired of losing!
 
I'm about to get flamed, too, but...

This forum has become more and more "DON'T TREAD ON ME" whenever there is discussion that includes disagreement. Get over yourselves. Sure, you've got the freedom to walk around in a tuxedo made from PPKs. Doesn't make it a good idea.

If you're going to carry a ton of hardware, so much that other people that carry scratch their heads when looking at, expect for people to say, "dude, why so much hardware?" It isn't that different than someone yelling everything as their means of expressing their right to free speech. You can expect some people to ask you to be quiet.

If you can't handle disagreement or if you frown upon dissention as disloyalty, brother, I just don't know how to have a discussion with you. There's nothing wrong with honest discussion.
 
That most (or many) Americans can legally carry a handgun openly without paying the government a fee is the most plain and literal example of the 2nd Amendment's existence.

Would the government freak out if EVERYBODY with a handgun that lived in an OC state started carrying openly every day? I think so. Would it be a good way for America to keep its muscles from atrophy? Absolutely.
 
It isn't that different than someone yelling everything as their means of expressing their right to free speech. You can expect some people to ask you to be quiet.

If you can't handle disagreement or if you frown upon dissention as disloyalty, brother, I just don't know how to have a discussion with you. There's nothing wrong with honest discussion.
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Agreed!

While I support your right to OC, I find it ridiculous that I have been told I'm not doing my part to help the cause just because I have made a decision to carry concealed.

The implications even by other members here that I am less of a supporter of the second amendment due to my personal choice on whether my gun is seen by everyone or not is insulting.

If I decide to have those who I interact with daily both personally and professionally, be they strangers, acquaintances, or friends, not need to know whether or not I happen to be carrying a weapon during our interaction, why does that seem to bother a large portion of the OC crowd so much?


I have the option for carrying either way in my area. I CHOOSE to carry concealed. Isn't that what rights are really all about?
 
There's nothing wrong with honest discussion.
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There isn't. But there's a lot more that goes on here, and in general. It goes beyond honest discussion. There is actual condemnation. It's always struck me as being right there with duck hunters condemning EBRs. They don't do EBRs, so we may as well concede EBRs to a ban.

While, it's few and far between that you'll actually hear an OC hater call for a ban on OC, they often seem to stop just short of that.

I don't OC very often. But I'll damn sure (actually, it's a certainty if you live in WV) fight for your right to do so.
 
I have absolutely no problem with anybody that chooses not to open carry. I think you should carry in whatever fashion you like. Just extend the same courtesy to others.

I have a major problem with people (on The High Road) who say that:
1. Anyone who open carries is [looking for attention/has a chip on their shoulder/is showing off].
2. Open carry is rude/offensive.
3. Police treating open carriers as criminals until proven otherwise is acceptable.
 
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Treo said:
In most of the United States no permit is required to lawfully carry a fire arm. No permit, No classes, No ( monetary)cost.
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I don't disagree with your new position -- in fact, I agree completely -- but the statement above is just plain wrong. There are a great many states (among them the most populated and/or most densely populated) in which you cannot legally carry a handgun either openly or concealed without a license/permit. Don't fall into the trap of extrapolating to assume that what's true in your state must be true everywhere.
 
MJRW said:
If you're going to carry a ton of hardware, so much that other people that carry scratch their heads when looking at, expect for people to say, "dude, why so much hardware?" It isn't that different than someone yelling everything as their means of expressing their right to free speech. You can expect some people to ask you to be quiet.
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There's a critical difference between yelling constantly and carrying a lot of guns.

Yelling hurts people's ears, drowns out normal conversation, etc.

Carrying an unusual quantity of guns has absolutely no impact on anyone else (unless they choose to be impacted). It should be no more cause for concern than an ugly tie.
 
I don't disagree with your new position -- in fact, I agree completely -- but the statement above is just plain wrong. There are a great many states (among them the most populated and/or most densely populated) in which you cannot legally carry a handgun either openly or concealed without a license/permit. Don't fall into the trap of extrapolating to assume that what's true in your state must be true everywhere.
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If we're going purely by geographical area, I think the OP may have been correct, licenseless open carry is legal in most of the US.

opencarrymap.png
 
I think that open carrying is great. It keeps you safe but more importantly spreads the word about the RKBA. Now people see law-abiding gun owners who don't do what the media and movies tell them. Those evil guns don't just jump out of their holsters and attack them. It's a very powerful statement that more people should exercise. If I could, I would open carry every day. I do as often as I can.

BTW, if you're looking for a nice holster, I bought one from High Noon Holsters. It's excellent.
 
JessieL I respectfully disagree.



If the man in question was carrying two pistols, I would fully agree, but three? I feel this is overkill and gives the anti gun crowd some ammunition for their bias. Plus, he may have gone unnoticed had he been carrying singly.



God forbid you NEED to defend yourself or others and they find you carring mucho weaponry, it may look like your were searching out a fight.



I'm not saying that I feel this way, but it is how they think and they will try to use against all of us, so in a way, it does affect us.



BTW, I'M PRO CC/open carry.



*edit*


I live in PA and Im wondering if someone can tell me what it means that we have an "Anomalous" open carry status?
 
King of Blued said:
That most (or many) Americans can legally carry a handgun openly without paying the government a fee is the most plain and literal example of the 2nd Amendment's existence.

Would the government freak out if EVERYBODY with a handgun that lived in an OC state started carrying openly every day? I think so. Would it be a good way for America to keep its muscles from atrophy? Absolutely.
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Hey, even us legal permanent residents can open carry too (with the right piece of paper in my case), something some of us cannot do back in the country we come from.

You are a very lucky bunch indeed!
 
There's a critical difference between yelling constantly and carrying a lot of guns.

Yelling hurts people's ears, drowns out normal conversation, etc.

Carrying an unusual quantity of guns has absolutely no impact on anyone else (unless they choose to be impacted). It should be no more cause for concern than an ugly tie.
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Bah, minor differences. It is still a pretty flamboyant excercise. Asking someone to tone it down isn't at unreasonable.
 
Bah, minor differences. It is still a pretty flamboyant excercise. Asking someone to tone it down isn't at unreasonable.
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Printing editorials several times a week, in multiple newspapers, without even giving the opposition a chance to respond, "is still a pretty flamboyant exercise. Asking [them] to tone it down isn't at unreasonable."

When did exercising one's rights become "flamboyant?" When did asking somebody to "tone down" his rights become reasonable? "Gee, Dr. King, we really wish you'd tone it down a bit. Surely you can see how reasonable that would be."

<spit>
 
If the man in question was carrying two pistols, I would fully agree, but three?
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Does it matter to you that one of the three was an NAA mini and practically invisible?


Does it matter to you that only one of his pistols became exposed?
 
No, one being seen was apparently one too many.



The way I interpret the law (not that it matters), concealed means hidden, not to be seen. If it can be seen, then it violates the CCW permit rules. I'm a good sized guy and could reasonably conceal a SBS given the right clothing, not that theres a need for that, but I could, and In my state it would be legal.



Should I biotch if it pokes out and someone panics?



Well, it was my decision to carry all that when a lesser amount of easier concealable weaponry would have sufficed. With every right comes a responsibility. With the right to CC comes the responsibility to keep things concealed. He didn't do that, he got hassled.



Since the vast majority of BG's only carry one gun, I think two would suffice.




Again, JMO, YMMV.
 
I am fortunate enough to live in a state, in a rural area, where open carry is not really even noticed.

A few nights ago I noticed three or us were pushing shopping carts down the same aisle at WalMart and all three of us were wearing cowboy hats and boots.

A moment later I noticed all three of us were packing, in the open.

Made me feel good to know I live in the land of the free.

I carry concealed 24/7. When I OC it means I'm carrying two guns. When I OC and drive my pickup that means I've got three.

Lord help me if I'm on my way to or from an IDPA match. I always have three pistols in the range bag, OC, one in my pocket and another under the seat when I go to a match.

If you don't like to OC, don't. OTOH, don't instruct me about the error of my ways.

And, it is true - we need to stick together. There are too many people who would take away some part of rights at any time given any opportunity.
 
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