Get disappointed with my Savage 11 shooting results

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ShootAndHunt

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Hi,

I just bought a Savage 11 FNS in .308 caliber. The reason I bought this is to get an cheap but accurate bolt action rifle to practice with my military surplus ammo (at these days the commercial ammo price is just too high, and I still have some pretty good surplus ammo left, such as the Austria). I could shoot my PTR-91 using these ammo into 1/2" at 100 yds.

However, during my two range trip with the Savage, I got very disappointed with this rifle. No matter how careful and hard I tried, it just shoot MOP (Minute Of PIE) at 100 Yds. I then shoot it at 50 yards, this time it gave me around 1 inch, that about 2 MOA. I am very embarrassed and confused. I know that Savage is supposed to be a cheap but very good rifle, and I don't think it is my shooting technique that is the problem (As I said, I could shoot into 1/2" with good rifles, some of them even don't have a trigger as good as the AccuTrigger). So what could cause this very inaccuracy? I topped the savage with a CenterPoint scope, which performed very good on other rifles.

Thanks,
 
My first thought is that your Savage just doesn't like that ammo. What one rifle may like, another rifle may hate. Try a couple of different brands and bullet weights of ammo. See how she does with some 150 and 168 grain rounds.
 
My savage rifles shoot poorly with military ball bullets. They shoot just fine with quality reloads made from good bullets. It does not have to be match grade components, but better than surplus.

Ranb
 
All the internet hype about how accurate Savage rifles are convinced me to try one. Three different times. I kept thinking it was just a lemon. My results were about the same as yours, no matter what ammo I used. No more Savage rifles for me.
 
I don't own one, but I've shot a few and across the board they shot a lot like the Remington 7600 and 750 - no matter how they looked, I've never seen one that wouldn't hold an inch if I did my part.

A Savage that won't shoot MOA, and a PTR that will shoot 1/2" groups with surplus ammo? Hmmm ... that seem to be an rather odd set of circumstances. ;)
 
A Savage that won't shoot MOA, and a PTR that will shoot 1/2" groups with surplus ammo? Hmmm ... that seem to be an rather odd set of circumstances.
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Same ammo, I doubt it...seriously!

my military surplus ammo (at these days the commercial ammo price is just too high
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You were thinking that all, or the surplus ammo you have on hand is good stuff, accurate? Not necessarily, it may shoot well for some ol; boy out of some military born hammer but not out of your Savage.

Try several different 'quality' ammunitions before you throw in the towel with your equipment.
Shucks, I have some 4 digit Palma stuff that I know, would not throw your surplus ammo into a bucket at 100y, now tell me, do you think the inaccuracy problem would stem from the rifle or the ammo? lol hehehehe
 
I would check the rate of twist in you mil-surplurs rifle and the rate of twist in your Savage. Then look at bullet weights. I'll bet your mil-surplus ammo is too light or too heavy a bullet to stabilize with the twist rate of your Savage. I suspect this because you groups are closing up at greater range: ie the longer the flight time the more spin on the bullet to stabilize.

My son has a Savage Model 12 in .308 and it is very accurate with 150 grain soft points.
 
I don't know, this is rude so sorry in advance. But honestly there's a reason things in life are "cheap". If it shot as good and/or was as reliable at half the price of other guns, they'd either be selling them at a loss (NOT) or nobody would buy the more expensive ones. You could kill a deer at 100 yards with that gun, or knock a man down with it, but it's probably not going to win you any marksman awards. It's a decent gun at a decent price. Not a great gun at a decent price. Only my 2 cents, but the theory is sound for about anything you buy in life. Just enjoy it for what it is; a .308 that could kill about anything you want out to 500 yards.
 
If it shot as good and/or was as reliable at half the price of other guns, they'd either be selling them at a loss (NOT) or nobody would buy the more expensive ones.
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Oh where to start with this one? Savages are inexpensive because of the design of them. Those same inexpensive to produce designs also lead toward accurate rifles. Things like the simple to headspace barrel and barrel nut, the floating bolt head, should I go on ...

I own a Savage target rifle, and I also own a Grade IV BAR, and a Renaissance grade Browning pistol. If you are buying for pure performance, and aesthetics are not a concern at all, then a Savage is a good choice. However sometimes I want to look good when I'm out hunting deer and pigs, that's what the pretty guns are for.:)

Cheap surplus ammo and a Centerpoint scope are not my recommended tools for shooting 1/2" groups. The majority of my bolt rifles with handloads or premium factory ammo and much more expensive glass won't do that. And a PTR 91 that will do that is a rare rifle to be treasured.
 
I've not owned a 30 cal rifle yet that could be relied aboun to put 5 147g fmjbt bullets into a pizza box at 100yds. Handloads, factory or milsurp. I'm fully of the opinion that this is the most inaccurate projectile mankind has yet devised followed closely by the .224" 55g FMJBT


A .5 MOA ptr91?????????? Why do I have a really really hard time believing this
 
Yep. Ammo, ammo, ammo.

Savages are the EXCEPTION to that general rule, OhioChief.

And the 2 MOA that the OP got at 50 yards is NOT inaccurate, let alone 'very inaccura[te
]'. It's not what the Savage is capable of (unless you got a lemon - doubtful), but with milsurp ammo, very very good. You're going from pie plate (12") at 100 (12 MOA), to 2" at 50 (4 MOA), or 3 times better. That's not the gun or ammo - that's the shooter/rest.

Get good ammo and will will shoot 1" or better at 100, and 1/2" or better at 50 - in ALL likelihood.
 
I just got back from a shoot that was chock full of Savage actions shooting a 3/4" dot at 200 yards. Some of the actions had been pulled off old model 10s and 16s and mated to a custom barrel. SOme were custom guns built on new Savage actions.

Savages will shoot. Period. And I don't own one.
 
first problem

Is the Cheap and I mean Cheap scope...... Check all your screws for tightness then throw the scope away and get a good one..... Your Savage is very capable of very good groups.


steve
 
Yeah, anyone one that says savage isn't making one of the best bolt guns for today regardless of cost is full of it. Every one of their models regardless of caliber will throw a 1" group or better at 100yds with factory ammo. The problem has nothing to do with twist rate, and bullets do not gain rotation after leaving the barrel schutzen. I would check your optics for one, but my guess is that a commercial .308 might not like the ever so slightly different 7.62x51 not to mention it is surplus. I'm in disbelief that the ptr is putting such groups up with any kind of ammo let alone surplus stuff.
 
2 MOA is fantastic with milsurp ammo. The powder in milsurp ammo is not consistent enough to give groups tighter than that, usually.
 
My Savage 10 did 4" at 100 yards with Magtech 147 grain ball. It just prefers Federal Gold Medal Match 168's and higher.
 
Hi,

I know that some of you guys really doubt my PTR-91 could shoot into 1/2" at 100 yards with my Austria surplus ammo. I have this gun for years. To be honest, I could NOT believe that myself the first time I saw the group, but it just keeps consistently doing that. When using other surplus ammos （I haven't tried the commercial ammo yet), the group opens up to 1" and 1 1/2", with South African, it is a little below 3". Once I even put a .308 shell at 100 Yds and shoot a hole right through it (I think there might be some luck in it). This is currently my most accurate rifle (with Austria Ammo). In my many other rifles, only my RRA AR-15 topped with a ACOG is close to that accuracy.

Back to the Savage, the surplus ammo I am using have bullet around 147 grains. I doubt that light bullet might be the reason, but some friend told me they tried 168 grain commercial and it is still not good. For those who have good experience with Savage in .308, what ammo do you guy use?

I agree Savage is a really good rifle at a good price, it looks not expensive, but still good, and I really like the AccuTrigger (I had a hard start learning to using it, because I set it light, and it is just a touch off, not even squeeze, but I begin to appreciate it once I get used to it). However, this grouping thing really get my nerve. If it cannot use the surplus ammo but ask for expensive commecial one, that is against my initial purpose.

For the scope, at first I have doubt on that too. However, the fact it could shoot around 2" at 50 yards seems against this reason. This is to be a non-pricey set up, so I didn't go high on glasses (I don't expect much from the rifle too, I was expecting around 2", but Minute of Pie is really radiculous
 
I'monna go a diff route here; I say scope first, I don't care if it is new or used, then bbl freefloat, then bullets, in that order.
To eliminate the scope as the prob, shoot it at 50 yds, open sites. if you do not have open sites, rig a siteline for yourself down the top of the bbl, maybe put a stripe of whiteout on the top of the bbl, near the muzzle about 1 inch long, and figure out where it is going to strike at 50 yds, then put your paper there. If you can consistently do 2 inch groups, at 50 yds, with nothing but handmade sites, then it is not the rifle.
If it is still grouping, with groups that make no sense, then it is time to make the bbl freefloated, for sure. Freefloat the crap out of that stock channel, whether you think it needs it or not.
 
The only time my savage 10FP has shot over an inch at 100yrds, was during load delelopment, with a powder it flat out didn't like. Fed GMM shoots under an inch, my tailered handloads shoot .5"-.6" 5 shot groups all day. My rifle prefers 155gr SMKs, 168gr SMKs, 168gr Amax bullets, havn't got around to loading anything heavier, but the 1 in 10" twist can handle the heavies.

Hang in there! and splurge on some Match ammo, to see what it can do. And definately borrow a known good scope to try, make sure your action screws are tight, barrel is floated, bore isn't copper fouled..........;)
 
How big are the strings that you are shooting? And what weight/thickness is the barrel? I have a Stevens 200 (same action as a Savage) in 7mm-08 that came with a sporter weight barrel. It is VERY accurate for about 5 - 10 shots and then it shoots all over the place when the barrel heats up. If I let it cool down, back to driving tacks.

If you have a lightweight hunting barrel you aren't going to be able to put tons of round downrange without giving it a bunch of breaks. This is the general rule of sporter barrels, and in my experience has held true pretty well.
 
guys... you know this thread is 6 months old, right?
 
Savage uses 1:10 twist, guys 147 grain ammo is to light to get stabilized in its barrel, first get some M118 that's 175 grain bullet ammo and try to shoot it. Another thing, I also had Savage 11 model before and it wouldn't group tight doesn't matter what I tried, usually it would shoot 1.2 - 1.5 MOA, so I called Savage and they told me that's it is normal and withing their specs for 11 model, actually 1.75" is what it designed to shoot. So I got rid of Savage and got Remington 700 SPS Varmint and that thing shoots 0.35 MOA

3 month old, upps never mind
 
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