.338-06 vs .30-06 for a Bush Gun.

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by KansasTrapper77, Mar 27, 2022.

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  1. Jack Ryan

    Jack Ryan Member

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    ANY THING that will kill game cleanly at 400 yards will do exactly the same thing AND MORE at 100 yards.
     
  2. Ugly Sauce

    Ugly Sauce Member

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    Why not a k98? I love the Springfield, and the P17, but k98's are so much easier to find. ?
     
  3. illinoisburt

    illinoisburt Member

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    I haven't felt truly undergunned with 30-06, though have to agree if you are going to go through the cost and work of modding a rifle best to go with biggest round which can be reasonably handled in the magazine using the same bolt face and a replacement barrel. I would be (and occasionally have) looked hard at 9.3x62. Maybe not as popular here in the US but it's truly on level with African big game and certainly more than enough umph to get the job done with anything walking in North America at brush gun ranges.
     
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  4. Ugly Sauce

    Ugly Sauce Member

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    Yah, brush busting. That bear I shot with my Jeager, I hit it a bit too far back, gut shot it, she dropped and bawled a bit, then rolled over, got up and took off, and I had to dive into the heavy brush after it. Now when I caught up with her I was close and could see her sitting up, through the brush. I've never bought into the brush-busting thing, but being so close I figured it would not throw a big old hunking .600" ball over a bucket full of Swiss off very much. Two clean misses later I walked up and finished it off. One would think that if anything could get through brush, it would be a .62 with a heavy charge. Nope. So that would be my "argument". ;)
     
  5. Robert

    Robert Administrator Staff Member

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    Honestly, between the two, for a gun that I might use on grizzly, 375 H&H.
     
  6. DM~

    DM~ Member

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    I've already done that test, the 200NP out of a 30-06, out penetrates many of the bigger calibers I see guys drooling over.

    AND, those that brag on how deep their bullet/load will penetrate, forget all about an important part of the equation! That would be, that the bullet must ALSO expand fast, BEFORE penetrating deeply, to give quick kills.

    DM
     
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  7. DM~

    DM~ Member

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    EXCEPT that, there are bullets that perform good at 400 and do NOT perform good up close. The reverse is also true...

    DM
     
  8. DM~

    DM~ Member

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    I have used (and still own) the 9.3x74R too, same bullet at close to the same speed as the 62. The 286NP's are pretty good, but that's about the only 9.3 bullet I care for...

    I really prefer a little more speed than the 62/74R gets with the heavy bullets.

    DM
     
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  9. Boattale

    Boattale Member

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    Even deader!
     
  10. KansasTrapper77

    KansasTrapper77 Member

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    Do you mean a true K98 or just a military Mauser action? Like an Argentine copy?
     
  11. Jack Ryan

    Jack Ryan Member

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    ah huh what ever
     
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  12. Ugly Sauce

    Ugly Sauce Member

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    I'm thinking German k98.
     
  13. GooseGestapo

    GooseGestapo Member

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    My solution was that I picked up a used Ruger M77 Hawkeye African in .375Ruger.

    Most of the bush type planes I’ve seen and/or flown would have no problem accommodating a rifle in a case up to a 24” bbl. The super cub I flew had a Kolpin case mounted to the wing struts (bungee cords) so most any scoped rifles (not AR’s) would fit.

    Ammo would be my concern. I had my MkX returned to .30/06 from .338-06. Between Finn Aagard anc John Barsness and others, I’d be inclined to go with a .30:06 and either 200gr NP or Swift A-frame.

    My observations on Alaska cartridges is that residents carry .30/30’s .30/06, 7.62x54R, .45/70 and .308’s. Guides, outfitters, non residents carry MAGNUMS. Visiting the Walmart’s in Anchorage and Talkeetna was enlightening. Saw lots of .375H&H, .458winmag! 11varieties of .45/70. 1 or 2 varieties of most Weatherby magnums. Crates of .30/30, .30/06, and 12ga.

    Unless I had access to an available action at bargain price and likewise barrel, Ect, I’d just buy a used bolt action .30/06 and cut barrel to 20” and replace front sight.
    Or do as I did and buy a lightly used heavy hitter.
    I have $425 in for the .375Ruger. $200 for a Savage 110 in .300RUM, and $250 for a Weatherby Vanguard.257! Nobody wants to pony up for the Ammo!

    If you do decide on a 98 Mauser action (or variant) pm me. I have a A&B 24”.338-06 bbl, Lee dies, brass and bullets I’d consider letting go of.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2022
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  14. Ugly Sauce

    Ugly Sauce Member

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    Wow, the Goose got ya covered!! I still understand why a .338-06 is desired over a .375, .358, etc. And although I'd prefer a 22" barrel over a 20" for beating around the bush, I understand the desire for a 20". I think you are thinking in terms of the overall package, which is good. Sure, even a 26" barrel would still fit in the Super Cub, and really would not be that un-handy in the bush, but that's not the point. !!

    Anyhow, finding a Ruger77 in any caliber, and just re-barreling it would save a lot of time, money and hassle. I prefer the tang-safety models, and have one with a 20" ER Shaw barrel in .350RM. It's a sweet handling, short and stubby light rifle. Crazy accurate. I "wish" it had a 22" barrel, but I lose no sleep over it.

    Having said all that, I'd jump on the Goose's barrel and accoutrements, and find me a Mauser. The Mauser does make an elegant sporter when worked over and done right. And again, more easy to locate than a Springfield, (cha-CHING!$$$$) and less work than a P17, which has to be trimmed down quite a bit.
     
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  15. Captcurt

    Captcurt Member

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    Which would point me to a Howa action.
     
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  16. KansasTrapper77

    KansasTrapper77 Member

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    Ruger already kinda makes what I’m talking about in their Guide Gun line. 20” barreled 30-06 with iron sights although they’re open and mounted pretty far forward. I just liked the idea of making one “myself” for less than the $1600 it’d cost to get one the Rugers. But like several of you have mentioned the surplus rifles aren’t as cheap as they used to be. Those days are gone I suppose. Bummer.
     
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  17. Ugly Sauce

    Ugly Sauce Member

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    I guess them days is gone. And I appreciate a DIY over a factory rifle. I'm pretty sure finding a Bubba'd Springfield would be difficult, as any Springfield would be sought after as long as the action is good. I can't imagine on laying on a gun-show table for long. Should still be a few Mausers around at somewhat reasonable prices. I don't know enough about the Mauser to say, but perhaps a 1909 Argentine would make a good rifle. I think one could find a 1909 or at least an action without too much expense. ? Also don't know if the barrel shank/thread size would be the same as a k98. ? There's the "large ring" and "small ring" thing that always confuses me.

    Sight radius (long) is always a good thing to have, but for me I kind of like the rear sight set rather forward and with an oversize notch for snap shooting. Doesn't seem to hurt much as far as carefully aimed shots.
     
  18. Goosey

    Goosey Member

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    I say .338-06, just because it's cooler. And the shorter barrel will affect both the same for all intents and purposes.
     
  19. KansasTrapper77

    KansasTrapper77 Member

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    I will definitely keep your offer in mind as I watch the local stores.

    Found a sporterized M1903 today after work.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2022
  20. KansasTrapper77

    KansasTrapper77 Member

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    Somehow I double replied and don’t know how to delete a reply.
     
  21. Ugly Sauce

    Ugly Sauce Member

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    NO WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! way? That would be like the holy grail. Or a pound of unobtainium.
     
  22. KansasTrapper77

    KansasTrapper77 Member

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    I had about 2 minutes to look at and didn’t get a picture because the owner was telling me a story about the last guy that came in minutes before closing trying to get a bargin. But I might go look again later. I’m not in a terrible hurry. I tend to get excited and hyper-focus on projects and have to tell myself to slow down haha.
     
  23. Ugly Sauce

    Ugly Sauce Member

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    I would not slow down on a Springfield action. That be like the ultimate. Of course, if the owner figures it worth it's weight in gold, might have to pass. But any reasonable price, considering the current state of affairs...snag it.
     
  24. wombat13

    wombat13 Member

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    I’d think the .338-06 should do better with a shorter barrel than .30-06. Larger bore with about the same amount of powder means the gas will expand faster and pressure will drop faster. This allows the use of faster burn rate powders and/or shorter barrels. Dividing case volume by bore area yields 713 gr per sq in for .338-06. .308 win is 752, .30-06 is 915 and .300wm is 1152. You’ll often see a .300wm with a 24” barrel, sometimes a 26” and very rarely a 22”. Most common for .30-06 is 22”, occasionally 24” and less common, but not rare 20”. .308 is most commonly offered in 20”. Anyway, there is clearly a correlation. Since the .338-06 ratio is lower than .308 win and 20” barrel is most common for .308 but not .30-06, I’d expect .338-06 to be happier in a 20” barrel than .30-06 would be.
     
  25. KansasTrapper77

    KansasTrapper77 Member

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    That’s kinda what I figured. That the .338-06 literally has less of a bottleneck to constrict the gasses. And the affect would be I could possibly fire 185gr .338 from a 20in barrel at the same velocity as I could fire a 180gr .30 from a 22 inch barrel. And if not the same velocity then at a lower pressure.
     
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