short barrel
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No, Mr. Dalton. I didn't say leave home without your .380. If that's all you have you should carry it. <deleted>
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38 special or .380?
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Arkansas Paul
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That's good to know.
I'm playing around with different carry methods right now in the summer months when wearing as few clothes as possible. I've got a Taurus 709 Slim that carries fairly well, but I've been looking for an excuse to buy another small pistol anyway.
I'm thinking of something like this:
http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/21_39_1806/products_id/26306
I already load for .38 so I have literally thousands of rounds ready to go.
Hometeached1
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Arkansas Paul, I can't say you'll love it, but I really like mine. It can be lively with the stock grips and +P ammo. You might want to try Federal Nyclad 125gr. for carry ammo because it does not recoil much on account it was designed for J-frames. Gold Dot 135gr.+P recoils more, but is manageable.
Pachmayer's compac grip really helps with recoil and you can still pocket carry with them.
Pachmayer's compac grip really helps with recoil and you can still pocket carry with them.
Arkansas Paul
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I've fired a cylinder of 158 grainers through a scandium .357 and let me just tell you, it is a handful. I figure as long as it isn't close to that, I'll be okay.
ljnowell
Member
I am willing to bet you would be happy with that. I actually wanted a 638. That's the model with the shrouded hammer you can still cock for single action. I ended up with one if these instead:
http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/mobile/product/26309/s&w_m637_5rd_38sp_+p_187
Just because of the deal I got on it. I am very pleased with it though and really don't feel that the exposed hammer matters at all for ccw as some will lead you to believe.
I shoot my bullseye loads for target practice and then run a couple cylinders of the hot stuff after every practice. I have a nice carry load using 125 gr JHP and Power Pistol. I found that the fixed sights on mind shoot 125s to point of aim.
BLU
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ljnowell....
You're going to like that. I got my Daughter one of those. After getting my first Chief's Special in 1976, I soon learned, (it's now a habit), to put my thumb, (or index finger depending on the pocket), over the hammer while I pull the gun out of my pocket to keep the hammer from grabbing anything. It's such a natural sequence now that I find myself doing that when I draw the LCR, which of course doesn't have a hammer.... but old habits die hard!
You're going to like that. I got my Daughter one of those. After getting my first Chief's Special in 1976, I soon learned, (it's now a habit), to put my thumb, (or index finger depending on the pocket), over the hammer while I pull the gun out of my pocket to keep the hammer from grabbing anything. It's such a natural sequence now that I find myself doing that when I draw the LCR, which of course doesn't have a hammer.... but old habits die hard!
My , what a lively discussion. I vote .38 , for reasons of reliability and "shootability". I am a much better shot with a J-Frame than with any compact .380. That stated , I am not a .380 basher. I like my PPK a great deal , and the little 1911-ish Sig .380 is on my wish list. (the model designation escapes me...)
BLU
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Waveski... Like you, I switch between the two rounds as well! Carried the Chief's Special yesterday. Today it's the Sig P238, (the mini-1911) in .380. Seriously, I'd feel more secure carrying my .45ACP, (if only I could hide it in shorts and a T-shirt)! Shot placement is critical, of course, but I doubt a BG will be wearing much more than I am and a T shirt hardly slows down a .380 round.
dickydalton
Member
I guess that if your barrel is short you might need a larger round. I think 8 95 grain bullets in the right spot are better than 5 125 grain bullets that aren't.
I have plenty more but most aren't that small and the 380 isn't the main one.
ljnowell
Member
That's why I like 5 either 158 or 125 grain bullets in the right spot! Lol.
Seriously though, the modern loading a in 380 have enough power to get the job done. In my opinion they are the lowest I would go, but they are sufficient. I stick with my 38s because I shoot bullseye competitively with a double action revolver so the technique comes very natural to me. For others it doesn't, one should always chops what's best for them, not the doofus like me on the internet.
MCgunner
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I prefer my .38 ballistically, but there are times that I carry my .380 for back up anyway. I wouldn't wanna be shot with it. I usually have a .38 revolver on me, though, and it backs up my .357 revolvers if I'm belt carrying one. A speed strip of .38 will fit either gun.
I like the .380 to back up my .45 because it holds 12 rounds in a package the size of a Ruger LCP, just a little fatter and 12 ounces unloaded (Grendel P12) so no reload is carried for the BUG, only a spare .45ACP magazine.
See, there's just more to the decision for me than raw ballistics, especially between two calibers that are close enough in effectiveness.
I like the .380 to back up my .45 because it holds 12 rounds in a package the size of a Ruger LCP, just a little fatter and 12 ounces unloaded (Grendel P12) so no reload is carried for the BUG, only a spare .45ACP magazine.
See, there's just more to the decision for me than raw ballistics, especially between two calibers that are close enough in effectiveness.
David E
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No kidding?
But that's not the comparison.
Which is better, five rounds of .38 in "the right spot," or 8 rounds of .380?
For pure horsepower, few will argue the .380 surpasses the .38, but that depends on load selection. A lightly loaded 110 wadcutter will be surpassed by the Buffalo Bore 100 grain @ 1042 fps (2.75" barrel) AND be easier to shoot out of a Glock 42
As some mentioned, raw ballistics isn't the only consideration. Another basic question is, what platform allows the most ballistic payload on/in the target in the shortest time?
But if you can handle each platform well with "serious" loads, THEN which do you choose?
orionengnr
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Sorry, but that is a trite and tired argument. A 642 is not a 6" M29.
jimbo555
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For me it comes down to reliability. The revolver wins in my opinion.
Vodoun da Vinci
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Exactly and thank you for the clarity.
I have both and shoot /carry both and hand load for both .38 and .380. I have shot .38/.357 mag for all of my shooting life (over 40 years) and only recently, with the release of the Glock 42 become proficient and experienced with the .380. I'll have to add that in my experience, and in the experience of a small "support group" we have formed here, the short barreled .38 snubbie is about the hardest gun to shoot well next to short barreled .357 and larger caliber, short barreled revolvers. Snubbie revolvers are just plain hard to shoot well/accurately and if one adds the SD aspect with rapid accurate follow ups it becomes a serious issue for all but the most experienced and best shooters. One has to be pretty serious to get good with a .38 short barreled revolver...it cannot be a casual relationship.
The .380, especially in the G42 platform, delivers much better results in the hands of most of our local support group members...the group was formed out of frustration and to allow folks to share guns and techniques as well as philosophy and mindset. All of the members are "casual" shooters...they want to protect themselves and their families and they wanna carry concealed. None of them have the time or mindset to become handgun aficionados - they don't participate on gun boards not follow the handgun fancy and have no desire to become "Gun Fighters". They are "normal" plain old people. Guns are tools to them - they want the best tool that suits them.
Our G42 and several other .380's have been completely reliable in the hands of multiple shooters as have other .380's like the Walther PPK/s, S&W Bodyguard, Ruger LC380 and others. While they do not offer the pure horsepower per round of a classic .38 snubbie they carry as well if not better and deliver much more accurate/faster follow ups and higher capacity/faster reload than the Ruger LCR's, S&W, and other .38 snubbies.
I feel that if one has the training and mindset to be a "professional" hand gunner then one can realize the advantage of the sheer horsepower of the .38 but for "plain old folks" who are not handgun aficionados and cannot "master" the .38 snubbie platform a good .380 fills 90% of the bill. I personally carry and shoot both .38 and .380 and I'm pretty dang good if I say so myself but if push comes to shove I feel more confident with my Wife's G42 .380 in a 12' - 15' shootout (Heaven forbid it ever comes to that) if I happen to be caught without my 9mm. I'd give 'em hell with my Ruger LCR, no doubt. But that Glock 42 can put 4 rounds in a 4" circle in less than a second at 21' and this is with *hot* .380 hand loads. And I have seen it do that in the hands of several of my Wife's Girl Friends who, until they shot a .380 or .32 pistol, simply did not feel confident carrying or shooting the larger caliber pistols and revolvers their coaches, instructors, boy friends and Husbands started them with. 2 of these ladies qualified for CCL with .38 revolvers and *never* carried them (will not carry them) as they cannot master them. They came to the group to find options because they really want to carry and feel safer and they have found that confidence in a .380 pistol.
I still feel that both calibers and platforms have their place as carry and SD guns. I just feel that in the hands of "average joe" folks who want to carry for SD and are not inclined to become Gun Fighters a good/reliable .380 is every bit as functional in the real world as a .38 revolver.
VooDoo
As between .38 Spl and .380, I'd go with the .38 Spl. I guess the bottom line for me is that I just have more confidence in the round (.38 Spl) and the platform (.38 revolver vs. .380 semi). Neither round will ever be hailed as The Manstopper of the Century, but (while I'm not a ballistics expert, my understanding is that) either will do its part if I do mine. Yes, .380 semis tend to be thinner, but it's not like I'm trying to hide a pistol in my Speedo. (Please accept my apologies for that mental image.) The .38 snubs are small enough that I'd still be willing to dress around the gun.
ljnowell
Member
I disagree with the notion that a 38 snub is so difficult to shoot. We aren't shooting bullseye here, we don't need 1.5" groups.
I suppose the difficulty level depends on what is being compared. I often tote a 642 Smith revolver. I find it no more difficult to shoot than my old LCP or a S&W BG .380 with a factory trigger. However, the revolver is much more difficult to shoot well than my slicked up, reworked Sig 938. I tote the revolver because I can just put it in a pocket and go without a holster.
dickydalton
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I'm thinkin' that anyone that decides to carry their 380 or their 38 Special is at least armed, even if they don't have a 45 Auto or a 44 Magnum!
Bert Retta
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38
50 years of LEO's and FBI Agents cannot be wrong,I have 3 semi-auto's and carry my 1973 Colt 38 Detective Special more than any of them..with the Critical Defense rounds available today its heads above a 380 ,IMO when of the Best Conceal and Carry firearms every made to this very day.
50 years of LEO's and FBI Agents cannot be wrong,I have 3 semi-auto's and carry my 1973 Colt 38 Detective Special more than any of them..with the Critical Defense rounds available today its heads above a 380 ,IMO when of the Best Conceal and Carry firearms every made to this very day.
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Bert Retta
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M1GarandDeerHunter
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Think I would just carry my Model 10 M&P .38spl with +P.
It depends on the guns. If for some reason I had to have a really small gun, a .380 would be fine. If the size doesn't matter as much, and we're talking 7 or 8 rounds of .380 vs 6 rounds of .38, then I'd go for the .38. If we're talking medium or service sized guns and the .380 is a double stack with 12-15 rounds, then I'd go with the .380.
jimbo555
Member
" why would anyone choose a large double stack 380 over a similar size 9mm".. I prefer my Beretta 84bb over the double stack 9mm I've tried [ Keltec p11 and Glock 19]. It is more reliable than the former and points better than the latter. I know I haven't tried them all but I haven't found one that matches the Beretta's features and ergos. My new to me Colt Cobra is my primary as of today.
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