Car carry in National Guard facilities

If Utah's law does not expressly forbid carry on STATE government property, I agree that a wearing a uniform should have absolutely no bearing on whether a gun can be kept in the parked car. But I'm talking common sense, not convoluted law.

BUT, there are federal projects and funding housed within the building.

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That alone does not make the building Federal property.

Once again, the definition of Federal property in 18 USC 930:

(g) As used in this section:
(1) The term “Federal facility” means a building or part thereof owned or leased by the Federal Government, where Federal employees are regularly present for the purpose of performing their official duties.

Two conditions must be met:

Is the National Guard facility owned or leased by the Federal government? Probably not.

Are Federal employees REGULARLY resent for the purpose of performing their official duties?
Probably not.

Perhaps a consult with a lawyer is necessary. I would not recommend messing with the feds in any capacity. But it does bring up an interesting conundrum some other posters maybe in.

Have you thought about asking the facility manager/commander?

I heard that there is a reg. stating you cannot carry a non-issue firearm while in uniform, I will look it up and see what it actaully states.

You can carry(nonissue weapon) in uniform IF you are specifically authorized by the CO in writing. There are very specific guidlines on that. Not that is for offical business.

You have ask about carrying in the parking lot. No Official has told you No you can't. The property is not posted. Under Federal Law you are permitted to carry there. If the building itself is not posted and no one in authority has told you carry is not allowed there you can legally carry in the building. Now since you are employed by the people who control the building if you were told that you can't carry while on duty then you are not breaking any law you are breaking your employees rules. Read the Federal Code below. If it belongs to the feds they must post it. If they don't and no one has informed you personally that you can't carry in the parking lot then you are legal in the parking lot even if it is federal property. Again read the US code below about firearms on federal property.

18 USC Sec. 930 01/03/2007

TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 44 - FIREARMS

Sec. 930. Possession of firearms and dangerous weapons in Federal facilities

(a) Except as provided in subsection (d), whoever knowingly possesses or causes to be present a firearm or other dangerous weapon in a Federal facility (other than a Federal court facility), or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 1 year, or both.
(b) Whoever, with intent that a firearm or other dangerous weapon be used in the commission of a crime, knowingly possesses or causes to be present such firearm or dangerous weapon in a Federal facility, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 5 years, or both.
(c) A person who kills any person in the course of a violation of subsection (a) or (b), or in the course of an attack on a Federal facility involving the use of a firearm or other dangerous weapon, or attempts or conspires to do such an act, shall be punished as provided in sections 1111, 1112, 1113, and 1117.
(d) Subsection (a) shall not apply to -
(1) the lawful performance of official duties by an officer, agent, or employee of the United States, a State, or a political subdivision thereof, who is authorized by law to engage in or supervise the prevention, detection, investigation, or prosecution of any violation of law;
(2) the possession of a firearm or other dangerous weapon by a Federal official or a member of the Armed Forces if such possession is authorized by law; or
(3) the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful purposes.
(e)
(1) Except as provided in paragraph (2), whoever knowingly possesses or causes to be present a firearm in a Federal court facility, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title, imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both.
(2) Paragraph (1) shall not apply to conduct which is described in paragraph (1) or (2) of subsection (d).
(f) Nothing in this section limits the power of a court of the United States to punish for contempt or to promulgate rules or orders regulating, restricting, or prohibiting the possession of weapons within any building housing such court or any of its proceedings, or upon any grounds appurtenant to such building.
(g) As used in this section:
(1) The term "Federal facility" means a building or part thereof owned or leased by the Federal Government, where Federal employees are regularly present for the purpose of performing their official duties.
(2) The term "dangerous weapon" means a weapon, device, instrument, material, or substance, animate or inanimate, that is used for, or is readily capable of, causing death or serious bodily injury, except that such term does not include a pocket knife with a blade of less than 2 1/2 inches in length.
(3) The term "Federal court facility" means the courtroom, judges' chambers, witness rooms, jury deliberation rooms, attorney conference rooms, prisoner holding cells, offices of the court clerks, the United States attorney, and the United States marshal, probation and parole offices, and adjoining corridors of any court of the United States.
(h) Notice of the provisions of subsections (a) and (b) shall be posted conspicuously at each public entrance to each Federal facility, and notice of subsection (e) shall be posted conspicuously at each public entrance to each Federal court facility, and no person shall be convicted of an offense under subsection (a) or (e) with respect to a Federal facility if such notice is not so posted at such facility, unless such person had actual notice of subsection (a) or (e), as the case may be.

If you're in uniform (IE on duty) they just get you for failing to obey a lawful order

mljdeckard,
Thats what my post stated. If you were not told it was off limits and it is not posted then you can't be charged under the law. Telling you would also mean the company/Units rules which you are required to know to have employment. In almost all instances you signed a paper stating you were given the rules and understand them. That is common practice anywhere you work.

If it is posted then you are breaking a law and can be charged. As for parking lot storage laws you have to read the law in the state you are in. In some states it just says a place can not prohibit by law someone storing a firearm in their vehicle. In some states the law says an employee can not stop anyone from keeping a firearm in their vehicle and can't fire them if they do. If the state you are in just says they can't stop someone from having a firearm in their vehicle in their parking lot that company can have a policy for employment that states if you have a firearm in your vehicle on company property you can't be charged under the law but we can fire you. Not all the parking lot storage laws are equal.

If your in uniform, or on duty as a member of the national guard you follow their rules, if not you suffer the consequences. If nothing exists on paper, as stated above you are violating a lawful order.

I know in the Air Force there is no carrying of unissued weapons in uniform IAW AFI31-1 and no carrying concealed without a CCW card issued by your commander. I am sure the Army or the Guard have similiar directives which are lawful orders and violation of a lawful order is punishable under Article 92 of the UCMJ.

The Real Mags said:

no carrying concealed without a CCW card issued by your commander.

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I am glad we don't have that requirement in the Navy! I'll bet there a lot of Air Force personnel out there breaking that one!

I meant in uniform for duty related activities, I should have been more clear.