Could you "point" your HP handgun bullet for better penetration?

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GJgo

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Thinking about a solution to an issue I'm having. I've worked up a pretty stout load in my S&W 610 using 200gr XTPs, and at this velocity they don't seem to hold together very well. It almost seems as though they come apart worse than a 180 XTP travelling faster.

The problem I'm seeing in all of the 40 cal bullet offerings is that they are designed for 40 cal velocities- it'd be nice if there was a heavy offering that was designed for 10mm velocities. Seems the round is gaining popularity these days. I could possibly use FMJ but there would be no expansion, I'd love to see a heavy JSP but I can't find one. I'm not really interested in hard cast, I suppose it'd work but I'd have to slow them way down.

I have a preference for XTPs in my handguns and was thinking, would it be posible to use some sort of pointing die to close up the hollow point some & possibly keep the rounds together better? Does that make any sense?

Heck, they might fly better, too :) Last week it took me 4 shots to whack the 15" gong @ 300 yds, off hand, that was pretty exciting!
 
I guess my reply would be in the form of a question..

What are you using the pistol for?

If it's gong banging, then just use the FMJ and who cares about expansion?

If it's hunting, you need to balance expansion with penetration.
Think of an arrow. Zero expansion
Now, a varmint bullet. Zero penetration.

So it depends on what you're using the bullet for.

Hollow points are to ensure that all the bullet's energy is displaced on in the tissue.

So what are you shooting? Deer? Coyote? Home defense? I'd have a different opinion bullet choice for every application.

Now, as far as your question about .401 XTP's at 10mm velocities, I understand your speculation as being correct.
I think Hornady redesigned the XTP to work more at .40 S&W velocities and considers the 10mm as a "dead platform" (much like diesel performance manufacturers consider the 7.3l Powerstroke obsolete).

As far as "pointing?" Not that I'm aware of.
But, I have known people to fill the cavity with Bondo or JB Weld.

When you think about it, remember those Speer(?) hollowpoints that were notorious for non-expansion if shot through heavy clothing? Because the cavity got clogged with fabric before it entered tissue?
 
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I'd use a FMJ myself. Or maybe a SP.
Most anything in that type of situation, you're gonna want to poke two holes in it with the same bullet. Except bears. You're gonna want a short-barrelled 12ga. loaded with slugs for that.

Handguns just pi$$ bears off.
 
I guess my response would be a question also. What are you useing it for? I don't see the point in useing a hollow point if you want penatration. The faster you push it the more it is going to come apart & the less it will penatrat.
 
The only bullet I am finding consistently is the Speer FMJ FP 180gr. I would like to find the Hornady FP's local but would have to order them online. I carry it in the woods when I really don't feel like lugging my 44 mag. The only predator I am worried about needing the solid bullet is the bears, and when they are out I do lug the 44 but I think a full power 10mm would have the penetration with a solid projectile. Olny ones I have found, hope it helps.
 
This is funny because it is exactly the opposite situation as when the .40 first came out and there were problems with bullets not expanding at all because they were designed for 10mm velocities instead of the .40 S&W aka the 10mm Special.
 
I load and test expansion/penetration with all of my hand gun loads and haven't experienced any consistent issues of this type. I've tested the XTP's by shooting them through a 16" cardboard box lined with a trash bag, filled with water and rolled up denim. About 1 in 10 rounds didn't expand much if any, but the others performed flawlessly with fullly deployed HP pedals. I also did this with Gold Dots, and contrary to what others have said, they demonstrated perfect expansion with 10 of 10 rounds fired. But regarding fragmentation or separation, I didn't see any sign of such.

If it's expansion that you are trying to avoid, try using a standard soft point bullet. HP's are designed to expand radically, that is how they function. It's all a matter of what your trying to achieve, and if expansion isn't what your seeking, then switch bullets, but certainly don't attempt to reconfigure the bullet design. And according to your post, you seem to be concerned with accuracy, which is not going to be very good if you go messing with the bullet nose. There are plenty of other reasons why it's a bad idea to mess with the nose of a bullet, among those reasons would be olgive inconsistency.

Years back I filled some HP bullets with epoxy to see what they did when fired into the water filled box denim test. They had nearly the same expansion pattern as the non filled HP's. The jackets on most HP's are thinner around the HP to help ensure full expansion, so changing the shape or filling the HP isn't the answer. Buy the bullets that meet your needs.
 
Why bother :eek:with filling / plugging HP bullets. Sound like to me, all you need are some good Hard cast, or solids of some sort. I would take a look at either Cor-bon, DoubleTap , Buffalo-Bore they all have some good loads for woods carry.
Good luck and be safe. You can use Hard Cast lead in a Glock as long as you keep it cleaned well after each range trip or shooting. Keep ahead of the leading of the barrel. If all else fails just buy a 10mm:evil:
It is easy to make a 10mm load down to a mild 40S&W load. Not so easy to reverse the loads. 40S&W up to 10mm. True it can be done at the risk of DANGER to either the weapon , the shooter, or bystanders.
 
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Sierra used to make a 190gr Match Flat Point bullet in 10mm. It had some exposed lead at the tip, kind of like most FMJs only reversed.

This was hands down the most accurate projectile ever to leave the muzzle of my 610 and Delta Elite. Far more accurate than I am.

Back in my impudent days (when everything I owned had to digest the hottest loads available), I drove it to ludicrous speeds. The only "expansion" I ever saw was it turning itself into more of a cylinder shape compared to its normal truncated cone. Penetration was deeper than any other 10mm bullet I tried.

Unfortunately, they are discontinued. Maybe if you kept an eye open at the various suppliers/auctioneers some might turn up. But probably only enough to work up some loads and keep on hand for real use... you won't be plinking with them I'm sure.

If not, it looks like a good hard cast bullet around 200gr loaded as hot as you care to will be your best bet.

I wouldn't try to compress HP's, I think you'd further compromise them and they'd come apart faster. Especially XTP's (and others) that having skiving on their jackets and/or internally on the lead core.
 
Fair enough, pointing isn't a good idea. That's why I asked. :) I may end up with a FMJ since JSP & XTP-FP don't seem to exist in 40 cal.
 
I would suggest giving the Nosler Sporting Handgun bullets a try. They have a tighter HP than the XTP's and they seem to be a tougher bullet meant for hunting. They are also sold in 250rd bulk packs so you can save some money too.

I used to use XTP bullets until I gave the Nosler bullets a try and I'm stuck on them. They are every bit as accurate as the XTP's and more.
 
The Nosler HP's have a picture on the box. It shows what the expanded bullet is supposed to look like at different velocities. The pic of the 180 gr @1350fps looks relatively intact, for w/e that's worth. The pics on the 150gr box suggest that weight will tend to fragment at 10mm velocities.

I've shot hundreds of the 180gr, and they do some serious damage to zombie squash. I haven't recovered any expanded bullets, but I've found a few shed jackets. Dunno how well a jacket is supposed to stay on when hitting a dirt and rock backstop, but finding nearly intact, empty jackets isn't very comforting.
 
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