fatcat4620
Member
Plastic is made from OIL!!! how could water do anything to it???
Glock Boiling???
- Thread starter coolluke01
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Ok, now I've heard everything. No, I've never heard of such a thing before. It sounds like someone from Pierce was pulling your chain.
Sonic cleaners are notorious for screwing up otherwise fine guns.
Having a couple rounds move around in a Glock magazine is not that uncommon or a big deal. From my experience it usually goes away after the magazine is broken in.
Certaindeaf
member
I've never heard of rehydrating plastics except for the hundreds of magic car products available.
Many plastics can be harmed by many solvents. Personally, I'd not use certain brake cleaners and or full strength Simple Green on any plastics I owned.
beag_nut
Member
Quote:
"Nylon 66 in raw form can absorb up to 11% of its weight in water... HOWEVER, Nylon 66 +30% glass fiber will absorb very little if any, moisture and will remain dimensionally stable.
This is why Glock (presumably) uses Nylon 66 + 30% GF. This is commonly known by injection molding manufacturers and is no trade secret.
BTW, even if nylon absorbs water while boiling, it will expel the water as it cools down. "
Sorry, but Nylon 66 +30% glass fiber will absorb between 6.4 to 7 % water. Also not a trade secret. And, it will NOT expel the water during cooldown. That was a problem we had when making surgical instruments. Absorption of the water causes the nylon to temporarily (as long as the internal water is present) soften. So the original guy who said to boil the Glock frames was a little bit correct, but only correct enough to get himself and others in trouble.
"Nylon 66 in raw form can absorb up to 11% of its weight in water... HOWEVER, Nylon 66 +30% glass fiber will absorb very little if any, moisture and will remain dimensionally stable.
This is why Glock (presumably) uses Nylon 66 + 30% GF. This is commonly known by injection molding manufacturers and is no trade secret.
BTW, even if nylon absorbs water while boiling, it will expel the water as it cools down. "
Sorry, but Nylon 66 +30% glass fiber will absorb between 6.4 to 7 % water. Also not a trade secret. And, it will NOT expel the water during cooldown. That was a problem we had when making surgical instruments. Absorption of the water causes the nylon to temporarily (as long as the internal water is present) soften. So the original guy who said to boil the Glock frames was a little bit correct, but only correct enough to get himself and others in trouble.
exavid
Member
Boiling some plastics in water can relieve stress. Years ago when I was a young lad flying R/C models the new nylon propellors that became available tended to break if you just bolted them onto the engine and crashed. If they were boiled for twenty minutes they became almost crash proof. It's also true that there are several different plastics that will absorb some water. If you have a powder scale it's easy to prove, just weight some samples, boil them for a half hour or more and weigh them again.
Maximumbob54
Member
I'm not concerned about the open cell structure of nylon or similar. What I'm trying to figure is how WATER would do a darn thing to how pliable the plastic is or isn't. We aren't talking about your dried out dish sponge. If we were soaking them in mineral oil then maybe I could see how that MIGHT do something, but I'm not enough of a chemistry teacher to know what nylon is made of or what it would need to react and become more "gummy" that it would normally be. I know acetone and turpentine tend to melt down anything they touch so that's one of the few things I would see in a very diluted state maybe making a Glock more pliable. But who would be willing to put that to a Glock torture test... 
Certaindeaf
member
Dear heavens to betsy.
Who would have even known that pig noses needed fixed.
Who would have even known that pig noses needed fixed.
A snipe is any of about 25 wading bird species in Scolopacidae.
Night Snipe hunting is the gag.
http://www.dgif.virginia.gov/hunting/regulations/webless-migratory-gamebirds.asp#common-snipe
armarsh
Member
^^^^
I was referring to the fruitless exercise famously known as a snipe hunt, hence the
smiley in my post.
We have plovers here that people call snipe too. I'm not ashamed to admit I had to look up scolopacidae.
I was referring to the fruitless exercise famously known as a snipe hunt, hence the
smiley in my post.We have plovers here that people call snipe too. I'm not ashamed to admit I had to look up scolopacidae.
W.E.G.
Member
I wonder if this means that it would actually preserve my Glock to carry it in a sweaty IWB holster?
Would I need to carry it righty and lefty on alternate days to keep one side of the Glock from getting over-hydrated relative to the other side?
Can I bend my Glock by carrying it regularly on just one side in the sweaty holster?
If I coat my Glock in paste-wax, will it keep the plastic from dehydrating?
Would I need to carry it righty and lefty on alternate days to keep one side of the Glock from getting over-hydrated relative to the other side?
Can I bend my Glock by carrying it regularly on just one side in the sweaty holster?
If I coat my Glock in paste-wax, will it keep the plastic from dehydrating?
nonseven
Member
The plastic in a Glock is either nylon 6, nylon 66, or a blend. It may be glass fiber filled, but from the looks of it likely less than 30%. Nylon 6 and 66 absorb moisture from the environment until they reach equilibrium. Moisture effects the properties of the plastic by making it tougher, more flexible, more impact resistant. Often nylon products like cable ties, have moisture added to them to make them tougher, less brittle. However, these properties can also be added to the nylon by chemical impact modifiers which cause the nylon to be tough and impact resistant independent of moisture content. Since it is likely that the Glock polymer has impact modifiers, I can see no reason that it needs moisture conditioning even in a very dry environment.
Master Blaster
Member
left handed smoke shifter anyone?
coolluke01
Member
Thank you to all those that know what they are talking about. It helps a great deal to have professionals weigh in on this.
To those that have a hard time understanding how water can effect "solid" objects, our own bodies are made up of 70% water. Finger nails and bones have water as part of their makeup. Heck, even rocks have water in them, that water level can change too!
In no way would we want to make our Glocks gummy or like a noodle. This is simply a process to ensure the moisture content is at the optimal level. If there are impact modifiers in the Glock polymer I can see that it could be something that is not needed. However, it could still be a positive practice as even with those modifiers it could still take on additional moisture. I would think that Glock would do it's best to maintain the baseline they would like the impact resistance and durability to be. Making the gun more impact resistant or flexible could be a good thing.
If I remember right Pearce said that there were no or few glass fibers in the Glock polymer. I can't remember exactly what he said. He did contrast it with keltec's that have glass fibers and a cheaper grade of polymer.
I don't think I'll boil my Glock frame until I see it failing though.
To those that have a hard time understanding how water can effect "solid" objects, our own bodies are made up of 70% water. Finger nails and bones have water as part of their makeup. Heck, even rocks have water in them, that water level can change too!
In no way would we want to make our Glocks gummy or like a noodle. This is simply a process to ensure the moisture content is at the optimal level. If there are impact modifiers in the Glock polymer I can see that it could be something that is not needed. However, it could still be a positive practice as even with those modifiers it could still take on additional moisture. I would think that Glock would do it's best to maintain the baseline they would like the impact resistance and durability to be. Making the gun more impact resistant or flexible could be a good thing.
If I remember right Pearce said that there were no or few glass fibers in the Glock polymer. I can't remember exactly what he said. He did contrast it with keltec's that have glass fibers and a cheaper grade of polymer.
I don't think I'll boil my Glock frame until I see it failing though.
mesinge2
Member
hahahahaha
hapidogbreath
Member
Does anyone with a materials science degree have any informative input??? I could talk to a QC Engineer and find out if not....
481
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I agree.
Last FTIR I ran on the Glock polymer was kind of inconclusive (the results didn't differentiate as well as I'd've liked) but the exemplar library matches it as Nylon 6 nonetheless. Overall, my best guess is that the Glock polymer is a glass filled impact grade of Nylon 6, possibly blended with a hybrid.
Polyamides (nylon) like those found in the Glock are attacked by strong bases and acids, suffer hydrolysis in hot (> 120F) water and are softened by ketones (e.g.: acetone) and permanently damaged by halogenated hydrocarbons. Nylon 6 (and its variants) has a Vicat softening point of 419F and melting points in the range of 401-437F and saturates (H20) between 7% and 11%. Nylon 6 exhibits excellent chemical resistance to alcohols (isopropanol, ethanol), gasoline and petroleum lubricants (like motor oil).
In short, I wouldn't advise boiling Nylon 6 because it risks permanent damage (primarily through hydrolysis) to the polymer with little benefit in return.
Overkilll0084
Member
Just for the heck of it, I sent a link to this thread to a friend of mine who owns a plastic molding company. Here is the response:
http://www2.basf.us//PLASTICSWEB/displayanyfile?id=0901a5e180004880
I'm not going to be boiling any guns, but I thought I would add some info.
The article cited:
http://www2.basf.us//PLASTICSWEB/displayanyfile?id=0901a5e180004880
I'm not going to be boiling any guns, but I thought I would add some info.
Maximumbob54
Member
And since the frame nor the mags are super tight tolerance parts, none of this should matter. Since UV was mentioned already, I would think that UV damage to the frame would be more of a worry item than the amount of moisture in the frame. Since I don’t know of many holstered carry Glocks failing from becoming brittle due to UV damage, I would think this would also be a non issue. At least this was a fun and slightly informative thread as far as learning about nylon.
tipoc
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Can anyone cite a source for the reference that Glock itself recommends boiling of the gun? I ask because I have not seen nor read that Glock encourages this practice for freshning up it's guns. I have not read or heard where any other manufacturer of poly framed guns recommends this either. Until I do I believe I'll pass on boiled Glock.
It was Pearce, the manufacturer of the after market extended base plate mags (if there was ever a useless product this has gotta be it, by the way) that made the boiling recommendation. In light of this I'd send the extended mag back to Pearce and have their skilled technicians do the boiling. If the mag was wrong let them repair it. I'd bet ten bucks they send it back and say "Hey we can't repair this someone boiled it!!?!"
Ain't it a bit nerdy to be actually debating this by the way?
tipoc
It was Pearce, the manufacturer of the after market extended base plate mags (if there was ever a useless product this has gotta be it, by the way) that made the boiling recommendation. In light of this I'd send the extended mag back to Pearce and have their skilled technicians do the boiling. If the mag was wrong let them repair it. I'd bet ten bucks they send it back and say "Hey we can't repair this someone boiled it!!?!"
Ain't it a bit nerdy to be actually debating this by the way?
tipoc
The frames are black due to a substance added to the plastic to cut down on UV damage. I've seen the results of one test quoted. In that test, which exposed the frame material to UV levels and durations equivalent to 100 years of sunlight exposure, the mechanical properties of the frame material were not significantly altered.
ny32182
Member
Man I've read some good BS Glock threads over the years but this one really takes the cake. 
The answer to the original question about rounds rattling in the mag is that it is normal from time to time with just about any double stack pistol mag I have ever seen. As long as the springs are stiff enough to keep them from going bullet-up, it is a complete non-issue.
Likewise, the dust cover is angled up to touch the slide on every single Glock I have ever seen. Personally I would not go boiling the frame or mags in an attempt to reshape the dust cover, "re-hydrate" the frame, re-homogonize the molecules, or for any other reason.
"Re-hydrating the Glock". Good lord. I bet the fellows are Pearce are changing their headlight fluid in their cars every so often as well.
The answer to the original question about rounds rattling in the mag is that it is normal from time to time with just about any double stack pistol mag I have ever seen. As long as the springs are stiff enough to keep them from going bullet-up, it is a complete non-issue.
Likewise, the dust cover is angled up to touch the slide on every single Glock I have ever seen. Personally I would not go boiling the frame or mags in an attempt to reshape the dust cover, "re-hydrate" the frame, re-homogonize the molecules, or for any other reason.
"Re-hydrating the Glock". Good lord. I bet the fellows are Pearce are changing their headlight fluid in their cars every so often as well.
Certaindeaf
member
These condensed time tests (all) are valuable but the one important thing they lack is actual time. I'm not a Glocker but why are they on generation 5 after 30 years?
I guess we'll just have to see for ourselves how the first generation holds up after 100 years of hard use.
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