TINFOIL HAT ALERT!!! My first conspiracy theory posting...

seeker_two · May 9, 2004

This whole "terrorist torture" issue got me thinking more about the photos taken. Listening to "The Everett Newton Show" (KLLI 105.3FM, Dallas TX) solidified some of my suspicions.

Follow along, if you will.......

What if the photos taken of the abused Iraqi prisoners weren't photos of abused Iraqi prisoners at all?

What if the "prisoners" were actors (remember, no faces were ever shown) who posed for these pics as part of an interrogation tactic?

Situation: An insurgent from [name your favorite terrorist country here] is detained at the prison. In the interrogation room, the CIA interrogator shows [name your favorite terrorist name] the photos & "infers" that the same (or worse) could happen to him if he doesn't cooperate. Other psychological pressures are also brought to bear, but no physical torture is ever done. [Name your favorite terrorist name] breaks & spills the hummus to the interrogator...

Somehow, the photos get leaked out to where everyone in the world [and every terrorist organization we're fighting] can see them. All heck breaks loose. The military & SECDEF have to make a decision: do we lose a valuable interrogation & intimidation tool--thereby losing a psychological advantage--or do we make it look like we're the baddest mo-fo's on the block who can do nasty things to people who attack us? So the order goes out to "play up" the authenticity & send the terrorists a message....

Now, I'm not saying prisoner abuse didn't happen. We have testimony proving that (maybe). But I just wonder if the photos were "real" in the first place.... :scrutiny:

Discuss.....

longrifleman · May 9, 2004

10 gallon TEXAS tinfoil hat.

glocksman · May 9, 2004

I recommend Reynolds Wrap.
It works better for blocking out the Mind Control Raysâ„¢ than the thinner generic foils. :neener:

Zedicus · May 9, 2004

seeker_two I think you may be on to something...

Intresting theory, and quite plauseable.

Personaly i'm more or less certan that the photos are phony, they simply don't look real, and there are other more technical reasons that i won't bore everyone with.

I do Photo Editing & Manipulation as a minor hobby & spotting fakes comes with the territory, & those have about a 2% chance of actualy being real if you ask me.

WilderBill · May 9, 2004

My gut feeling is that someone got bored and decided to have a little fun with the prisoners.
However, given the capabilities of Photoshop, you are right in never automaticly believing any picture, anywhere ever.

Even if everything they claim is true, it's still better treatment than Saddam and Co. were dishing out.

Kamicosmos · May 9, 2004

Do you really think that someone who is willing to strap explosives onto him self and blow himself up, OR someone willing to engage the US military in a one vs many situation would really be intimidated by participaing in a naked pyramid?

Unless there is more 'horrific' abuse photos I haven't seen, I don't get it. I don't see how humiliating some prisioners=torture and abuse.

I don't think it should be done, and the soldiers need to be reprimanded, and perhaps even court martialed. But it's not torture and abuse.

And Rumsfield in hot water, possibly his job in question? Over THAT? :barf:

glocksman · May 9, 2004

Intresting theory, and quite plauseable.

Plausable?

That a bunch of reservists would willingly let themselves be publically humiliated in the media and face charges that could land them in prison for a long time in order to 'send a message' to the rest of the world? :scrutiny:

45R · May 9, 2004

Tin Foil Glasses on!!!

Art Eatman · May 9, 2004

Today's WND has links to a story about phony photos. WND made this claim on May 4th, naming the porno websites from which SOME of the photos came.

Does anybody think that those who would create ill will against us are stupid? That they can't use PhotoShop in a prototypical "disinformation" campaign?

Always remember there is a double standard: Any mistake any low-echelon doofus makes is due solely to evil intent of our government. Everything we try to do is wrong, because some rich guy could benefit. Anything done by an enemy is alright because of past foreign policy decisions.

The actions of a stupid few in prisons in Iraq is alleged to be worse than the institutionalized physically damaging torture done in Iran, Syria, Pakistan and most all other thugocracies...

Art

Justin · May 9, 2004

Personaly i'm more or less certan that the photos are phony, they simply don't look real, and there are other more technical reasons that i won't bore everyone with.

No, please, bore me.

Zedicus · May 9, 2004

Well, here are a couple of the more easy to explain points.

pay particular attention to the person in many of the photos giving the "thumbs up".

The edges around him have minor, almost un noticeable signs of having been pasted in, also the exposure of the "thumbs up" person and the rest of the photos differs to a noticeable degree.
Also, the Noise in the Photos is not Random, it is Uniform & as if it was added on purpose.

Another is that many of the photos simply try to show to much going on, in actual photos of most things having everything showing is Unheard of, and is even rare in many staged photos.
The same principle also applies to video.

Much of it is down to Psychology.

glocksman · May 9, 2004

Some of the photos may be fake, but that doesn't explain why the reservists are being charged and the testimony that exists about the torture.

I don't buy the conspiracy theory for a second.

But if it was a conspiracy, is it the Masons, the Illuminati, or the World Jewish Conspiracy that's behind it? :neener:

Zundfolge · May 9, 2004

I do Photo Editing & Manipulation as a minor hobby & spotting fakes comes with the territory, & those have about a 2% chance of actualy being real if you ask me.

I'm a professional graphic designer and I'd put myself in the top 10% of Photoshop users ... I never 100% believe any photo I didn't take myself.

Thing is, even if the photos are not digitaly manipulated, that still doesn't prove that those men are actually Iraqis ... the whole thing could have been shot in a sound stage in Hollywood (maybe they used the same soundstage they faked the moon landing :neener:

)

Cal4D4 · May 9, 2004

The command people seem to be taking these pretty seriously. I think if they could yell "fake" they would have. The various investigations were announced 4 months ago and one is already coming up for courtmartial.

NavajoNPaleFace · May 9, 2004

There are two sides to my thinking here.

1. Why hasn't more than one GI been named?

Here in Arizona I've only heard of the girl's name but no other.

Are there more? If so why haven't they been publicly identified as well?

2. If the pics were fake and government officials and news media were head hunting and I was being falsely charged I can guarantee you I'd be shouting loud enough for the entire west coast to hear me.

Also, whether you believe it to be true or not remember past instances where the government and military have fed the public do do and most all bought it.

Heck, slick Willy never had relations with that woman!

It wouldn't be the first time the Democrats and media stirred up erroneous chit just before election time based solely on false reporting by 'others'.

Who knows...this prisoner of war abuse thing might be true....it might not be.

I'd like to know who is doing the reporting and what investigations have truthfully and TOTALLY revealled so far.

Art Eatman · May 9, 2004

Today's New York Times has an excellent article on the whole prison mess. It is far more of an objective relating of the facts and timelines than one might expect, with relatively few emotionally-laden words or personal slant.

I'll try to get back later with the URL.

Edit:
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/05/09/international/middleeast/09PRIS.html?th

Art

ctdonath · May 9, 2004

Occam's Razor: "Of two competing theories or explanations, all other things being equal, the simpler one is to be preferred."

Could the pictures be faked? Yes.

But what's so hard to believe about some bored/stressed troops having some somewhat sadistic fun messing with people already identified as enemies (anyone recall what that word means?) and taking/sharing some pictures thereof? Humans, regardless of which side they're on, are notorious for being cruel to captured enemies. Digital cameras make it really easy to snap pictures and share them.

If the pictures were faked, why are they so tame? Considering the history of prisoner abuse in the last few thousand years, I'd expect faked pictures would show far more horrific acts. If you're gonna fake such picture, why limit to human pyramids, urination, and mundane beatings?

Too many people see conspiracies where human nature and statistics provide examples with predictable frequency.

Cal4D4 · May 9, 2004

Humbug! Registration req'd. FWIW I think half a dozen were named so far, the 5 mo pregnant clerk is getting most of the press. Didn't that 2 star lady Gen'l running the show get pulled from her post over this also?

TINFOIL HAT ALERT!!! My first conspiracy theory posting...

seeker_two

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longrifleman

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glocksman

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Zedicus

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Kamicosmos

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glocksman

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45R

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glocksman

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ctdonath

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