Idiocy by range employees, at a state-run range in Arizona - Won't be going back

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I am amazed with the fact there has been no personal injuries with the indoor range I used to frequent.

This is what its like at a lot of our local ranges. Kids running around, people joking and firing when unsafe and just BAD gun etiquette. And not an employee around, they are all just still back in the shop taking peoples money and joking around. And this is why its better just to find someone who own a gazillion acres down there and just go shoot.

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The PSl has a "small" mag & usually only has a couple mags when purchased...I have shot one rapid fire and never had a problem. I have shot an AK until I could smell the forearm smoking....this shouldn't be an issue.

Burrs/headspace? Maybe your ammo is too heavily laquered? Clean the chamber with a bore brush...

Sorry if you feel you're getting hammered. A lot of RO's don't like glitches, the more the "flow" gets messed up the more they feel that something is about to happen.

There are no public ranges in my State, so I pay $150/yr for a private one. If the place really sucks, there's always private property.

Wardenwolf. WHO told you that is normal behavior for that type of rifle? Almost all bolt and an awful lot of Semi's use the rotating bolt, and I have NEVER heard of your rifle's behavior as being "normal". You have a malfunctioning rifle. There is something wrong, seriously wrong with your rifle, and it needs fixin'.

Do not blame others on here who are saying "ahem, young man, your guns broke," when you are too insistent on describing a serious issue with your weapon as a normal operating characteristic. Sorry to rain urine on your parade, but you have a problem with the gun, the RSO did what he had to do to ensure a safe range for all the others at the shooting line so it could go cold. It may have pissed you off, but that is not their problem. Had I been the RSO there, I would have pulled you off the line, I would have done the same as that officer did, and I would not have tried to do anything with the gun, including trying to manipulate the safety on what was a defective malfunctioning weapon. I also would have told you that you had one shot left, and then I was red tagging the gun.

I do not care if it only happens if its hot, or your lube fails to work, all I would know is I have a gun on the range that can not be cleared when ordered. Simple fact. Your gun does not work as designed. It has an issue, as it seems you do, when confronted with this.

A PSL is a tough and rugged rifle, calling it a "precision" weapon is debatable in my mind. Its a stamped steel war rifle, probably assembled here in the USA of mix master parts to beat the importation ban. I am not trying to put you down personally, but your tone towards some very educated and experienced people here on the board leads me to believe you need a couple of wake ups.

Your refusal to listen to the RSO at the trap line signals much the same attitude, I have yet to visit any trap range where the signs do not say "Load only when on the line, Load one round, Leave the action open and displayed between trips to the line."

Take a step back and ask yourself why are the RSO's upset with me?

That RSO has no clue who you are, and doesn't know you from Adam, but he knows the rules of the range and when you broke them, he applied the rules. I am 100 % certain he never thought "oh, there's that WardenWolf, I am going to be a complete dick to him" when you showed up.

my indoor/outdoor range is policed by members. our main concern is your a member. It's amazingly stupid how many bullet holes are in the ceiling by people who cock their revolvers pointed up and discharge them before the muzzle comes even close to the target. I've seen 2 people do it, 1 twice in a row with the bullets inches apart in the duct work. we make them circle their ND's and sign their names to the holes, if we catch them.

I have to agree with the folks here. You're rifle needs some work. Just because it is a PSL, it is NOT a precision rifle. I wouldn't even call a TRUE Dragunov a precision rifle. Accurate in the right hands, yes, but it's a battle rifle. I collect and repair relics primarily and I can tell you I have fired Mosins, mausers, carcanos, you name it, until you could cook on them and the bolts open with the same force it takes to open them on an empty chamber. It is very possible your headspace is just a tad short and it isn't the heat but an out of spec round of ammo that is wedging on the shoulder. I had the same problem when headspacing my Savage. I headspaced on a fully prepped and fired case that was fired out of that specific rifle. It makes it very picky and if the ammo is a bit out of spec the bolt is hard to close and even harder to open. It absolutely would hurt no one if you just check the headspace and see if you have a bolt lug dragging.

we make them circle their ND's and sign their names to the holes, if we catch them.

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That's actually a kind of neat system.

I work at a private range open to the public and work most weekends. I care about safety of all the shooters on the line. New shooters I watch like a hawk, and I've seen more stupid things from shooters than I care to mention, even experienced ones. Our rules are pretty straight forward: On cease fire. Drop mags for semi's, rack slide and lock slides back if possible. Wheel guns open cylinders, dump rounds leave cylinders open. handguns are pointed down range on the bench, rifles are in the rack. EVERYONE steps back from the firing line and absolutely no one picks up a weapon. Once that's done I call the range safe.
Referring to the OP's problem I probably would have let him clear the chamber, then talked to him about it when the range is safe. In some cases I would probably get the gun back into the shop and have the boss look at it. If he tells me and the owner of the gun that the gun has a problem, That gun is off the range.

I have shot at the Ben Avery range and like the controlled environment. It sure takes care of the crazys out there with their brand new AR's that ain't got a clue as to how to operate it. I watched an RO pull a couple youngsters off the line and take the time to show them proper use and operation of their new AR. Then they returned to the line and seem to enjoy the rest of their time. These guys and gals ain't all bad.

For those of us who went through basic training, firing line RO's are like having that old DI looking over our shoulder.

A rotating bolt action can lock up very tightly if the tolerances are tight. Particularly if it's been shot enough that the lube has worn down or the gun is hot, the latter being the case for me because I was sighting in and adjusting the scope after every shot or two.

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I have a hard time believing that the tolerances are tighter than the various target guns I've been around, yet none of them seem to have the issue you're reporting.

Being a PSL, it's designed with a bit tighter tolerances than your typical AK. And, being a PSL, the ammo generates a lot more heat. As anyone who's ever fired a Mosin Nagant for any length of time knows, actions can get very hard to cycle once the gun heats up.

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So hard to cycle that it's not possible to render one safe in the event the range is called cold?

So no, there's nothing wrong with the rifle. It's a simple matter of heat expansion coupled with tight tolerances.

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I'll admit to not having experience with the PSL. So I'll defer to you that this may be an inherent flaw in the design of the weapon.

That said, just because a flaw is ensconced in the design of the weapon does not mean that you should get a free ride to ignore proper safety procedure. A weapon that regularly becomes so difficult to operate that the bolt cannot be operated in order to unload and show clear when a range is called cold is fundamentally an unsafe gun.

Wardenwolf,

Sorry if you felt I insulted you, that was not my intention. I did however give you some ideas as to how to avoid the wrath of the ROs in the future. The ROs didn't want you to discharge the firearm because people have already removed their hearing protection so the rifle was "made safe" by removing it from the firing line, This is Standard Ops. If you were on my firing line, the rifle would have been declared unsafe and removed until it was proven (to me) to be normally operative. If it happened a second time, it would be removed for the day.
Trap rules are easy, one round at a time for American trap, two rounds for International. Skeet is one round per target presented. I'll go away now.....

Thanx, Russ

I agree with the OP. It would have been a simple matter of letting everyone else know that the range was still hot, and fire off the round. Short, sweet and simple.

If you ever get down by Bouse, stop by the LaPaz County Firing Range and enjoy yourself. Covered concrete shooting benches etc, free, no RO, one range courtesy person who lives on site.

It is one neat range for pistol, rifle, scatterguns and muzzleloaders. Hard to believe a tiny remote community like Bouse would have such a facilty. But, it might be the old military range, as Bouse was where General Patton trained troops for North Africa campaign during WW-2.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...bouse&btnG=Search&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=