1911 45ACP Headspace Gauge

[1911Tuner]

Pictures

Very nice, Cap'n...but all it means is that the chamber shoulder to hood face length is in-spec. Dominic's barrel will look just like that and go to battery on a .920 NO GO in several different slides that I've got here...which means that the gun is unserviceable until the excessive headspace condition is corrected.

By insisting that your pictures are proof of the correct method for checking headspace is leading the readers to believe that a pistol is good to go when it's entirely possible that a dangerous headspace condition can exist.

Standing offer...Anybody who wants to come and see it, let me know and we'll arrange a visit.

Dave...Carry on!

 

[Old Fuff]

As “One of Many†put it previously, “The photos are worthless for the purpose intended.†The issue is not, in and of itself, chamber length, but rather if there is any additional space between the breech face and cartridge head when the pistol is in battery. This can only be determined with a
no-go gage, which apparently Mr. Sample either doesn’t have, or if he does he doesn’t understand how to use it.

In a 1911 pattern pistol, headspace by definition is the distance from the shoulder in the front of the chamber to the breech face – not to the end of the barrel tang. In those few cartridges that are bottlenecked headspace is measured from the shoulder to the breech face. For purposes of demonstration the hood could be completely removed and headspace still measured by employing a set of go and no-go gages. This simple fact is well known to anyone with any real knowledge of the pistol and how it works, and it is almost inconceivable to this writer that anyone who build such handguns and/or teaches others how to do it, would be so ill informed and that such basic (and critically important) knowledge would be so completely misunderstood.

Throughout this thread several individuals with experience – sometimes with considerable experience – have come forward to offer words of support for our moderators explanations concerning headspace. None have backed Mr. Sample’s contentions. No reputable authorities on the subject that I know endorse Mr. Sample’s professed theory, either in posts or in publications covering the subject. A reader can make their own judgment as to what is right or wrong, but a mistake could result in both a damaged gun and an injured user.

 

[Dave Sample]

Showing a chamber check on a $225.00 Chinese 1911 caused all this long winded nonsense. My My, how "Dangerous" can we get? It told me what I needed to know and it still shoot bullets, not gauges. These two experts could not recognize the picture of the Go Gauge that I put up. You people who believe the silly stuff that your two resident experts put out have my deepest sympathy. It is now one of two factory 1911's that I own. It runs 100% after a few tweaks which I don't dare tell you about because my ways are much too dangerous and you might blow yourself up. ROTF:LMAO! Beam me up Scotty!

 

[KMKeller]

"Dangerous" can often be defined by a cavalier attitude.

 

[1911Tuner]

Winded

Fuff...Jim...I give up. We can't teach him nothin'.

 

[R.H. Lee]

Fuff and Tuner, you guys aren't real Pistolsmiths (tm), so you still need gauges.

 

[gamachinist]

Somewhere I was taught or read to use the cartridge in the chamber test was a test for an over/underlength case or bullet seated too far out,making an over max length cartridge.
Using a headspace gauge in the barrel only is only to check for proper chamber depth.
Taking this a bit further,(in case I missed it during one of the times my eyes crossed reading this thread ),
a slide/barrel combination could check correct on a headspace gauge and still be wrong,if the chamber was short,and the lugs were out of spec allowing the barrel to go too far forward in the slide.

So,to sum up,
Use headspace gauges:
to check the overall headspace,and to check for proper chamber depth on a 1911 style gun.

We need a "beating a dead horse " animated smilie here I think!
Robert.

 

[1911Tuner]

Re: Stuff

Nope gamachinist...Your chamber can check dead on the money still show excessive headspace when the slide goes to battery. I've got a 1991-A1 Officer's Model on the bench right now that has a chamber that's actually a little short, according to Dave's Cartridge Test...and it'll go to battery on a NO GO with a bit of effort. I've had a time with this one, and I've probably got it runnin'...but now I have to inform the owner that I advise against firing it. One of the standing rules in the shop that I used to work for was that
headspace was the first thing to be checked...and if it didn't fall within specs, no work was to be performed unless and until the owner agreed to have it corrected. No exceptions.

As far as beating a dead horse...you're probably right...but I can't, in good conscience, let this one die because excessive headspace on ANY firearm
has the potential to bring about disaster...even a .22 rimfire.

Once more...Come see it for yourself. Georgia ain't that far away.
************
Riley! I surely am not a pistolsmith...I'm an armorer.

 

[Bill Z]

We need a "beating a dead horse " animated smilie here I think!

I'm particularly fond of this one, I think it's appropriate and what the machinest ordered.

Thsi one might be good too, you think?

 

[1911Tuner]

Similies

ROFL Bill! As you wish...but it'll come up again. No axe to grind here. My purpose is to provide correct information, especially when incorrect information could result in injury.

Closed...for the time being.

 

[P95Carry]

Bill - you got in first LOL ... nice one.

I was gonna make this offering .....

 

[1911Tuner]

Horsin' Around

Awwwww....Ya'll gimme a break! I didn't pick this fight!