Question about Montana Gold Bullets

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gibekim

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I loaded up a few hundred 142 gr TC in 38 special and fired them in both a S&W 67-1 4" and a 686+ 6". I loaded with HP-38, 4.4 grains. COL 1.440. All rounds fired very well, nice recoil and accurate. When cleaning both revolvers I noticed gold (yellow) stripes down the length of the barrels on both sides of all the lands. Looks like a grey and yellow peppermint stick. After the normal amount of cleaning with patches and bore brushes, the stripes remained.
I tried some more aggressive cleaners (shooters choice, clp breakfree) with limited success. I then used Butches Bore shine to see if it was copper fouling. The patch came out pink and not blue which indicates no copper fouling. Before I go and use JB bore compound or Flits, I figured I would post here and see what, if any, other reloaders experiences with these bullets may be. I should also note that I have reloaded and fired .358 dia. cast bullets (Missouri and Oregon Trail) through both of these guns with no lead fouling at all.

I would greatly appreciate any feedback from any my fellow reloaders.
Thanks and keep the faith.
 
Jacket fouling is normal. Don't worry about it. I use a lot of 125 gr Montana Gold in .357. I haven't found a better bullet for the price.
 
Foaming bore cleaner has always worked awesome for me when it comes to cleaning out copper fouling. Just remember that it's not recommended to be used in firearms with a gas system, like ARs, Garands, etc. It works great in pistols.
 
That's not copper, Montana Gold appears to be brass jacketed. I too have this bright yellow fouling that does not come off the rifling during cleaning.
 
I have shot at least a few thousand of them mainly outta 2 guns and never worried about trying to clean the fouling out. Never say a reason.
 
Thanks for the quick replies (IMtheNRA Coltpythonelite). Glad to see that I am not alone with this. Yes I figured that it was brass from the jacketing. I'm anal when it comes to cleaning my firearms so I (we) need to find an easy was to remove the deposits. I loaded up some copper FMJ's yesterday and will run them through tomorrow after work. Will post the results if any.
 
The foaming bore cleaner works best after you remove powder fouling first.

Have no experience with MG bullets but everything else it has cleaned up great
 
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I chambered a 1903 Turk Mauser in 45acp by using a .469" straight fluted reamer and a 45acp throater. That is benchrest tight.

THe best groups at 100 yards are with 230 gr Montana Gold FMJ, enough pistol powder to exceed 460 Rowland loads, 45acp brass, and large rifle primers.

The Shilen Chrome Moly bull barrel [not lapped] gets some Copper fouling, er brass or what ever MG uses for jackets.
That opens the group size.
I clean out Copper every 20 rounds or so.

Copper fouling happens much faster at high velocities.

I would imagine it would take a lot of shooting and a very good pistol shooter to see a difference that Montana Gold Copper fouling makes on accuracy in a handgun with 45acp loadings.
 
some updated information

I fired the 130 gr Zero FMJ's through both revolvers (50 rounds each). No luck in fire cleaning the gold stripes. Sent off an email to MGB and asked 2 questions.
What is the fouling and how to remove it
Asked for recommended bullet velocity for the 142 grain bullet

Received an answer rather promptly although somewhat vague. They referred to the fouling as "guilding" and did not give any direction on removing it.

They recommended minimum muzzle velocity of 850 fps and suggested I refer to sierras' loading data for their 140 gr jhp bullet.

I'm not sure but this may be approaching +P pressures. The recommended powder load by sierra for 800 fps is higher than the recommended 'max' load in some other manuals.

Any input?
 
The only thing I'd note is that I heard an interview with a member of the US Army marksmanship team in which he said that, after testing, they determined that their long-range rifles shot better with copper fouling in the bore. The metal fouling (as opposed to the powder/carbon) filled in the imperfections in the barrel.

In a similar vein, Brian Enos, one of the real yogis of competitive action pistol shooting, has written that he has NEVER cleaned the fouling from the bore of his competition guns. He thinks it does affirmative harm, and questions why anyone would even try.

Now, those guys could be wrong. But if they're right, you could quit worrying about it entirely.
 
Makes some sense

ATLDave your reply certainly makes sense. If the fouling fills the imperfections in the bore (broach chatter) then the bore will be more uniform.
Thanks for the input.
I am, however, concerned that the presence of fouling my be an indication that the loads may be either too fast or too slow. With "too slow" being the more undesirable of the two.
 
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