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1911 without grip safety

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by Chevelle SS, Jun 16, 2012.

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  1. Chevelle SS

    Chevelle SS Member

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    I was curious if there ever was a 1911 produced without a grip safety.
     
  2. exiledtoIA

    exiledtoIA Member

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    IIRC the original 1911 didn't have a grip safety. It was added at the US Army's request and with a few other changes resulted in the 1911A1.
     
  3. R.W.Dale

    R.W.Dale Member

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    All the Spanish star pistols patterned on the 1911 are sans grip safety as is the Argentine ballister molina
     
  4. markallen

    markallen Member

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    The Detonics Combat Master.
     
  5. Auto426

    Auto426 Member

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    The original prototypes for the 1911, such as the 1910, lacked the thumb safety, not the grip safety. The thumb safety was added at the request of the U.S. calvery, as they desired a way to make the pistol safe with one hand while riding on horseback.

    As for the OP, if you so desire you can have the grip safety pinned, which is nearly the same thing as not having one at all. I believe Novak or one of the other large shops has also come up with a solution or two that gets rid of the grip safety.
     
  6. sgb

    sgb Member

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  7. 1911Tuner

    1911Tuner Moderator Emeritus

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    The grip safety was in place in 1905 as an add-on, and incorporated into the design in 1907...present on the 1909 Models, and retained on the 1911 prototypes produced in 1910...only eight of which were made. Six of the original eight were retrofitted with the thumb safety on request of the US Cavalry and resubmitted for evaluation...and the rest is history.

    Pictured below is one of two unaltered 1910 Colts in existence.

    Photo courtesy of Charles W. Clawson.

    [​IMG]
     
  8. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

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    There are pistols without grip safeties. There are even Colts without grip safeties. But they are not 1911s. "1911" is a particuar gun with specifications and parts laid out by the US Army, not a catch-all term for anything that looks kinda-sorta like a real US Army issue.
     
  9. Kleanbore

    Kleanbore Moderator

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    ^^^^

    Yep.
     
  10. S.B.

    S.B. Member

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    exiledtoIA, sorry but, you are incorrect about the original 1911s. John Moses Browning designed all 1911s with a grip safety.
    Steve
     
  11. kcshooter

    kcshooter Member

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    The grip safety can also be easily deactivated if desired, without needing pinned and without seeking a gunsmith.
     
  12. Chevelle SS

    Chevelle SS Member

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    Thanks for all the info. BTW that 1910 Colt is really cool.
     
  13. orionengnr

    orionengnr Member

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    JMHO...

    Since the advent of the "speed bump", I'm not sure what purpose the pinned grip safety or the one piece "always on" grip "safety"/MSH serves.

    I somewhat regularly find my carry 1911 has somehow disengaged its thumb safety (this has occurred for a number of years with a number of 1911s, so it is not a mechanical issue with one 1911).

    This is not a major concern as I still have two active safety devices (the grip safety and my index finger's position) between me and disaster.

    If we remove the grip safety from the equation, I am down to the safety between my ears...and although my ego tells me that is sufficient, I would prefer to retain at least one mechanical safety as well. Call me crazy, or perhaps, older and wiser. :)
     
  14. kcshooter

    kcshooter Member

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    I don't see why that is such a concern.
    I own multiple guns that don't have any safety at all, thumb or grip.
    Darn things just don't go off until the trigger is pulled.
    Odd, that.
     
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2012
  15. eddielewis

    eddielewis Member

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    Do they have cocked hammers and 3 lb triggers also?
     
  16. HDCamel

    HDCamel Member

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    There's still the half-cock in the event of hammer hook failure and possibly a Series 80 firing pin safety depending on the model.
     
  17. Skylerbone

    Skylerbone Member

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    One very well thought of pistolsmith made note that his personal 1911 has the grip safety deactivated and an intact Series 80 safety meaning the pistol must still have the GS depressed in order for it to fire.

    I suppose by strict definition I own no 1911s, just Commercial models and variants as none were ever Government Property.
     
  18. 1911Tuner

    1911Tuner Moderator Emeritus

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    I think you're confusing the Series 80 system (Colt) with the Swartz system. (Kimber, etal)

    For the IMHO segment...

    Removing or deactivating a designed-in safety feature on a carry gun probably isn't the wisest course to take. If there's a problem with an individual's ability to reliably get it to release, it can be fine-tuned to release earlier in its travel.
     
  19. hentown

    hentown Member

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    So, we're all in agreement, then, that the grip safety is superfluous and patently absurd?? :cool:
     
  20. 1911Tuner

    1911Tuner Moderator Emeritus

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    Not at all. How did you come to that conclusion?
     
  21. The Lone Haranguer

    The Lone Haranguer Member

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    The grip safety is easily deactivated. Just hold the gun in a proper shooting grip. :p

    Holding the gun too low on the grip might cause a problem, but it will also cause problems with recoil control, with the gun wanting to "whipsaw" around in your hand.
     
  22. S.B.

    S.B. Member

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    orionengnrt, I wouldn't want to be on trial after shooting a perp, AFTER removing any gun safety? But, you do as you see best.
    Steve
     
  23. Skylerbone

    Skylerbone Member

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    Didn't confuse my safeties, just posted late and scrambled my wordin. Meant to read trigger must still be depressed, thanks for the catch Tuner.

    As for my opinion there is no reason good enough to eliminate any functional safety on the 1911. If a particular style is absent or included deemed undesirable to a potential owner an alternate brand or model is the simpler solution. The legal consideration I take in to account is what liability I have should the firearm ever be sold. Shooting another in defense of one's life is a whole other matter and involves the intentional deactivation of all safeties in order to initiate fire. That is intentional not accidental but you will be sued none the less.
     
  24. FoMoGo

    FoMoGo Member

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    2 of my 1911s are sans grip safety.
    Then again, the Combat Masters were sold that way.


    Jim
     
  25. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

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    A Detonics Combat Master does not meet my definition of "1911" or the US Army's or, I suspect, Tuner's.
     
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