tokarev, makarov, or luger for new range gun?

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gibson_es

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im looking at 4 guns, but can only get one. need some help from those that have experiance with some or all of these guns.

m70a
m57
Romanian ttc
cz-82

i sold my only 9mm luger a couple years ago to help me purchase my first .45, and sense then i have not purchased another, and i have never owned anything chambered for 7.62x25 or 9x18 ( well, i had a nagant revolver that had a cylinder chambered for 7.62x25, but i never used it because i have grown partial to my hand and face)

i have always wanted something chambered in these two rounds, and would like to once again have a 9x19. but im at a bit of a cross roads, im basically just looking for something fun, but i always keep the idea of buying for self defense in my mind (for example, even as a range gun i would get some self defense rounds and a decent holster when possible) but chances if this purchase ever needed to be used for anything other then fun at the range is slim to none unless theres some SHTF scenario were im having to arm my whole family or something (and im not real big into the SHTF preperation thing, im only prepared for hurricane season and there's not a lot of guns needed to for that as a general rule of thumb)


the 9x19 a year ago would have been a great choice simply because of the price of the ammo and the ease of finding it. but right now it seems to be one of the harder rounds to acquire. 9x18 is a hair cheaper then the tok, and still a bit easier to find, but with both the mak, and the tok, im looking to purchase online so its not a huge difference for me as they both can still be found.

when it comes to surplus ammo, which i would like to get in the future when i have the cash for a large ammo purchase, im not finding much for any of them, i found one thing for the 7.62x25 for $500, and thats pretty much never gonna happen, if i purchase surplus its most likely going to be about $150 or less.

the 7.62x25 seems to have a bit more power behind it, but this would, i assume, also result in more recoil. and the cz might be a bit more dependable and accurate as far as the guns them selves go, its also a little more costly (not by alot though) and i have read on a few forums were people choose the m57 over the ttc because they believed the m57 supply would run out sooner. and i think i need to consider rarity and/or what will not be available in 6 months to a year. if the m57 is thought to disapear in the next year and the cz, ttc, and m70a are thought to be around for a while, i would feel silly not going with the m57, as an example. as i once wanted a polish radon 9x18 and found that every surplus site online had them, now they seem to be gone, done wanna miss out again. (although i dont think it be as much fun at the range as these 4 anyway, shorter barrel and smaller mag cap would be less accuracy and more mag loading)

And while I can't speek for tye others yet, I know the cz is very ambidextrous and as a lefty I like that
 
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While I dread choices mentioned I would go with Serbian TT chambered for the 9mm Luger cartridge. I would not pick 9x18 or 7,62 x 25 as those are no longer used by foreign militaries for front line duties and if inexpensive ammo from places like Russia becomes unavailable.......Guess you know were I'm "heading".....
 
I have an M57 Yugo Tokarev 7.62x25mm, a Zastava M70A Tokarev style 9x19mm, and a couple of CZ82's and I like them all.

The M57 is a hoot to shoot with the screaming Tokarev ammo, but the 7.62x25mm cartridges cost me about .45 each and I feel over-penetration would be a big concern anywhere but on a firing range. I never fired a Romanian TTC but I expect it would have to be very similar to the M57, albeit with one less round capacity and not as nice of an import safety installation.

The new production Tokarev style M70A in 9x19mm Luger is a nice shooting pistol with a slide mounted safety that effectively blocks the hammer from the firing pin. I got one because I liked the simplicity and ruggedness of the Tokarev design and wanted it in a caliber less expensive to shoot. The slim single stack frame fits my hand very well, and I consider the M70A to be a 'keeper'. That being said, there are other $300 modern pistols in 9x19mm with much higher capacity and more concealability for someone looking for a single handgun to consider.

The CZ82 in 9x18mm Makarov is one of my absolute favorites. It is easy to field strip (although a detail strip almost takes the patience of Job) and the polygonal rifling makes the barrel super easy to clean. The fit and function is first rate, and it is one of the most accurate shooting compact pistols I have fired. The recoil with the blowback design can be a bit snappy, but the Makarov round has slightly more power than a .380 ACP so it meets many folks' minimum carry requirements.

All things considered, especially current availability and price of ammunition and overall usability, of these four the CZ82 would easily be my own first choice if I was only going to get one pistol. I consider the CZ82 (especially shipped right to my front door as an 03FFL C&R purchase) firing 9x18mm Makarov ammo to be the best pistol 'bang for the buck' presently available.
 
I would also go with the CZ-82. I think you'll find it the most pleasant shooting, accurate, and reliable. Also the 9x18 round is still plentiful, and relatively inexpensive for the surplus stuff, Wolf, etc.
 
Thanks so far guys! I think I'm leaning towards the cz myself vut 9x19 is so cheap (when its available) its getting a look at too.
 
I have a Tokarev and a cz-82s. The cz-82 gets a lot more range time.

I like Tokarev-style pistols but the main disadvantage, IMO, are the sketchy safeties that are added on to meet import restrictions. Some are well-implemented, but many are not, and unless the safety is both reliable and ergonomic I would not consider one for defensive use.
 
While I dread choices mentioned I would go with Serbian TT chambered for the 9mm Luger cartridge. I would not pick 9x18 or 7,62 x 25 as those are no longer used by foreign militaries for front line duties and if inexpensive ammo from places like Russia becomes unavailable.......Guess you know were I'm "heading".....
Wrong there, Pablo. Both 9x18 Makarov and 7.62x25 Tokarev (PPU, Selliet & Bellot, Fiocchi, and several versions of commercial Russian) are as readily - and inexpensively - available as any ammunition. I've bought several hundred rounds of each in the past month.
 
You mention "a Makarov" and then ask about the CZ82. The Pistolet Makarova (built in Russia, Blugaria, East Germany, and China) is the only "Makarov pistol". There are other pistols (including the CZ82 and the P64) which are chambered for 9x18 Makarov ammunition, but they are not Makarov pistols.

I have 2 Bulgarian Makarovs, a Polish P64, a CZ82, and a Zastava M57 Tokarev. My Makarovs are far and away my favorites.
 
Cz 82

Buy a CZ 82 & You will not be sorry.I have an M 57 and it is just OK.The CZ 82 is dead on accurate and is also easy to handload. I would not trade my CZ for 2 M 57s. I carry my CZ and don't feel under gunned because of the accuracy and 12 round mag.I have a 9MM & a 45 ACP also to chose from and keep going back to that little 82.:banghead:
 
You wont regret the CZ-82. I've wanted to try the Tokarevs and the new M70A, but wouldn't trade the CZ for one. It will exceed your expectations.
 
Hurryin' hoosier,

At what point do i call the cz a mak by name of gun? I only use the name twice (once actually as the second time is just mak for short) and both times, the first being the title, its obvious im talking about the ammo, i also say Luger in the title but yet im not looking to buy "the" german luger. The second time i say mak you again can tell im referring to ammo because im talking about ease of purchase for the various types of ammo in question.

Please use context clues, thank you.
 
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I have a TOK, Romanian, and a CZ82. I like to shoot the Tok b/c it is slim and sits in my hand well. The recoil is not bad, However, My safety SUCKS! If it is flicked on the wrong way, a trip to the work bench is needed. Get the CZ82. Great fun and a good carry.
 
The above guns are what I call fun guns. I have a Polish Tok and two CZ-82's (and a CZ-70 and a Makarov, etc)

The CZ-82 being the most accurate and reliable. Probably best choice for all around use and sometimes I do use mine as a HD sidearm. I do prefer a more modern weapon like a 1911, day in and day out. :D
 
One thing you need to be careful with 7.62x25 ammo is some of it was for machine gun use in the PPSH-41. Too hot for pistol use.
 
Cz-52's are becoming plentiful and cheap on the private market. I love mine. it's a cryin shame the ammo's QUADRUPLED in price since the last wave of hysteria (or is it new import restrictions?). I have a hard time believing there aren't massive stores of 7.62x25 in Russia and former ComBloc countries that could make their owner's VERY happy if imported to the US. Same goes for .308 in NATO-friendlies... Anyway, the CZ-52 is a great design and can handle any of the varying pressures you might find in surplus ammo's. A unique piece of history...

CZ-82 is a phenomenal pistol for what it is. I can't believe something mass-produced for military/LE is so accurate (even with a so-so trigger). I sold mine only out of sheer necessity...
 
If you can't find 7.62x25, you can shoot 7.63mauser. When the Russians started the Tokarev, they took the Mauser round and changed it so minutely that it is basically the same round. The Mauser is what I'm shooting in ma Tok at this time.
 
CZ 82. CZ is still making this gun as the cz83, most offen seen in .380. Surplus cz82 are in the category of best bang for the buck. They are well made, reliable and accurate. A bonus is the really nice trigger. Bonus #2 is CZUSA still services this pistol and they are good to deal with. I tested various ammo in mine, it ran everything and was most accurate with the bargain basement Brown Bear Ammo.
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Con... Field strip on these is a piece of cake, but I wouldn't recommend going any further because they can be tricky to put back together.
 
I cannot believe their aren't more people on here telling you to get the Mak (A real one). The only thing that makes the CZ82 any better than the Mak is the white dot sights, other than that the Maks are hands down the best guns I have ever owned/shot! These things are crazy accurate, easily taken down to the 27 parts that make it up, and I am still getting 9x18 ammo for under $15 for a box of 50 (was paying $9.99 til Sandy Hook). I have my Russian Mak w/ adjustable sights that I carry, and I have put about 10,000 rounds thru in the last 2 years (I still wouldn't trade this for a new unfired anything), my Bulgarian fixed site Mak that has only had 16 rounds put thru it for testing, and I am in the market for one of the hard to find Stainless Steel 9x18 Maks. You can usually find these guns mildly used or NIB old stock at any gun show or on gunbroker.com for around $300
 
I cannot believe their aren't more people on here telling you to get the Mak (A real one). The only thing that makes the CZ82 any better than the Mak is the white dot sights, other than that the Maks are hands down the best guns I have ever owned/shot! These things are crazy accurate, easily taken down to the 27 parts that make it up, and I am still getting 9x18 ammo for under $15 for a box of 50 (was paying $9.99 til Sandy Hook). I have my Russian Mak w/ adjustable sights that I carry, and I have put about 10,000 rounds thru in the last 2 years (I still wouldn't trade this for a new unfired anything), my Bulgarian fixed site Mak that has only had 16 rounds put thru it for testing, and I am in the market for one of the hard to find Stainless Steel 9x18 Maks. You can usually find these guns mildly used or NIB old stock at any gun show or on gunbroker.com for around $300
I have owned and shot two Russian Makarov pistols and three Glocks. I can tell you the Glock is head & shoulders above PM in every department. Ok the G29 is fatter and harder to hide but slug fired from it has more energy at 200 yards then 9x18 at the muzzle. Hope that helps.
 
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It must be a personal thing, but the CZ is way more comfortable in my hand than a Mak.
The problem with CZ82/83 is that when you put up with something that thick it might as well have more punch at the bullets tip.
 
The problem with CZ82/83 is that when you put up with something that thick it might as well have more punch at the bullets tip.

I must agree with this. Its good for a range gun (which is actually what the thread is about), but for carry purposes the CZ-82 is just plain thick. A Glock 19 is nearly a quarter inch thinner, holds more, and packs a lot more power.

Anyways, back to the OP's actual question - of the guns you listed I have the M57 and the CZ-82. Just personally, out of all of them I'd go for the M70 in 9mm. Everyone should have at least one 9mm Luger just due to the ammo costs. 9mm Mak isn't quite as cheap as it used to be (usually I'm seeing it for more than 9mm Luger commercially) plus most of the ammo that actually is cheap is all steel cased which means no reloading. Buy reloadable brass 9mm Mak ammo and its way above 9mm Luger plus the component bullets cost more too.
 
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