34 Ways to Cut Corners on Manufacturing an AR15

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Shot peening and a good magnuflux is a good idea, but I've had all the rods in my 500hp small block Chevy peened and fluxed for $45. You should have that option for an bolt for $20 extra.

Some manufacturers still charge too much for an AR.
 
Although I like AR's and their design; this post also reminds me of why I don't like them.
 
Sorry if this is unacceptable thread necromancy, but it didn't seem that old, and I wanted to say thanks for it being so informative. So, thanks! :)

I saw this while lurking a couple of weeks ago, and after some more investigating and the response from Del-Ton, I decided to order one of their kits instead of getting a Stag or some such on my next payday. To the best of my knowledge, it would appear they've done all the bits they say they have. Sans things beyond my ability to check (metallurgy, magnetic particle tests, etc..), of course. Well, they didn't offer anything but an HBAR on their middy kits, but that was my plan anyway, so, no big loss.

Granted, this probably isn't much of an endorsement being my first AR anyhow. :p Just thought someone out there might be curious how an inexpensive kit measures up to the list. Pic of the carrier is attached in case anyone cares too.
 

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Which also brings up a good point. God forbid that I follow everything on the net, but I have never heard anything bad about a Stag or a DelTon. Low money, doesn't always mean low quality in terms of a modular firearm.
 
Bringing this back up because it should be a sticky!



Oh and I guess I missed it the first time around, to BrainonSigs I think is his name, RRA actually got a smaller portion of that contract. Colt and Sig were the other two who received a contract with the DEA for rifles. I don't drink the Colt kool aid as I build my own ARs using top shelf parts for less than I could buy a Colt (and I get standard pin sizes to boot;)) but RRA's advertising is kinda misleading because it makes people believe that RRA beat out Colt in the tests when in fact Colt had a greater portion of the contract awarded to them.
 
I missed this the first trip through the mill, but agree that it should be made a STICKY.
Thanks. Tomorrow morn, I'm gonna make sure my bolts are staked. Now, I'm goin' to bed and ......well I'm sure not gonna stake my nuts!!!:what:
 
Actually, this is a sticky. It is one of many threads listed in the "Rifle Forum Reading Library" stuck to the top of the Forum.
 
Wow, this helped clear up a lot of my questions on why there was such a price difference between AR-15s. After hearing the answer from Del-Ton, I think I will probably go with one of them. Now I just have to pick all the details (which should only take me two or three months :uhoh: ).
 
Bringing this back up because it should be a sticky!



Oh and I guess I missed it the first time around, to BrainonSigs I think is his name, RRA actually got a smaller portion of that contract. Colt and Sig were the other two who received a contract with the DEA for rifles. I don't drink the Colt kool aid as I build my own ARs using top shelf parts for less than I could buy a Colt (and I get standard pin sizes to boot) but RRA's advertising is kinda misleading because it makes people believe that RRA beat out Colt in the tests when in fact Colt had a greater portion of the contract awarded to them.


This is actually incorrect. While DEA signed contracts with RRA, Sigarms, and Colt for semi-auto rifles, DEA has not exercised it's right to purchase rifles under the Sigarms or Colt contract and has only bought RRA's. The FBI and ATF have also bought RRA's under the DEA contract, in a manner known as "piggy-backing".

DEA has continued to purchase some select fire Colt M-4's and M-203's, as well as FN SAW 249's, under other contracts, but in much smaller numbers, and primarily for use in foreign countries.

So while the RRA advertisement is not totally true in regards to all DEA rifles, it is totally true in regards to semi-auto rifles.
 
Interesting,

Bart made this a sticky in the rifle forum reading guide.

Is it possible to tell just by looking at the said parts on the list, if they are or are not made that way?
Is there a stamp or anything that can identify say if the handle was forged? just one example..
 
I'm convinced

It seems like a lot of good reasons to buy the real thing instead of an imitation. Same for a 45 ACP or a Peacemaker.
 
Does anyone know if PWA is still in business. I had a M-4 clone A1 that was great but my crackhead cousin stole it. Also does anyone make a new A1 model, I prefer the aperture to the A2.
 
Old thread, but not a bad one.

As someone that uses milspec tools and parts on a regular basis (active duty), being "milspec" doesn't necessarily mean "better."

For example, a milspec magazine is crap. Milspec mags are made of thin aluminium and are very easy to dent or break. I've personally broken more than one. The plastic (yes, plastic!) Magpul pmags are far better than milspec magazines.

The M4 buttstock is also crap. It's difficult to have a proper cheek weld on it. The civilian LMT SOPMOD stock, as one example, is far better.

The trigger, or fire control group, of a milspec AR is really crap. It's heavy and full of creep. Many civilian ARs have far better feeling triggers.

I'm not arguing with Bart's post, but I shake my head when I see people buying milspec on the assumption that it's "better."

Most of the failures that happen in an AR are related to lack of lubrication, bad magazines, or a part that has failed in the bolt carrier group.

A Lewis Machine & Tool or BCM bolt carrier group is shot peened, magnetic partical inspected, and has a properly staked carrier key. You can save money buying a Bushmaster, Stag Arms, Rock River Arms, etc. and swapping out the bolt carrier group for an LMT or BCM.

An LMT or BCM bolt carrier group costs about $130.

Sure, a Bushmaster, Stag Arms, Rock River Arms, etc. dosen't have 4150 barrel steel, but who's going to say a 4140 chrome lined barrel is not up to shooting thousands of rounds? You could also have a match grade barrel and a match grade trigger if you choose which, while not milspec, will be a whole lot more enjoyable to shoot.

Why limit yourself to what we're stuck with in the military?
 
According to the Bushmaster rep., their barrels are indeed a form of 4150 barrel steel.
The LMT SOPMOD stock isn't civilian, it is an actual piece of US Military hardware issued with the M4 carbine enhancement package.

I have had very good luck with the bolt carriers offered by High Standard.
They feature the older, heavier, semi auto carrier design with the fuly shrouded firing pin slot.
I don't know if H.S. particle inspects the carriers or not and couldn't care, I have yet to see a civilian bolt carrier fail.
I install the gas tube carrier keys myself and ensure that they are properly staked.
Why count on somebody else to do the work when you can do it yourself.
 
I can think of one thing that would actually make this all worse.

Have shadetree gunsmiths purchase the same substandard parts referred to in Post #1 above and assemble them using improvised tools, materials and techniques.

Then we wonder why folks post here that their AR-15s don't run correctly...? :confused:
 
Sorry Bart but I for one wouldn't even think about buying one of these "bargin basement" items (calling this a rifle just seems... wrong). :scrutiny:

You want something cheaper?!? Make your own. If the current models available are out of your price range... save more $$$.

People were complaining about these cheaply made Mattel Toys when they replaced the M14 (I know... I was there). Too much plastic... too flimsy... etc. I don't see where any of these penny pinching options will produce something in any way BETTER than the current design.

Some things should NOT be made as cheaply as humanly possible. Things that go boom are usually in that category.

:banghead:

Of course, this is just MHO. You are all entitled to yours.
 
Yes, peening reduces surface stress risers. It's been done on racing conrods just about forever.
 
mil spec isn't the be all and end all
there is a world of difference between a standard dimarco C8
and the special forces super gucci version handled both and you can tell the difference though its debatable the extra accuracy and general build quality would be noticeable in combat.
 
Actually I can tell you that.

I have yet to find one DPMS without most of those features standard. Ive never seen a BCG on any manufacturer yet that was not properly staked. Maybe actual owners of the weapons being "snobbed at" should respond to give accuracy to the subject. In fact many of the 34 subjects I have never heard of or seen actually present any manufacturers AR. I know of one company that uses plastic in the recievers.
The only models I know of that are just painted are done by aftermarket, and by customer choice.
There are a few of the above mentioned features that separate the major AR manufacturers from one model to the next. Comparing a colt AR my friend recently purchased by my suggestion (excellent price), to my DPMS and most other ARs I have ever looked at or fired for many years there is VERY LITTLE DIFFERENCE aside from shot peened bolts, MPT.
I can tell you with all confidence that my DPMS fires so accurate that you couldnt compare a colt to it, not one colt or hundreds Ive shot.
It comes down to (except one compant with plastic recievers) what brand you want to buy, what features you want, how it looks seems to be important to most, and what you want to spend on it.
I bought my AR used, and have been very good at picking good used ARs out for others. Thousands of rounds in my hands, and who knows how many thousands of rounds in someone elses hands, they are functioning just like new today.
 
Ive never seen a BCG on any manufacturer yet that was not properly staked.

Really? On average I transfer about 5 ARs a week from various manufacturers. I haven't kept written records or anything, but I'd guess about half of the BCGs that come through are not properly staked.
 
FYI, the carrier on my Del-Ton midlength is staked - barely:

staked1462.jpg

staked2280.jpg


(Yes, I know the pics are blurry; for a phone camera with no macro setting, it's not that bad.)
 
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