AR 15 open sights?

http://www.brownells.com/rifle-part...ar-15-m16-cqb-notch-peep-sight-prod25128.aspx here ya go

Similar thing:
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/917708/xs-csat-combat-rear-sight-aperture-ar-15-a2-matte

...and here I thought I'd looked at everything Brownell's offered!

Thanks!...for the right question and the answer!

That's why this is truly the best site around.

Mark

I still have to wonder why though?

A notch rear sight simply won't work as well as the standard AR-15 aperture sight when it is located 2" in front of your eyeball on an AR-15 receiver.

Don't think so?
Hold any handgun 2" in front of your eye and look at the sights.
See clearly now?

No, you don't!!!

rc

I run ARMS rear sights on my AR rifles and they have a notch above the aperture. It is simply for very close range. You must elevate the muzzle to get the post into the notch. At close range, the sight height is enough over bore centerline to cause misses by several inches if using the aperture.

The first sight linked appears to be the same principle, but needs to be flipped down from the aperture to the notch. The second one seems to be similar to the ARMS in that the notch is above the 100-300 aperture.

Well, at first, I looked at the linked sight and it wasn't what I was used to. CQB? What kind of marketing nonsense is that, wait, maybe not.

Close Quarters Battle is a known problem area for targeting with the M16 - the sight line is offset pretty high off the barrel axis and there is a corresponding offset in the point of impact at close range. It's the singular subject of some combat carbine courses specifically held for LEO/Mil who encounter it. Training costs money.

But, all it takes is a flip down sight to adjust the sight line and point of impact to correct it. If that seems to be a bit much, still, lets not forget the flip up/down rear sight on the M16 is exactly for that - one is for 0-200, the other for 200-800. The aperature size is different in the close sight for better vision, especially in low light, the long range is smaller to gain accuracy.

If the target is less than 50 meters and moving, an open top rear sight would be even better, especially set up to correct the high sight plane offset of the M16. Nice to have.

Some day we'll get a pushbutton 2x power on a red dot and enjoy a similar convenience.

Tirod said:

Close Quarters Battle is a known problem area for targeting with the M16 - the sight line is offset pretty high off the barrel axis and there is a corresponding offset in the point of impact at close range.

Click to expand...

That's exactly the reason XS gave me for developing the sight when I talked to them at SHOT a couple years ago.

If you'll notice, the notch is on the smaller aperture, so you don't have to take the time to flip it, if a target suddenly presents itself at close range.

I've never tried it (or needed it, for that matter), so I don't know how useful it actually is.

My dept. has all our M4s fit with the XS sight. It will keep the point of impact within 2 inches high or low from 5 yards (low) to 15 yards (high). It is also pretty quick to use once you get used to it. The concept isn't that you use it to make every room length shot. Shooting at a full body profile is quick and easy so just point shoot with the front sight. The idea is to use it when you need something more accurate than point shooting but quicker than the small aperture.

Still I'm not a big fan because with proper training (far more than a police dept can provide all its officers) you just learn how to aim high at close distances, instinctively, and still have your bullet impact with the same accuracy. Using the large aperture of course. Plus that large cut for the notch makes it more difficult to center your post for longer shooting when using the small aperture. It makes the circle look like an oval when you focus your vision on the post. Even after using it quite a bit I still found myself doubting my point of aim and doing a quick double check.

So while it does work and is the poor mans solution to mechanical offset, I found I prefer to just use the large aperture sight for all shots 50 yards and under. Then for over 50 yards the only thing it does is ruin your small aperture.

Thanks for the real-life POV, NWcityguy. That's good info.

I would tend to agree with NWcityguy2, if the sight had the notch and small aperture visible at the same time. The sights I run do not, but I can easily envision the problem he describes.

As far as training to aim high at close range, that would be the preferred method, but most individuals and many police departments simply don't have the budget to allow for proper training. Heck, I spent a few years in the military and had to change commands to find out how poorly trained I actually had been.

some guys still like the advantage of the open sight vs peep. look what they used to do with the m1 carbine.they put an open sight in the front hand guard