Could YOU fire a bolt-action that fast?

Let me ask a simple question: How many people who have actually shot a Carcano say it can't be done?

The History or DiscoveryChannel mounted a re-enactment test with a trained marksman and easily duplicated the shots, bullet impact, paths of the bullets, etc not long ago. Good grief. I was 11 years old at the time of the shooting, and knew enough about marksmanship at the time to reason that it wasn't difficult shooting at the distances given. I have NO reason to believe, at this point, with all that has been questioned and presented, that there was more than one shooter, or that that one shooter was NOT able to do the deed. I watched the re-creation, and it was dead on with the timing, bullet impacts, etc.

First off, I have had the privelege of being able to interview/quiz/query a secret service agent who was on the Ft. Worth detail that morning, took Oswald's family into protective custody, performed tests on the rifle and testified at the commission.

Based on his statements and experience, there is no cover up or conspiracy. The rifle performed precisely as one would expect if you had a crappy scope, disassembled the rifle and literally tossed it into the backseat. The zero was off. Working the bolt and firing the shots (remember, the first one is free and exempt from the time limit!) is not only possible, but actually quite easy.

I have seen a Persian Mauser fired by a non mil-trained person at a head-sized target twice in six seconds and hit the target. Actually he did it 4 times in a row with no misses.

The gentleman was not trying to prove anything. He was just a very good shot. It can certainly be done. Simply a matter of practice.

Somewhere around my house I have a copy of "Case Closed" which basically shows the single mutant theory to be much more likely than any of the conspiracy theories, I recall the shots did not sound too unlikely for someone who practiced with the rifle and scope. I have seen many, many people shoot a clean with iron sights at the 200 yard rapid sitting portion of an across the course match to believe that hitting twice out of three shots is unlikely.

All of those who shoot varmints know that you can get off more accurately aimed shots in less time and at smaller targets than what Oswald did. We drive around the pastures in a '77 Dodge pick-up and shoot praire dogs from the windows at distances greater than what LHO did. That's a truck that vibrates enough to double your group size, shooting from an awkward position with zero set-up time and at a very small target. Only when the dogs get skittish and ranges start to exceed 150 yards do we shut the truck off and set up with bi-pods on the ground. Then it's really easy to get off aimed shots in rapid succession.

His performance was rather mediocre, IMO. At that range, with the amount of time he had, should have been 3-4 head shots.

It's one thing to fire a rifle at stationary head-sized paper targets, at distances of from 175 ft, 240 ft and 265 ft, three (3) times in 5.6 seconds, over a level/nearly-level shooting range from a benchrest, through a good rifle scope properly sighted in.

It's entirely another matter to:

(1) attempt to assassinate the President of the United States (there would be very, very few individuals who would be able to control their heart rate, breathing, hold and cheek weld considering the massive amount of adrenalin that the brain would cause the adrenal gland to excrete into the circulatory system). It's doubtful that even James Bond could keep his cool during such an event;

(2) shoot at a moving target, at a significant down-angle (so a rifle sighted in at level/nearly-level will "shoot high"):

(3) accurately fire a rifle that was later tested by the FBI and found to shoot wildly off-target (i.e., at 15 yards the rifle tested 2½ inches high, and 1-inch to the right, while at 100 yards the test shots landed 2½ to 5 inches high, within a 3 to 5-inch circle);

(4) though a rather poor quality rifle scope (Ordinance Optics 4x18) with a VERY narrow field of view and a very small exit pupil diameter;

(5) rapid-firing three (3) rounds in 5.6 seconds;

(6) firing a cartridge with a "rainbow" ballistic trajectory (i.e., 162 gr military bullet shoots approx. 10" high at 100 yds on a rifle sighted in at a 300 yd military zero);

so even with a relatively light-recoiling round such as the 6.5x52mm round, it is very difficult to believe that a single shooter could fire three (3) well-aimed shots, two (2) of which struck Kennedy one (1) of which passed through Kennedy and struck Connelly.

Then there was the death bed confession of E. Howard Hunt (former Nixon "plumber", CIA operative, etc.) to his son, during which Hunt reportedly confessed that he had been involved in the JFK assassination and then there's that other "troubling fact" that Jack Ruby assassinated Lee Harvey Oswald on national television right inside the Dallas PD's main headquarters - Jack Ruby wasn't JFK's biggest fan and more importantly had strong Mob ties. Then there's always the still-secret JFK assassination files that won't be released until 2017 at the earliest but even then may be held back by Executive Order...

So, while Oswald could and most probably was involved, it's very difficult to accept that a troubled, ineffectual, wayward miscreant like Lee Harvey Oswald could have acted alone to assassinate JFK. Applying Occam's razor, it's easier to reason that Lee Harvey Oswald was simply a willing dupe, and that some other person(s) with either/both rouge CIA and/or Mob ties, was/were the shooter(s) that killed JFK.

The last words out if his mouth were "I'm a patsy"

Keep in mind the first shot starts the clock. There are tricks to operating a bolt action quickly that are less well known now than they were back then. One method to shoot the Lee Enfield quickly was to use your middle finger to pull trigger and keep thumb and index on bolt handle so youmcan run it quicker with less motion.

sppalmdale said:

(1) attempt to assassinate the President of the United States (there would be very, very few individuals who would be able to control their heart rate, breathing, hold and cheek weld considering the massive amount of adrenalin that the brain would cause the adrenal gland to excrete into the circulatory system). It's doubtful that even James Bond could keep his cool during such an event;

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Pure speculation. Also, this was not Oswald's first assassination attempt. He'd previously shot at General Walker and narrowly missed.

But even if what you say is true - he only hit one time in three at his target (JFK's head).

sppalmdale said:

(2) shoot at a moving target, at a significant down-angle (so a rifle sighted in at level/nearly-level will "shoot high"):

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Barely moving. It's not like the car was zooming along at 60mph.

sppalmdale said:

(3) accurately fire a rifle that was later tested by the FBI and found to shoot wildly off-target (i.e., at 15 yards the rifle tested 2½ inches high, and 1-inch to the right, while at 100 yards the test shots landed 2½ to 5 inches high, within a 3 to 5-inch circle);

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Totally untrue. The rifle was tested and found to be accurate. The FBI termed it "very accurate".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_F._Kennedy_assassination_rifle#FBI_tests

sppalmdale said:

(4) though a rather poor quality rifle scope (Ordinance Optics 4x18) with a VERY narrow field of view and a very small exit pupil diameter;

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No evidence Oswald even used it. Frankly, he didn't need it - the shots were easy. I have zero marksmanship training but with my milsurp rifles, I can easily head a head-sized object at 100 yards. That's only what, 5 MOA? Oswald was trained by the Marines. An average shot by their standards but a great shot by civilian standards.

sppalmdale said:

(5) rapid-firing three (3) rounds in 5.6 seconds;

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It's not that rapid. And it may have been more like 7.9 seconds.

sppalmdale said:

(6) firing a cartridge with a "rainbow" ballistic trajectory (i.e., 162 gr military bullet shoots approx. 10" high at 100 yds on a rifle sighted in at a 300 yd military zero);

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CBS took 11 men with no prior exposure to that rifle and who had less training than Oswald and many were able to hit twice in the time allotted. One hit three times.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_F._Kennedy_assassination_rifle#Firing_range

sppalmdale said:

So, while Oswald could and most probably was involved, it's very difficult to accept that a troubled, ineffectual, wayward miscreant like Lee Harvey Oswald could have acted alone to assassinate JFK. Applying Occam's razor, it's easier to reason that Lee Harvey Oswald was simply a willing dupe, and that some other person(s) with either/both rouge CIA and/or Mob ties, was/were the shooter(s) that killed JFK.

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No, Occam's razor argues that Oswald was indeed the lone gunman. There is no substantive proof to the contrary that has stood up to any kind of examination.

Sorry, but the evidence is overwhelming and the conspiracy theories (the mob, the CIA, etc.) are ridiculous and disproven. The only people who push them are people with books to sell.

The best site on the Internet is one maintained by McAdams, which goes to great length to debunk all the conspiracy theories.

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

There is no substantive proof to the contrary that has stood up to any kind of examination.

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The best that people come up with is 'ear' witnesses who say they heard more than 3 shots and/or shots from different directions than the TBDB. But for anyone that has ever deer hunted before we all know how hard it is to tell which of our neighbors just shot at a deer.

Plus the echos in a downtown setting would be very confusing to anyone who was there.

I don't know about the aiming bit, but I've fully cycled my MN 91/30 bolt fast enough to stovepipe the empty once. I showed my shooting buddy, dropped the case, and tried to put the next one in line in the chamber. Low and behold, there was already a live round in there, so it wasn't short stroked.

The best that people come up with is 'ear' witnesses who say they heard more than 3 shots and/or shots from different directions than the TBDB. But for anyone that has ever deer hunted before we all know how hard it is to tell which of our neighbors just shot at a deer.

Plus the echos in a downtown setting would be very confusing to anyone who was there.

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Which leads us to the ultimate stupidity.

There was a motorcycle cop who left his mike keyed, and there were some sounds on it that were thought to be gunshots. Congress hired audio "experts" who sealed off Dealy Plaza and actually fired shots from different locations and determined one of the recorded shots came from the Grassy Knoll -- with 95% certainty.

The National Geographic did an article on that, and included a flimsy vynel pull-out with the sounds on it.

Some guy put it on his record player and heard something the audio "experts" never noticed -- someone talking in the background. (I've heard it myself.)

It was "cross talk" from another channel, and it's the Sheriff of Dallas giving orders after the shooting.

Some "experts!"

But the grassy knoll....

I've seen it done a few times, and by teenagers at that. On occasion you will so a tube fed bolt 22 on the line at an Appleseed event. There is one stage where you start standing and have 50 seconds to drop to a seated or kneeling position and put 10 rounds on target. With a centerfire rifle this would be a full sized target at 200 yards , the standard is 4MOA.

He knew the rifle, what it was capable of and what it wasn't.

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Which might have been a good reason for him (or someone) to have used the Mauser that DPD initially claimed to have recovered from the TSBD.

Seems I read once that the limo wasn't preserved for evidence, that it was actually dismantled and destroyed rather quickly. Anybody else hear that? Seems mighty odd.

JFK assassination mysteries solved:

http://robotchicken.wikia.com/wiki/Secrets_of_the_Animal_Kingdom

Just because one was in the Marine Corps there is no guarantee that one was or is a competent/proficient marksman.

Just because one was in the Marine Corps trained on the semi-auto M1 Garand is no guarantee that one was or is a competent/proficient bolt-action rifleman, either.

It takes tractice. Marina Oswald testified that Oswald often sat practicing working the bolt on his rifle. She remembered it because it was annoying he spent so much time on that rifle. Oswald also occassionally shot at ranges for accuracy/sight check (at least twice).

Three shots require the bolt mechanism be operated twice: Bang. Work the bolt. Bang. Work the Bolt. Bang.

In one of the latest research studies, Failure Analysis Associates timed the shots at 8.3 seconds from first to last assuming the first shot missed, the second wounded Connelly and JFK, and the last was the head shot. Even with the minimum time used by the Warren Report assuming the missed shot was between the wounding and killing shots, that allowed 4.6 seconds total or 2.3 between shots. The FBI guy mentioned in the Warren Commission Report did have trouble doing three shots in 4.6 seconds, but I don't expect 1960s FBI agents to be proficient with WWII bolt actions.

Did anyone mention that Oswald might have been left eye dominant? I read an article where the writer claimed that people who knew Oswald said he shot from the left shoulder.

Lets just say that was true. A lefty can pull the trigger with the left hand and have his right hand on the bolt if the rifle is rested. Shooting prone in a sling lefties have to reach over the scope with their trigger hand because their right hand is on the forend, but they don’t have to do that from a bench.