.223 for Black Bear

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by Ben86, Dec 22, 2010.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. wrs840

    wrs840 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2008
    Messages:
    1,922
    Location:
    NC
    Most sensible thing that's been said in this thread so far.

    Les
     
  2. HOOfan_1

    HOOfan_1 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2010
    Messages:
    4,700
    Location:
    Virginia
    I was watching a show on National Geographic about a rash of bear attacks in Anchorage and the stock footage they kept rolling of a bear charge, was a black bear charging, holding up and then slapping its jaws together.
     
  3. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2010
    Messages:
    3,276
    Location:
    Kodiak, AK
    Black bears kill about as many people as brown/grizzly bears in North America. However, blacks outnumber browns by at least 100 to 1, so they are at least 100 times safer to be around.
     
  4. Surefire

    Surefire Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2004
    Messages:
    737
    Location:
    Tampa
    Anything smaller than .308 is asking for trouble as bear defense.

    Having said that, a .223 is better than nothing.

    If that is all you have, your best bet is to fire as many controlled shots as possible before the bear is on you.
     
  5. Surefire

    Surefire Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2004
    Messages:
    737
    Location:
    Tampa
    I think black bears are generally more timid. The ones I've seen while hiking in California generally keep their distance as long as you show them respect.
     
  6. Freedom_fighter_in_IL

    Freedom_fighter_in_IL Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2010
    Messages:
    2,097
    LOL, Yeah HooFan I have dern near had to change underwear a few times from the "jaw slaps". Had one Boar that would have tipped the scales at around a measly 325-350 pounds do it to me and all I had on me was my Swiss Army Knife! It was in my MUCH younger days at around 22 (you know the age where you aint sceerd of nuthin) and the only thing that was going through my head was "Why in the hell do I not have a pistol on me!" Was the middle of summer and was out hiking with my wife. LUCKILY she froze up and didn't run. I stood my ground and yelled at it, luckily it turned and ambled on away. Didn't run, just walked on. Guess it was letting me know it was boss and I was in HIS world! Needless to say the message was delivered and imprinted.
     
  7. pikid89

    pikid89 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2009
    Messages:
    1,556
    Location:
    The Gator Nation
    in florida black bear are protected so we dont hunt them
    that said...ive seen some pretty BAD wild hogs dropped like rocks by 223s and 22-250s rather regularly
    that said...florida black bears are not a whole lot bigger than some big wild hogs and the wild hogs that are that big are most certainly tougher than an equal sized bear
    I my self would have no qualms over using the 223 with good soft points on the bear if i was hunting from a treestand
    if it was charging however i rather have slugs
     
  8. d2wing

    d2wing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Messages:
    5,367
    That's a varmit bullet, not a corelokt. If the op had said varmit bullet, I'd totally agree with you. I don't like the results I have seen with slug guns but if you guys rather use them, have at it. No arguement just preference.
     
  9. Al LaVodka

    Al LaVodka member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    1,040
    .223 Woo Hoo!

    Hmmm... And the .223 FMJ is HOW MUCH less powerful than the .44 Mag? Trick question: they're about the same.

    Can you use one on a Black Bear? Sure, if you must. But given any choice the 12 ga. slug is much preferred. Twice the energy. In some states it isn't even legal to shoot DEER w/a .223...

    Al
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2010
  10. wrs840

    wrs840 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2008
    Messages:
    1,922
    Location:
    NC
    Really? Got a link to an account of a human-fatality from a Black Bear attack in the lower 48? I've never seen one.

    Les
     
  11. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2010
    Messages:
    3,276
    Location:
    Kodiak, AK
    Black bears are over-sized raccoons. Grizzlies are true predators.

    Even raccoons will bite. Big raccoons will take big bites.
     
  12. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2010
    Messages:
    3,276
    Location:
    Kodiak, AK
    I was badly mauled ten years ago and so have developed an interest.

    List of fatal bear attacks: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_bear_attacks_in_North_America
     
  13. Al LaVodka

    Al LaVodka member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Messages:
    1,040
    Black Bear are known to be much more high strung and unpredictable.
    Al
     
  14. d2wing

    d2wing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Messages:
    5,367
    I very surprised at the number of black bear kills' I do know that playing dead doesn't work on black bears. If they attack black bears will kill and eat you on the spot, while a grizzly may leave if you play dead. I learned many years ago when I was charged by a moose, that it is a good idea to have a couple slugs handy when bird hunting some places.
     
  15. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2010
    Messages:
    3,276
    Location:
    Kodiak, AK
    Black bears don't have the "space" or territorial imperative that brown bears have. Most brown bear attacks are simply because you got too close and he's asserting his alpha status. Most black bear attacks are predatory - the animal is starving.

    So, the rule of thumb (which is only true most of the time) is to play dead with browns and fight back to your last breath with blacks.

    Still, considering how common black bears are and how infrequently people are attacked by them, it's shouldn't be a big worry for anyone.
     
  16. wrs840

    wrs840 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2008
    Messages:
    1,922
    Location:
    NC
    Thanks KB. I stand corrected.

    Les
     
  17. rocky1

    rocky1 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2010
    Messages:
    61
    Location:
    ND/FL
    Bear Humor...

    Curious Bear

    That's a must see video!!

    As for Pepper Spray...

    Bear_Country_Warningc.jpg





    Shotgun with slugs! Don't even think about it with a 55 grain bullet. You can drop them with a 22 short, IF you hit them right, but in a defense situation the odds of hitting them right are just about almost exactly---> 0.
     
  18. Stevie-Ray

    Stevie-Ray Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2003
    Messages:
    4,784
    Location:
    Mitchi-gun, the Sunrise Side
    Pointless for home defense? Sorry, can't agree with that at all. Unless you're stating that in this case (M4) the HD rifle is not also good for bear. Then I can agree, but if it was all I had I wouldn't lay down and die without a fight.
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2010
  19. 336A

    336A Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2007
    Messages:
    1,014
    You don't say... What do you think all of the 55gr SP bullets loaded in .22 centerfire ammunition is..... yeah varmint bullets:rolleyes: Last time I checked the Remington web site they don't offer any loaded 55gr Core Lokt ammo for the .223, what they do list however is a plain ol' 55gr SP varmint bullet. The performance of such will be explosive as is described here regardless of who makes it.
    http://www.hornady.com/store/22-Cal-.224-55-gr-SP/
    http://www.hornady.com/store/22-Cal-.224-55-gr-SP-SX/
    http://www.hornady.com/store/22-Cal-.224-55-gr-SP-with-cannelure/

    The exceptions will be those bullets that are listed in the links that I previously provided as well as the Rem Core Lokt Ultra which 62gr however. And I still wouldn't choose a .223 with those loads over a 12GA with slugs.
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2010
  20. WTBguns10kOK

    WTBguns10kOK Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2008
    Messages:
    539
    Location:
    Where men own big trucks and the women drive them
    Why would you want a little .22 sized bullet? And in a gun that has a proven history of failing since its inception? A pump shotty is like a revolver, you can quickly rack a new round, and it causes a big hole, wherever it hits. It's better for both situations.
     
  21. goon

    goon Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2003
    Messages:
    7,265
    At any rate, I think we have established that a 12 gauge loaded with slugs is the obvious choice. No more point in debating this.
     
  22. DBR

    DBR Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2002
    Messages:
    1,071
    Location:
    Vermont
    Brenneke hard cast 12ga slugs would be first choice.

    If I had to use a 223 I would load it with 60gr Nosler partition SP or 70gr Barnes copper TSX. Either of these will stay together and offer adequate penetration.

    We have had good sized black bears on our porch here at night and no we don't feed or encourage them.
     
  23. rocky1

    rocky1 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2010
    Messages:
    61
    Location:
    ND/FL
    As long as we continue to allow Animal Rights Activists to influence and oversee federal wildlife programs, you're going to continue to have them on your porch, in your yard, in your garage, in your house. They aren't going to go away; and as long as they aren't threatened, they'll keep pushing a little further each time, until someone eventually comes to the realization of the choices offered in this thread.
     
  24. Freedom_fighter_in_IL

    Freedom_fighter_in_IL Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2010
    Messages:
    2,097
    LMAO, good one Rocky1, "Hey what you doin there" That was rich!
     
  25. Ben86

    Ben86 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2008
    Messages:
    3,232
    Location:
    MS, USA
    Before I get berated by a rainbow hugger I want to make it clear I am not out to shoot a bear. From my experience most black bears have the temperament of Weny the Poo and the only way I could get one to come close is if I had a large pot of honey, and even then it might not work. I just wanted some opinions on how my .223 might stack up against a black bear, just in case.

    They also emit ear splitting screeches when frightened. I think I'd rather be charged at. :D

    Yet it's been in service for 50+ years? I'm not so sure you've got that straight.

    Awesome picture rocky1!

    Thanks for sharing the product of your research Kodiak.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice