NJ senators want to confiscate, confiscate, confiscate

Sadly, Johnny, as a Washingtonian (and as a Wet Sider "mossback") myself I have to point out that WRT Seattle the stereotype of them is bang-on far more often than it's wrong...

TenDriver said:

This is what I'm talking about. Many folks in the concrete jungles see a firearm as an instrument of killing people. It's our job to change that mantra, and the only way to do it is one at a time. You "enlighten" your brother-in-law, and the next time the subject comes up amongst his crowd he'll have a different point of view on it.

That does not mean an anti-gun person will suddenly become an avid shooter. You'll just be expanding their knowledge a little.

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That's definitely the right attitude, but in NJ, winning the "hearts and minds" of the population is practically impossible. The starting point in NJ is this: it is illegal for anyone to possess a firearm. Just think about that for a moment. There are NO 2nd amendment rights in NJ. They are denied by state law. Only with an exception (FID card) you MAY be allowed to possess a firearm. Therefore, only about 10% of the population here are gun owners. So for 90% of the population, guns are something: Seen on TV. Seen in movies. Used by criminals.

There is no "culture" of firearm ownership here AT ALL. Just a small minority of the population. And of that small minority, a small subsection that is active and trying to fight for our rights. We're vocal, we're active, we're doing the best we can, but it is a battle I'm afraid we will ultimately lose, unless there is some sweeping relief from the courts.

I do my best to have rational conversations with people and educate them, but it's quite an uphill battle. I'll keep fighting. It's all I can do.

I do my best to have rational conversations with people and educate them, but it's quite an uphill battle. I'll keep fighting. It's all I can do.

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You can move out of the slave state of New Jersey to a free state. You said it in your post: there are no 2A rights in the state; only exceptions to the law prohibiting possession and use. The courts will not save the right there. Get out if you really want the right to keep and bear arms.

Yeah, I've heard that a million times. Uprooting my kids, and both my wife and I leaving our jobs and extended families is certainly an option, just not a very palatable one. I'll stay and fight as best I can.

Almost all of my cousins, nephews and nieces are from NJ/NY. They all view the gun as a tool,not as a weapon of irresponsible destruction.

Perhaps it's because the majority of them are farmers. But mass stereotyping is certainly not cool. Washington State,Seattle could be joked to death. Latte and liberals and anti gun fools.

See the correlation Old Man? Not cool.

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It's not stereotyping, That's how people are born and raised here. It's brainwashed into you from the time you're little. I myself live in a very rural part of the state and still 4 out of 5 people act the way the Old Man described.

When you're taught that something is evil and bad from the time you're a kid and your parents are the same way most people here have little chance. When I first got my Utah CCW and could carry out of state my dad couldn't even believe that people area allowed to carry a gun anywhere "just because"...that's how most people here think/feel.

I'm a physics teacher and can always tell which kids are brainwashed at home when I use examples involving bullets, recoil, impulse of a gun and so on. They always give me that look with the head cocked to one side.

glennv said:

I'm a physics teacher and can always tell which kids are brainwashed at home when I use examples involving bullets, recoil, impulse of a gun and so on. They always give me that look with the head cocked to one side.

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I wish I had had you for physics in High school

My physics teacher told me of the days when they used to have a kid bring his .22 in to shoot a block of a known mass, measure the angle the block swung to in order to calculate the velocity of the bullet. Days long passed...

Hope everyone is getting on their reps regarding the upcoming vote. From what I understand, handgun ammo (including .22LR) will require a valid handgun purchase permit in addition to the FOID card under the new legislation...and they are going to be combining Motor Vehicle license issuances with your permit info embedded on it.

Been to the MVC lately?
applied for an FOID or handgun permit lately?

Interested in going through those two atrocities simultaneously?


Call, write, email...please, help out. This is about to go very downhill, very fast. I picked up an application for a handgun purchase permit Saturday and still haven't gotten any word on when my "appointment" with the investigations bureau will take place so I can pay $80 to go get fingerprinted (my FID card is more than 2 years old...so my prints are not longer valid for a handgun app!!), and then have another meeting once my references respond....and then wait a month for the permit....

tomrkba said:

You can move out of the slave state of New Jersey to a free state. You said it in your post: there are no 2A rights in the state; only exceptions to the law prohibiting possession and use. The courts will not save the right there. Get out if you really want the right to keep and bear arms.

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The problem with that is that when the liberals decide that the taxes are too high they come to a good southern state and ruin it.

The problem with that is that when the liberals decide that the taxes are too high they come to a good southern state and ruin it.

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Indeed! and it's not always a "good southern state" either.

There's always a balance to be struck; how much guns vs. any other equally/more important issues weigh on our life decisions, and how much pain we are willing to tolerate to live our lives the way we want. I've been told that NYC is a wonderful place if you fit the mould, but seems utterly untenable for a person like myself. Similarly, rural East Texas will not permit some people to live their lives they way they please, so they stay away (granted, their hurdles would be more logistical than legal, as they would be if I tried to exercise my rights in NYC)

There is also something to be said for making your fight, should you choose to deem it worthy of your valuable time, as effective as possible. Being the last remaining voice of resistance in a state/locale that has all but purged legal gun-use and utterly defamed their owners from every seat of authority is not the best use of your resources. It is a Quixotic battle with no purpose other than personal-gratification through defeat. Still, I can only think of three places so corrupted as to be irredeemable from within, and these are becoming more and more besieged and isolated from without by the rest of us every day.

There is nothing wrong with tolerating some tyranny if the alternative is a graver sacrifice elsewhere in the lives of our families. It's great to pretend to be Henry David Thoreau and sooner live free in a prison than enslaved on the streets, but that too, is something of a pointless sacrifice unless you have a nation's ear with your writings . If you wish to help the struggle from behind enemy lines, it makes more sense to do so by aiding organized external forces than by attempting to change things from within--the system was perverted to take the rights away; it will not permit their return by its own rules. That's what we have federal courts for.

TCB

The problem with that is that when the liberals decide that the taxes are too high they come to a good southern state and ruin it.

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It is inescapable socio-economic convection; the 'ol Chinese proverb that wealth never lasts four generations. It is what it is, and it's "our" job as freedom/industry* lovers to stay out in front of the wave as long as we are able.

1) Potential is discovered and exploited in an explosion of human industry
2) The potential is sealed away and protected from the exploitation of latecomers
3) Entrenched interests become preoccupied with maintaining their interests
4) The system corrodes until it is weak enough to be displaced/abandoned, and the potential kept sealed is rediscovered

*"Industry" as in the creative potential and force of mankind, not corporations