While your experience is important to you, just as mine is to me. The Facklerits will dismiss it as anecdotal.
357 Magnum vs 45 ACP
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While your experience is important to you, just as mine is to me. The Facklerits will dismiss it as anecdotal.
Funny I don't know any ppl still on their feet after being shot point blank in the chest with a 357mag. But then I don't get out as much as I used to. And at the ranch shooting at Watermelons, they exploded with my 357 and 45,but the 9mm just left entrance/exit. Maybe shot placement? Type of ammo? Type of melon/ranch?
C-grunt
Member
I never said the .45 doesnt do more damage than the 9mm. What I said is that in real world shootings they behave the same. IE... the slightly larger bullets wont make up for poor shot placement. Look at the expanded bullet pictures. The difference in diameter is .15 inches. Look at the gel shots at the top of the link. All of them are very similar.
texagun
Member
This photo has been around for a long time. Common sense would tell you that the round on the left would most likely do more damage than the round on the right.
This article by "Deadmeat" should dispel a lot of myths floating around the internet about "Stopping Power." One of the conclusions is that a handgun is a very poor tool for "stopping" a gun fight.
http://www.gunthorp.com/Terminal Ballistics as viewed in a morgue.htm
I think it was Clint Smith who said "The only reason to bring a handgun to a gun fight is to fight your way to a rifle or a shotgun."
This article by "Deadmeat" should dispel a lot of myths floating around the internet about "Stopping Power." One of the conclusions is that a handgun is a very poor tool for "stopping" a gun fight.
http://www.gunthorp.com/Terminal Ballistics as viewed in a morgue.htm
I think it was Clint Smith who said "The only reason to bring a handgun to a gun fight is to fight your way to a rifle or a shotgun."
JFrame
Member
Ha...Believe it or not, this thread is actually kind'a timely for me... 
As my screen name implies, I tend toward revolvers (and small ones at that). My most recent acquisition was a S&W 360PD .357, and it has been, uhm, exhilarating trying to find the appropriate load for that little puppy.
But I recently found a supplier of Detonics magazines -- and I've started thinking about pulling my 26-year-old Detonics Combat Professional .45 "safe queen" out of mothballs. I've always loved shooting that little hunk of stainless steel, and found myself periodically ruing that it hasn't seen more daylight in the past decade and a half...
I'm not gonna enter the .45 vs. .357 debate, because I'm sure either one will perform adequately provided I do my part. Heck -- maybe I'll carry both...And then it's just a case of which one is actually the "New York reload"...
.
As my screen name implies, I tend toward revolvers (and small ones at that). My most recent acquisition was a S&W 360PD .357, and it has been, uhm, exhilarating trying to find the appropriate load for that little puppy.
But I recently found a supplier of Detonics magazines -- and I've started thinking about pulling my 26-year-old Detonics Combat Professional .45 "safe queen" out of mothballs. I've always loved shooting that little hunk of stainless steel, and found myself periodically ruing that it hasn't seen more daylight in the past decade and a half...
I'm not gonna enter the .45 vs. .357 debate, because I'm sure either one will perform adequately provided I do my part. Heck -- maybe I'll carry both...And then it's just a case of which one is actually the "New York reload"...
.
mrbro
Member
Ok, hold on a minute while I check.
Yup, just as I thought. All those people killed over the years with small guns using inferior bullets are still dead.
I'll keep watching though and report back the second the situation changes.
Yup, just as I thought. All those people killed over the years with small guns using inferior bullets are still dead.
I'll keep watching though and report back the second the situation changes.
jad0110
Member
I shot a melon with an SKS in 7.62 x 39, and the melon did NOT explode. Melons aren't people, so there really isn't any conclusion that can be drawn other than I must of hit the melon at a strong spot. Same thing with a pumpkin, even a small one, but I did get a little one to blow up with a 3" .44 Special revolver. Again, I must have hit it just right with the .44.
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C-Grunt, great post, and thank you for your service too.
I've basically been stating the same myself for years, that most medium and big bore handgun calibers are going to perform closely enough that the deciding factor becomes what platform feels most natural and shoots best for you, also figuring in cost considerations. Then, select a load that hopefully penetrates well. Expansion potential is a nice bonus. For me, I'm a huge .38 Special fan, particularly when used in heavier steel frame revolvers. Barely any recoil, super fast follow-up shots, good penetration and expansion with the better loads, and it is one of the easiest cartridges to reload. But YMMV.
What one shouldn't do is pick a caliber simply because it starts in a "4", or because it is a Magnum. I saw a guy at the range years ago who rented a Glock 19 and a 23. He shot the 9mm 19 MUCH better than the .40 (flinch city). He went with the .40 because his buddies told him 9mm will only piss a BG off. :banghead:
They do make those 15 round magazines for a reason my 45 with about 1/8th inch trigger reset will allow me to empty the clip in probably 2 seconds or less, shoot him nine times and pissed off wont even be in his mind.
C-Grunt,
I know this thread is about hand guns, but saw a show on Military Channel about the M16 and ammo was designed to fragment on impact,so getting shot once could be like getting shot up to 4 or 5 times, can you confirm that?
C-Grunt,
I know this thread is about hand guns, but saw a show on Military Channel about the M16 and ammo was designed to fragment on impact,so getting shot once could be like getting shot up to 4 or 5 times, can you confirm that?
C-grunt
Member
When a 5.56 projectile hits a bad guy it tends to yaw. If there is enough velocity left in the round it will usually fragment causing significant wounds outside the initial bullet track. Many rifle rounds will yaw also because they tend to be long and narrow with a heavier base. I wouldnt say its like getting shot 4 or 5 times though.
Jim Cirillo talks about ammunition/caliber selection in his two books. Bullet placement and bullet type/construction are key. Caliber, while somewhat important (assume service cartridges), does not play as big a role as many of us would like to believe.
By occupation, I have seen a good number of folks who were shot, stabbed, and otherwise assaulted. There are so many variables in each particular situation, that naming one caliber/gun as "better" than another is fruitless. I am of the belief that proper gun handling, sound tactics, good shooting, luck and a combat mindset are what will work most of the time.
By occupation, I have seen a good number of folks who were shot, stabbed, and otherwise assaulted. There are so many variables in each particular situation, that naming one caliber/gun as "better" than another is fruitless. I am of the belief that proper gun handling, sound tactics, good shooting, luck and a combat mindset are what will work most of the time.
Their probably NATO rounds if they still exist?
Last child moved out and I bought some pistols since they sometimes have 6 shootings here a day. 2 or 3 home invasions sometimes. I think the 45 on the night stand and 357 in the closet for BU+ Not to mention a little Chi (wawa?) that can hear a mouse run across the carpet and let you know about it. I started helping my Dad raise walker coon dogs around 8 and by 10 I could pop the eye out of a coon way up in a hardwood standing chest deep in the swamp with half a dozen dogs going crazy. The used to make me hit a nickle from 10-25 yrds. I,m pretty sure they got the "Make my day law" in Texas.
Thanks for all the help.
Too close to the border in Texas!
btw ive been to the range several times with both guns (like ridin a bike) if 92 out of 100. are ok right, after not shooting in 25 years?
Last child moved out and I bought some pistols since they sometimes have 6 shootings here a day. 2 or 3 home invasions sometimes. I think the 45 on the night stand and 357 in the closet for BU+ Not to mention a little Chi (wawa?) that can hear a mouse run across the carpet and let you know about it. I started helping my Dad raise walker coon dogs around 8 and by 10 I could pop the eye out of a coon way up in a hardwood standing chest deep in the swamp with half a dozen dogs going crazy. The used to make me hit a nickle from 10-25 yrds. I,m pretty sure they got the "Make my day law" in Texas.
Thanks for all the help.
Too close to the border in Texas!
btw ive been to the range several times with both guns (like ridin a bike) if 92 out of 100. are ok right, after not shooting in 25 years?
Just had rotater cuff on my right shoulder 6 months ago , have to shoot left handed. ,and im right handed. Have to grab the grip left handed, so recoil goes to my left hand/shoulder,but still use both hands as hard as I a can,since Im sure I would not stop shooting until they were on the ground or gone. Im sure glad i got the 45 w 4" barrel. No way I could get off multple rounds accurately and guickly with the small frame 357 snubby.
Ric
Member
What the 9mm lacks in mass and width, it makes up in velocity.
What the 45 lacks in velocity it makes up for with mass and width.
I don't think anybody would continue to attack you just because they noticed you were pointing a 9mm at them.
And I don't think anybody that is actively attacking you will run just because you have a 45.
(my opinion is worth exactly what you paid for it)
What the 45 lacks in velocity it makes up for with mass and width.
I don't think anybody would continue to attack you just because they noticed you were pointing a 9mm at them.
And I don't think anybody that is actively attacking you will run just because you have a 45.
(my opinion is worth exactly what you paid for it)
I don't carry except in the car and house, my most probably situation would be home invasion. I put my mouse on my coffee table so 4 steps inside the door they would hit it in the dark and my monitor would light them up like a flare and my chiuaha to deal with.
Id would probably be in my dark bedroom,open to the den. The would never see anything.
Id would probably be in my dark bedroom,open to the den. The would never see anything.
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amd6547
Member
Thread quickly approaching worthless waste of time redundancy.
Both cartridges will do the job in the hands of someone who can hit with them.
Neither will in the hands of someone who can't.
Both cartridges will do the job in the hands of someone who can hit with them.
Neither will in the hands of someone who can't.
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