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357 Sig

Discussion in 'Handguns: General Discussion' started by lpsharp88, Mar 20, 2013.

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  1. lpsharp88

    lpsharp88 Member

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    I was reading this thread and this thread about camping/backpacking/hiking guns and only noticed 1 mention of a weapon chambered in 357 Sig being used. There were plenty of instances of varying calibers from 9mm on up to .44 special, I noticed a LOT of 10mm and .357 magnum. My question is, why is 357 Sig so infrequently used (according to the two threads I listed)? If it mirrors the performance of a .357 mag, but in an autoloader, it seems that it would be more commonly used. Also, is there a major difference between 10mm, .357 mag, and 357 Sig (performance, not cost wise)? Thank you!
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2013
  2. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    First the name of the cartridge is 357 SIG, there is no decimal point in front of the 3

    It is often stated that the 357 SIG is meant to replicate the performance of the .357 Magnum...this isn't completely true. It was designed to duplicate the performance of the 125gr JHP loading of the .357 Magnum...as that was the LE loading which had the best street record for one-shot stops.

    While the 357 SIG's 125gr JHP loading is quite effective within it's design parameters, is very accurate, and reliable, most folks feel that a heavier bullet is preferred against threat that may be encountered while in the wilderness
     
  3. lpsharp88

    lpsharp88 Member

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    My apologies. I fixed the post
     
  4. X-Rap

    X-Rap Member

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    I feel no more alone in the wilderness with my G32 than I do with my AR. It's true that neither may be as robust as some but I am OK with either. There are no doubt better but they too come with sacrifice of weight or capacity.
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2013
  5. armsmaster270

    armsmaster270 Member

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    357Sig is actually a 125 grain 9mm slug.
     
  6. postalnut25

    postalnut25 Member

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    The 357 Sig is not a bad round. It would be just fine for camping/hiking/backpacking.

    However, I carry a M&P9 and a 1911 the majority of my time. Therefore, I would carry the same thing while engaged in outdoor activities. I am not going to have a seperate gun for every task. It gets a little silly. I am competent with those two platforms, so I stick with them no matter what I am doing.
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2013
  7. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    I didn't mean it as a chastisement, it was just informational
     
  8. ozarkhillbilly

    ozarkhillbilly Member

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    The 357sig is a great round, but more expensive and a little harder to come by,so it is used less often. I love my Smith 686 but I would take 13 rds of 357sig in my 229 over it any day of the week.
     
  9. kyhunter

    kyhunter Member

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    I believe it has to do a lot with availabilty and cost as well. Its also a somehat more complicated cartridge to reload for due to setback issues (so ive heard).

    A lot of people like 10mm cause its one of the hardest hitting readily available autoloaders. .357 mag and .44 mag are revolver cartridges and millions of people carry revolvers. Id go on a limb and say .357/.38 special is one of the most popular cartridges period.

    9mm and .45 are go to standards for many popular guns and what a large portion of what people carry. You cant carry what you dont have and most people dont have a 357 sig.
     
  10. willypete

    willypete Member

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    It's more expensive, harder to get, and is in the middle ground of performance between hot 9x19 and mild .357 Magnum. 357 SIG usually ends up somewhere around 1350 fps with a 125 grain bullet, which is NOT the nominal performance of a .357 Magnum, unless you're shooting a 3" barrel. Another reason the 357 SIG can't really match up with the .357 Magnum is that its performance suffers when shooting heavier bullets (158 gr, 180 gr, 200 gr) which is where the .357 Magnum really starts to shine. Basically, with 357 SIG, you get a faster 9x19 with very little improvement on terminal ballistics, harsher recoil, lower capacity, more expensive ammo, which is more difficult to reload - if you're into that.

    It's not a bad cartridge, it just does some things better than others and worse than others. Pick your poison. I think the reason the 357 SIG hasn't caught on more is that the areas of performance in which it excels are already covered by other cartridges which have been established for at least or almost a century.
     
  11. beatledog7

    beatledog7 Member

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    The [no period here]357 Sig is becoming a favorite of mine. It is most commonly loaded with 124/5-grain JHP or flat-nosed bullets but can work with a range of weights: 90-147 grain.
     
  12. MagnumDweeb

    MagnumDweeb Member

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    If it's not a .45 LC Keith Style 250 Grain LFN pushed to 1000 fps, or a .44 Magnum 320 Grain LWFN (Lead Wide Flat Nose) pushed to 1000 fps, it's not really a camping gun for me. For me, camping guns are anti-bear guns when they come to handguns.
     
  13. gandog56

    gandog56 Member

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    All a 357 SIG is, pretty much, is a 40 cal S&W case necked down to 9mm size. You can shoot a much faster bullet than a 9mm because you can load a lot more powder in it. Think of it as a 9mm on steroids. Because the parent cartridge is a forty Cal S&W, sever gun makers make models that will shoot both calibers with a simple barrel swap, even the same magazines are used. My SIG P229 has both barrels.

    I'm wondering if it could be done with a parent 10mm case? Then you have a Supersteroid 9 ! For self defense in bear country I think bigger is better, though. 357 SIG is a fine home defense round, and I think quite a few cops use them. At least that is where I scarfed up quite a few free 357 SIG cases from, a part time police used practice range.
     
  14. crazyjennyblack

    crazyjennyblack Member

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    gandog56 - They did make one. It's called 9x25 Dillon. And yes, it's a supersteroid 9. You can get barrels in that caliber for the Glock 20. The round used to be used in competitions, but I guess it gave some folks wrist problems when used a lot. Getting the ammo is pretty much a "you better load your own" affair.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9×25mm_Dillon


    As for the 357 Sig, if I was looking for something for bears, I'd want something a bit bigger. For coyotes, feral dogs, feral bipeds, and other woodsy encounters, the 357 would work great.
     
  15. gandog56

    gandog56 Member

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    One problem there, stud. I HATE Glocks! :cuss:

    They do not make one single model pistol that feels good in my small, short fingered hand, and their grip angle seems wrong to me. I like a 1911 SO much better.

    Both my 10mm pistols are 1911's, now show me who makes a barrel in that caliber for THEM! :cool:
     
  16. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    Yes, the 9x25mm Dillon is the 10mm case necked down to 9mm.

    The point of the Dillon is to stuff it with slow burning powder, to make USPSA Major and even more important to produce a lot of gas to optimize the effectiness of the multi-port compensator.

    The crack of the Dillon igniting is very impressive to say the least, but the gases caused the muzzle to hardly lift at all in recoil
     
  17. Corpral_Agarn

    Corpral_Agarn Member

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    357 SIG is one of my favorite cartridges for up in the woods because I get to have 11 of them on board and a spare 10 in my pocket. Also they are lighter to carry than 180gr .40 loads so that is nice. But like others have said, its no .357 Mag (especially in the heavier loadings)

    They tend to be a little loud, recoil a bit (not uncontrollable), and produce a pretty cool muzzle flash (which may be bad at nighttime if you have to use it) but I have been impressed with its performance both on gel blocs and through barriers.
    I often carry the Hornady xtp 147gr instead of the 124gr up in the hills though. On the tests that I found the 147 penetrates a few extra inches and expands to like .50 (or something like that: youtube vid)

    Its a nice round, imho.
     
  18. gandog56

    gandog56 Member

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    Second question, anybody make standard reloading dies for it that don't cost an arm and a leg?
     
  19. kyhunter

    kyhunter Member

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    Hornady has a set for 60 dollars. Not cheap but not too awful bad. There are several brands that make them. Pick your flavor
     
  20. jim243

    jim243 Member

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    I must have missed the 115 grain and 147 grain load data in my books for the 357 Sig. Truth be told, there are very few 9mm bullets that can be used with the 357 Sig. Because of the short neck on the case a round nose or standard hollow point can not be used with out bullet set back on that round.

    In addition to the extra pressure from the round over and above what a 40 S&W will produce the blast from a 357 SIG is a lot noisier and flash like a cannon.

    That is why they are less popular than you would think.

    This is a 357 Sig

    Jim

    IMG_1492.jpg
     
  21. jim243

    jim243 Member

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    Yes, Lee or you could just purchase mine, I do not use them (PM me)

    Jim
     
  22. beatledog7

    beatledog7 Member

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    Yes, you do have to be careful in selecting bullets for 357 Sig, but I'm not prepared to agree that "very few 9mm bullets" can be used. I select bullets whose bearing surface will be in contact with the neck interior over the neck's entire length, so lead bullets, with their lube groove, are pretty much out. I've learned from threads here (though I was at first skeptical of this) that using a slow powder which "fills" the case seems to support the bullet and helps ward off setback. AA#9 pretty much does this at book load levels and is a 357 Sig crowd favorite, though I'm finding the faster burning HS-6 to be more accurate.

    I have successfully loaded and fired 124-grain XTPs seated to OALs of 1.140" to 1.162" with no discernible setback issues (Lone Wolf G31 barrel in G22 Gen4). Over the weekend I loaded a few 100-grain plated flat nose "380" bullets and a few with 147-grain XTPs, pretty close to the top and bottom of the bullet weight range. When I get a chance to hit the range I'll let you know the results.
     
  23. PabloJ

    PabloJ Member

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    That is what Virginia State Police are equipped with. I would not touch gun so chambered with flag pole. It's worth couple squirty ones over 7,62x25mm.
     
  24. Bovice

    Bovice Member

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    Any flat nose 124 FMJ bullet works fine. Most bullets of that kind are plated and.not actually FMJ though, and plated bullets will not survive 357 SIG speed without being downloaded. Defeats the purpose of 357 SIG to do such a thing. So, I put nosler 124 JHPs in mine or hornady 124 grain XTPs. The bowlers seemed to work the best.

    The blast is something to consider. Every time I shot it at the range, people were either intrigued or really agitated. I used it in IDPA once, that got a lot of surprised reactions. Shooting it between barrels rang my bell pretty good and I decided then that it wasn't going to be a first choice caliber, ever.
     
  25. mdauben

    mdauben Member

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    If my main concern was 2-legged predators, a semiauto in 357SIG (or 9mm, or .40S&W or .45ACP) would be my preference, too. If medium-large wild animals, on the other hand, were the problem I'd much rather have my 686 loaded with something like Buffalo Bore 180gr ammo. :)
     
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