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20mm Vulcan training projectiles

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by Matt304, Mar 25, 2012.

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  1. Matt304

    Matt304 Member

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    Saw these blue 20mm projos at the gun show and wow they are crazy looking. Guy had the bullets on display. Curious: what's the cap on the nose of them for? I notice the core seems all steel, brass drive band, and what looks like an aluminum cap or solid tip. What's the point of the tip? Is it like threaded on or what?
     
  2. MrCleanOK

    MrCleanOK Member

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    20mm x 102 rounds come in a lot of different flavors. High Explosive and Armor Piercing (each with and without incendiary), sabot (APDS) and training rounds (with and without tracer). If what you were looking at was a live round, the blue color would indicate that it's a training round. TP or TP-T marked on the cartridge would have told you if it was a tracer or not. I'm not really that familiar with 20mm, but I'd put money on the bodies of the HE and TP rounds being the same part, with different stuff inside and possibly a different nose cap.
     
  3. Matt304

    Matt304 Member

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    What about PBM88D55 6:011 M55A3
     
  4. Ian

    Ian Member

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    The removable nosecap is the fuse, which is threaded into the main body of the projectile (where the explosive or incendiary compounds would be).

    M55A3 20mm ammo is API.
     
  5. Jenrick

    Jenrick Member

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    As noted live rounds have a fuse. The training round has an inert fuze that is simply screwed into the fuze well. The keeps the ballistics of the rounds intact vs. having an empty hole there.

    -Jenrick
     
  6. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    See this other thread that just started today.
    http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=651210

    The cap on the inert training round is just a crimped on "windshield" to allow it to look and feed right, etc.

    It doesn't screw off, and you can't screw a fuse on it.

    rc
     
  7. Matt304

    Matt304 Member

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    I'm confused.

    So if the round says M55A3, is it a true armor piercing incendiary, even though it's painted blue? So in other words, it contains composition, but is a "trainer" round category still?

    Or is it weighted to mach a M55A3, but there is no composition because it's blue? Trying to figure ou

    I can tell the rear and body are steel (or some hard alloy) by the hardness and lathe marks, but is that just what all plain-jane blue rounds are, just a standard hard steel, or is there like a tungsten penetrator inside that steel being marked "M55A3"? Because BMG uses a tungsten-carbide penetrator, so I figured to be effective 20mm would also use T.C. for a penetrator. Or is the whole thing minus the nose cap a penetrator itself of T.C.? These things just intrigue me, because their design is so radical looking once you cross 50BMG territory.

    What's confusing again is the mention of two trainers above: TP- and TP-T (that are blue), but these are blue and you're saying AP-I (which we know work without a fuse anyways.) Hmm, so what the heck is it?
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2012
  8. RCArms.com

    RCArms.com Member

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    TP = Target Piercing
    TP-P = Target Piercing, Tracer.

    Basically live rounds for target practice. Same ballistics as AP, API, AP-T, APDS, etc, but much less expensive.



    Don
     
  9. Shadow 7D

    Shadow 7D Member

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    NO
    also what BLUE
    is it nato/baby blue?
    or is it a darker blue band, SOME countries, COMBLOCK used BLUE for API I believe (mind you US is not standard, well NATO is standardized but, that doesn't mean everything is the same)

    So, is it something like Hydra Rockets, where the light HE warhead is used with a smoke charge (and that's NOT inert BTW, it just doesn't blow up VERY big)

    and remember the point of training rounds is being cheaper than the real stuff, and cheaper may be a FMJ inert, or it maybe the HE shell with a cap, ALSO, they need to be ballisticly the same.
     
  10. Matt304

    Matt304 Member

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    AHHH! See you're doing it; there is nothing in front of me with 'TP' or 'TP-P'! Those letters keep being said, and I stated, "M55A3". With all due respect, my question is primarily about M55A3 now, since I am trying to learn what souvenir I purchased. I want to know what is on my shelf, so I can at least explain it to people, let alone be concerned if it has HE inside of it. Since I am holding the bullet I bought today in my hand, I want to know exactly about it specifically, please and thank you.

    Here, I'll show a photo so you can see the color next to a brighter blue CAT5 cable. It is that lighter, sky blue color.
     

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  11. mdauben

    mdauben Member

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    According to my official references, the M55A3 is the US Military designation for a 20mm TP cartridge. The full round is "live" in that it contains propellent and can be fired from an appropriate gun. The projectile itself for that round (which is what you appear to have) is solid steel with an aluminum nose cap, but no explosives or fuse.
     
  12. Matt304

    Matt304 Member

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    Ok, see that's more clarity. :)

    Now what type of steel are they if they are "piercing"? Are they tungsten carbide? Because the metal looks very hard, based on the machining marks.

    I'd like to see if there's a point under the tip, but these training tips do NOT thread on, they are pressed on? Is it an impossible feat to remove the tip without gouging something?

    I think it would be neat to put a regular one on display, and then a disassembled one next to it with band, core, and tip, laid out. (I'm trying to start a small, large-caliber museum in my basement glass display case.) I love looking at these huge rounds! 30mm A10 Warthog cartridge is my next discussion. hah
     
  13. paintballdude902

    paintballdude902 Member

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    its generally just a hard piece of steel for the penetrators with a solid windscreen over it. the inside may be hollow or may be one solid piece of steel to make up the projectile.


    id be willing to bet the majority of it is just solid steel with an aluminum windscreen crimped on and then the inside between the windscreen and steel part is hollow.


    the 20mm vulcan is an interesting design, the had the one gunships for a while but eventually got rid of them in favor of the 25mm gau-12. they dont have a standard primer theyre actually electronically fired. that is both cool and bad at the same time. there were issues with the rounds going off after being ejected and exploding on the gundeck (so ive been told) and also if one were to be jettisoned and then picked up, simple static could set it off
     
  14. MrCleanOK

    MrCleanOK Member

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    Again, the projectile you have is from a TP (target practice) round. It has no enhanced AP capabilities, and no explosive. It is an inert training dummy designed to be a ballistic match for service rounds within typical gunnery ranges. Light blue over the whole projectile is the color code for training rounds for all the NATO big stuff.

    Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk
     
  15. MrCleanOK

    MrCleanOK Member

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  16. Ian

    Ian Member

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    Sorry - it looks like Google mislead me on the designation...that is a just an inert trainer.
     
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