.25-06 v 6.5 Swede
- Thread starter ExAgoradzo
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They are awesome guns, deals can be had on used ones. Back when Ron Peterson's was still around on Central I bought a 1968 Sako Finnbear in .30-'06 for $700, it is now my elk/oryx gun. Accurate and incredible smooth action with a great trigger. Since we can't have too many pictures of guns:
Anchorite
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The 25-06 is just a 270 that took a week off from working out. The bullet diameter of the Swede puts you between the 25 and and the 270. Problem solved (go with the Swede for nostalgia, it’s a Sako action, and so on).
Thank us all later.
Thank us all later.
I am not Paul, I will throw in there, the 130 gmx, 129 lrx, 130 t/ttsx, and 130 etip would be what I'd be looking at for elk bullets for this equation.
I'm not Paul but consider Swift A-frame, Federal Fusion & Trophy Bonded Tip, and Woodleigh Weldcore unless lead free projectiles are required. Go to 136 grains and add Federal Edge TLR & Terminal Ascent.
But I 100% get what HowieG's question was about - a well constructed .257 117 to 120 grain bullet traveling at Warp 6 vs a well constructed .277 130 grain bullet traveling at Warp 6.
Then consider the 257 & 270 Weatherby Magnum cartridges.
Anchorite
Member
Don’t forget the new 6.8 Western.
Consider the 240 Weatherby Magnum also. It's supposed to be real lightning in a bottle. Nosler 7 has a picture of a very nice bull elk killed outright with a 240 Mag.
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A perfect pronghorn load.
And if you were out hunting and just happened upon a 450 yard coyote shot, it would handle that too.
d2wing
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Sako's are very high quality guns. I shoot a Tikka which is the cheaper version and still better than many other brands.. Ruger 77 models were never much to get excited about. Sub par accuracy and nothing special although they do make some nice looking versions.
Interesting opinion on Ruger. I too have a Tikka. It's fine, plastic parts and all, but it doesn't outshoot my Ruger 77. I've owned three Ruger M77s. One I still have. An original version. The later 220 Swift was a Mark II and was a lights out shooter as is the 22-250 I currently own. The 25-06 shot fine, about like my Tikka, not spectacular, but plenty adequate. I am still waiting for that brand of rifle that makes lights out accurate rifles 100% of the time.
I was there at the start back in 1968 and the M77 was certainly something to get exited about back then. I couldn't wait to get in line to buy one as soon as I had the means and the years to do so, which was 1972. Well over a million of the original model were sold in 24 years when the original production ended in 1992. The pre-64 Win 70 only sold 581,471 in it's 28 year production run. The 77 might not be considered exciting at the present time, but after 53 years, I would say they are an American tradition.
By the way, Ruger is still owned by Ruger and stockholders, including me. SAKO has been owned by the Italians for 21 years.
Just to be clear, I am NOT smearing SAKO. Got nothing against them, or Tikka, at all. But, they are Finnish...er....Italian. Ruger is American all the way through.
I ran across this interesting quote on the NRA American Hunter website in an article dated Dec 8, 2017.
"Though you may doubt my word, when I hunted bison in South Dakota, my guide carried a .25-06 Remington, insisting he had plenty of gun (for the record I had something much larger)."
I obviously like quarter bore guns, but even I think that the 25-06 is a bit light for bison. Not much, but a bit.
The link to the full article is here: American Hunter | Behind the Bullet: .25-06 Remington
"Though you may doubt my word, when I hunted bison in South Dakota, my guide carried a .25-06 Remington, insisting he had plenty of gun (for the record I had something much larger)."
I obviously like quarter bore guns, but even I think that the 25-06 is a bit light for bison. Not much, but a bit.
The link to the full article is here: American Hunter | Behind the Bullet: .25-06 Remington
d2wing
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Glad you are a Ruger fan. I own a couple and like them. I saw your post with a pic of your 77 with a Shilen barrel. It is nice. That doesn't change my mind.
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Thanks. I don't really count that one as a 77. It's 77/22 VHZ. Totally different action than it's 77 big sort of half brother. Frankly, the 77/22 is sort of a problem child with it's two piece bolt. Not one of Ruger's best efforts. That's why I reworked mine.
If you want to check out a special 77, take a look at the thread "Show Me Your Wood" in the rifle section.
I have a Tikka T3 in 260 Remington. It has a long throat, but the short magazine wouldn't let me seat bullets out near the rifling. It's a Tikka, so no problem. I just installed a long action bolt stop and bought a 30-06 magazine and my rifle is now a long action. I can seat the bullets out all I want. Kind of the reverse of wanting a short action.
Rounds fitting right in actions is one of those really inane pet peeves I have. I won't own a long action gun in a short action cartridge (all the unless, unless, not being accounted for).....280AI actually kinda bugs me 'cause its a long cartridge (3.45coal) in an H&H length action......not important in the least, but I've considered having its throat reamed out so I can load 168-180s out farther, not because I'd get any major performance increase, but because it bugs me looking in and seeing space at the front of the mag LOL.
Equally, I'm really not a fan of being stuck with a medium length, or maybe a +2.9" cartridge, in a short action rifle. So there's VERY few options Id want a Mauser cartridge, another 6.5-284, or most of the stubby mags in.
My 28 Nosler is almost exactly right. The longest bullets I have easy access to are 190A-tips, and those loaded to max coal are all but touching the lands.......
yeah, weird I know......
We all have our weird quirks. Apparently so do gun manufacturers. That's why we have these cartridges that are stuck between short and long. They wanna be short, but they probably work better long. Anyway, I kind of like having a long magazine. I know I can stuff whatever bullet I want in the case and it will still fit in the mag. A bigger problem for me is my Cooper which has a long magazine, a long throat, but a SLOW twist. You can load all the long bullets you want, but they won't stabilize.
Nother peeve.....I don't NEED the long bullets I tend to shoot, but slow twist rates are a deal-breaker for me also.
MachIVshooter
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I've hit animals in the wrong place and got lucky, too. Your implication in this context, however, seems to be that there's some magic with the Swede which makes it more lethal with a bad hit. There isn't. Luck is luck, and unethical shots are unethical shots, whether you're using just enough gun or massive overkill.
God point, but I see it as more fundamental than velocity alone but I do give the concept of sectional density - when combined with bullet construction. In this example, comparison between the following:
A well constructed.257" diameter bullet weighing 120 grains with Sectional Density = 0.260 traveling at 3000, or more, feet per second muzzle velocity.
A well constructed. 277" diameter bullet weighing 130 grains with sectional density = 0.242 traveling at 3000, or more, feet per second muzzle velocity
This could be further expanded, say
A well constructed 6.5mm .264" diameter bullet weighing 125 grains with sectional density = 0.256 traveling at 3000, or more, feet per second muzzle velocity.
A well constructed 7mm .284" diameter bullet weighing 140 grains with sectional density =0.248 traveling at 3000, or more, feet per second muzzle velocity
A well constructed. 308" diameter bullet weighing 150 grains with sectional density = 0.226 traveling at 3000, or more, feet per second muzzle velocity.
Anchorite
Member
Great pointers....I would say the 270 has been hampered all these years by factory twists....now we’re seeing new bullet weights that ought to shine in custom twist rates. So many new cartridges and offerings, but twist rates and bullet diameters and sectional densities make the difference. We’re taking differences in hundredths of inches.
And who says what the actual "killing power" of any bullet and velocity combination provides to define "enough gun", especially WRT non-dangerous game? The .25-06 Remington has been successful in taking crocodile in Africa in yesteryears without wailing and gnashing of teeth, and prior to that, the famous use of 6.5X54mm and 7X57mm FMJ military ammunition used on dangerous game?
If the landowner / guide service has a specific set of requirements and someone chooses to use that service that's simple business. If an area has specific government regulations defining what can, and by exclusion, what can't be used, that's clear legal framework that is tacitly agreed to by anyone choosing to hunt where such regulations are in place.
The variable of shooter skill set with the firearm, cartridge, and projectile a shooter plans to use for a particular purpose, especially in field conditions where the use will take place, isn't something that I see any way to yet objectively quantify, and weight, into defining "enough gun".
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