45 Colt or 45ACP for a woods gun

mbopp, when you said that you shoot +p's in your k-frame,do you mean 38+p? I never heard of 357+p loads. Do you load the 357's heavy? That would not be a +p load. Please tell me what a 357+p load is . Thanks

With bear and moose involved, the 45 Colt, hands down. Way more potential for power and penetration with hot loads.

I have a 625 and 629 which I do carry in the woods once in a while but since I don't have anything meaner than feral hogs or the occasional mountain lion my Kimber Warrior has done just fine for many years. She has a little wear no but she is still going strong. A lot of pigs have been made nice by this old girl.

Then you're not talking .45 ACP.

What you're talking is at LEAST .45 Colt with loads somewhat hotter than standard.

A Moose is a HUGE animal!
A Bear is a HUGE animal!

The .45 ACP was designed for military use...it is NOT suitable for use against truly large predators.

The .45 Colt is "better" but the IDEAL round for use against large animals should be the heaviest bullet over the stoutest powder charger!

You have to decide which platform you'd rather be carrying. The .45 Colt in a Blackhawk is some good big bore medicine, and I'd have to say the .45 Colt is probably my favorite cartridge. I can run 330gr WFN hardcasts to over 1,300 fps from my 5.5" Bisley Blackhawk, which will punch a hole through pretty much any living thing on the earth, it's a wonderfully versatile cartridge and the added bonus of the .45 ACP/SUPER cylinder only makes it more awesome.

But if you're after something lighter weight with faster reloads, the .45 ACP isn't completely worthless. There are 250gr hardcasts available for the .45 ACP (Buffalo Bore and Underwood) and I personally have shot them up to around 1,000 fps from a 5" .45 ACP and that alone would work. A better option is the .45 Super, same size as ACP but higher pressure, so it can go faster. Even boutique .45 Super ammo isn't load to the max, with max being essentially identical to the 460 Rowland (800-1000+) ft-lbs with 250gr+ bullets, but with the advantage of being able to safely shoot .45 ACP in the same setup.

I love my Blackhawk, but moose have been shot dead by a single .40 (which I love BTW), so I don't think a heavy hardcast .45 is going to be ineffective against a moose or black bear, not even a little. The best choice? Well no, but if you want to go that route, no handgun is really the best choice for anything is it? But too many underestimate how efficient a big bore (.400"+) hardcast from a handgun can be for killing some pretty large critters. For me it would be the .45 Super loaded right, out of my G21 w/KKM comped barrel shooting wide meplat 255-280gr hardcasts, just because it's a good bit lighter than my Bisley and holds more ammo and reloads almost infinitely quicker.

But for the price? A Blackhawk .45 Colt can't be beat, it's even better if you get the convertible model.

45 colt for versatility...buffalo bore or DT heavy...cowboy loads light.

Recently I bought a .45acp/.45C Blackhawk convertible for deer hunting and woods gun.

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I like this option. As it gives you a lot of options. .45 ACP in standard or "hot" loadings. Also, .45 Colt in mild all the way up to .44 Mag levels.

All in a gun that's relatively inexpensive and easy to shoot.

I've had one of these with a 4-5/8" barrel for nearly 20 years, and it's probably still my favorite revolver.

45 Colt

Woods /trail defense a 45acp will fineand with +P or super or smc would do even better. I to would carry a double stack poly pistol. Just a weight and capacity thing. 255gr hard cast would get a moose's attention. Grizzle bear ?? Carry a can of bear spray for each person too. Have a glock 21 or 41 ?? How about a 9" barrel your glock !! ?? hehehe
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HccnkSg49CI

bannockburn said:

Like huntsman more often than not I found on my hikes the most dangerous threat of the animal kind were large packs of feral dogs. I went from carrying a .22 Beretta Model 70S to a .38 Special 3" barrel J frame before finally settling on a Ruger SR9c as my backwoods companion.

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I used to cruise timber in eastern NC from the mid 60s to the 90s. I was always running into cottonmouths, timber rattlers and wild dogs, not to mention ground bees, hornets and wasps which are very hard to shoot with any gun!. I carried a Smith M60 .38 spc. with the first round up a shot cartridge, the next four 158 JHPs. I have now switched to a SP101 .357 for my woods walks.

The .45 long colt and the .45 ACP are about the same power range when using 230g bullets. There are more SD rounds to choose from in the .45ACP. Also, the .45 ACP has the advantage of being able to have more rounds available faster. SO, for me I would pick .45ACP in a Glock with a couple of spare mags.

Moose attack and injure more folks than bears (black an brown combined) in Alaska:

http://www.animalplanet.com/animal-facts/dangerous-moose.htm

45 colt in a Blackhawk will provide all the protection you will need with a heavy load. With a heavy Buffalo Bore load you could even those creatures.

But... a 1911 with a heavy load from Buffalo Bore would work (My Kimber would do a fine job protecting me). I would go with hard cast 255 gr loaded to the gills.

My ideal "woods/ranch" revolver is this 625-6 S&W "Mountain Gun".
Lightweight, powerful, no MIM, FO front sight. It has taken a number of hogs; at ranges under 50 yds. it's terminal performance (with 255 gr. KTSWCGC @ 1100 FPS and proper bullet placement) is on par with a .30/06 rifle.
One shot, DRT.

It really depends on if you want a revolver or a bottom feeder I think.

45 acp and standard powered 45LC are neck and neck. The army trials for the 1911 stipulated a load similar to the 45LC if I remember correctly.

If you handload, one would assume the 45LC to be the better round since you can really hot rod it some. But with a few simple and inexpensive changes you can run 45 Super in a quality built 45 ACP gun (including 1911's and Glocks). Factory ammo in both of the hotter power levels are readily available from a few boutique places (Buffalo Bore, Underwood .et al)

I actually just checked underwood's site, they list a bullet with the same weight within about 50fps of each other in 45LC and 45 Super so I consider power factors a wash. Considering any changes you make to a 1911 or similar pistol to run 45 Super is easily converted back to run standard (or even powederpuff wadcutter loads in the same barrel none the less)

I was recently pondering on either a Colt 1911 Delta elite, glock 20 or S&W M57 (10mm, 10mm, 41 Magnum respectively) almost the exact same conundrum.

I ended up with a M29

Glock 21 or fn45, 2 legged bad people worry me more than the animals!

I don't know guys. I like my .45Colt too, for hunting.

It would be used for protection from Moose, cougar, elk, bear and 2 legged bad people.
Looking or something for a woods gun not a hunting gun /QUOTE]
I'm gonna jump ship on this one and go with my own definition of a defensive gun. In this situation the gun won't be needed at all unless under terrible circumstances.
A slim easily packed auto with a couple spare mags is my vote. In true defensive use, the higher cap, quicker reloaded, added firepower of an auto gets my nod...esp if it is your ccw. In which case you should be well practiced with the piece anyway.
My choice for self defensive(1911) is different from my deer hunting revolver.(RBH .45colt)

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Given the job(s) at hand that you describe, I'll opt for the 45 Colt. Running it through a Blackhawk, I can push one of these 325 grain cast bullets as fast as 1300 ft/sec with a max load of H-110 powder. My most accurate load is with 13 grains of HS-6 powder with a muzzle velocity of 1100fps. 325 grains at 1100fps will leave a mark on whatever you hit, so long as you do your part and hit it in the right spot.



Here is a summary of the performance/penetration numbers of this bullet fired into rubber mulch. (The lower left bullet is a 357 mag 158 grain SJHP @1250fps which penetrated about 16 inches in the same media and expanded to just a little bit greater diameter than the 45 starts out...pretty anemic performance compared to the 45 Colt) For what you describe as your needs, I'd opt for the solid Flat nose at 1100 ft/sec.

That 625-1 will handle that Buffalo Bore load? I've always been told the 625 or mod 25 should not be pushed over standard factory. If it will that would be great news. I read a test on the 3 inch 625 and even hardball leaves it barely at 700 fps.

Clark Custom Guns rechambers 625's to .460 Roland. Way way ahead of .45 Supers.

They told me my 625-1 would take .45 Supers all day long, and sure enough, it does!

Since my 625 is a 3 incher I chroned it and 230 gr. .45 Supers get 1000 fps. Kicks a mite to.

It would be interesting to turn it into a .460 and then REALLY have a woods gun.

But...



I already have that covered.

Deaf

I carry .45 Colt -- I have a Colt New Service and load it to about 1,000 fps with a 255 grain cast bullet. Alternatively, I carry my Ruger Blackhawk with the same load.

Deaf Smith said:

Clark Custom Guns rechambers 625's to .460 Roland. Way way ahead of .45 Supers.

They told me my 625-1 would take .45 Supers all day long, and sure enough, it does!

Since my 625 is a 3 incher I chroned it and 230 gr. .45 Supers get 1000 fps. Kicks a mite to.

It would be interesting to turn it into a .460 and then REALLY have a woods gun.

But...

I already have that covered.

Deaf

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That ka-thump sound you just heard was me swooning. Gun porn! I likes gun porn.

You could always go with and instead of or, I can pocket carry my CW45 and put my Bisley Blackhawk in a belt holster.

I'd be real nervous about rechambering an N-frame to the .460. Sounds like at least 10,000psi too much to me.

I have a Marlin 1894 in .45 Colt.
I mentioned I wanted to get a Blackhawk in .45 Colt
to my shooting buddy. He ended up getting one with a 5 1/2" Bbl.

Underwood Ammo makes some "+P" for Blackhawk or Contender
or the Marlin only

I have the S&W 625 which fires the .45 ACP w/full moon cllips
or .45 Auto Rim - some ammo makkers offer some heavy loads which
get close to the .45 Colt +P loads

R-