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44 Special Pet Loads???

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by Float Pilot, Oct 4, 2012.

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  1. the Black Spot

    the Black Spot Member

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    Did some checking and best I can figure they are running about 650 fps. If I jump to 3f I might get 675-700 fps. I am waiting on a .429 sizer then I can seat bullets out a little farther and get another 5 gr of powder which should boost velocity over 700 fps for sure.
     
  2. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    Driving up the hwy today on PRIMER QUEST... (150 mile round trip)
    For some reason the Winchester standard primers give me about 50 fps more velocity than the CCI standard primers. The Remington's loose even more...
     
  3. the Black Spot

    the Black Spot Member

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    For some reason I have always stuck with cci, but have used federal in the past
     
  4. Eb1

    Eb1 Member

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    I always find that Winchester primers seem to work better for me. I did a test with my .25-06 same powder load, brass, bullet, and OAL.

    It was between CCI, CCI Mag, and Win. It was very eye opening how the primer affected accuracy.
    I have done this with the .44 SPC and .44 Mag. Same results.
     
  5. the Black Spot

    the Black Spot Member

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    More searching revealed a post on the high road where someone referenced the Lyman black powder manual which listed 23.5 gr of 2f with a 240 gr cast bullet at 829 fps.
    Sound reasonable?
     
  6. Fatelvis

    Fatelvis Member

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    7 grns Unique under any 240 grn lead bullet. Mild and accurate!
     
  7. the Black Spot

    the Black Spot Member

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    Found this in a "shoot!" Magazine article

    44 special w-w cases cci 350 primers
    240 gr RN bullet
    25 gr of elephant 2f - 660 fps
    21.4 gr of goex 2f - 700 fps
    24.4 gr of Swiss 2f - 840 fps
    Charge determined by volume. Weight shown for reference only.

    Same mag different article

    Lyman 429383 250 gr RN 7.5" barrel
    26 gr goex 2f - 770 fps
    26 gr of goex 3f - 823 fps
     
  8. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    Early .44 Special Black Powder Factory Loads article

    http://www.leverguns.com/articles/44special.htm


    I am back... the road was water on ice, dark on the way home with a couple moose here and there...

    Most of the primers were gone but I found a few hundred by driving around to various places. I could not find any more 44 special brass....
    My neighbor from down the road went up with me... He wanted a couple AR-15 magazines and a couple Glock magazines... Boy was he in for a rude surprise....
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2012
  9. the Black Spot

    the Black Spot Member

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    Glad u made it back safe

    Thanks for the link
     
  10. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    I had a couple e-mails and a pm ABOUT THE AA#5 loads.

    I double checked and yes it was 9.0 grains of AA#5 for the 240 grain SWC, for 803 fps from the 2.1 inch Taurus.

    On page 936 of the Speer #14, they show 8.4 to 9.3 grains of AA#5 for a 250 grain semi wadcutter.

    In the Hornady 7th edition (page 877) they show 8.9 grains of AA#5 for a 240 grain semi-wadcutter.

    I too was rather surprised because I thought it would be faster burning than Unique...

    I am thinking about trying some HERCO tomorrow if it stop with the freezing rain or wet snow...
     
  11. joneb

    joneb Member

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    You can't assume a powders burn rate based on weight.
    http://www.tacticoolproducts.com/powder.pdf
    AA#5 is dense compared to Unique and occupies less volume at the same weight.
     
  12. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    I was thinking more along the lines of the burn rate charts... All of which show it being a little faster than Unique... But in this case it is slower...
    I have not played with AA#5 enough to see how it acts in a smaller or narrower case...
     
  13. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    Horrible day for a range session.....
    Rain & sleet on top of flooded ice, winds around 35 knots....

    I only managed to get a few loads tested before the Chronograph filled up with water...

    I tried some book loads to see if they were anywhere near as good as listed.
    Groups at 15 yards, Chronograph at 10 feet


    Bullet: 240 grain Keith SWC
    Brass: Winchester
    Primer: Winchester large pistol
    Roll crimp, 1.480 inch col

    13.8 grains IMR 4227
    Taurus 2.1in = 667 fps and 1.5 inch group
    S&W 6.5 in = 765 fps and a 1.0 inch group
    Very DIRTY LOAD

    8.5 grain HS-6
    Taurus 2.1in = 737 fps and a 2.0 inch group
    S&W 6.5 in = 828 fps and a 1.5 inch group
    Clean cases

    6.7 grains HERCO
    Taurus 2.1in = 738 fps and a 2.5 inch group
    S&W 6.5 inch = 815 fps and a 0.50 inch group... Good load for longer barrel
    dirty cases
     
  14. ArkieVol

    ArkieVol Member

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    New guy...

    Just discovered this thread yesterday and hope y’all keep it going. I’m a .44 Spl fan, a relatively new reloader, and very interested in learning more. Reviewing old posts now.

    Bought my first chrono last year but haven’t even used it yet. I’m southern born and bred and no way I’m going to go shooting when it’s freezing. (I don’t think I’d last long in AK Float Pilot. :))

    In response to FP’s request for specs on the S&W 396 Night Guard:
    Outside diameter of cylinder
    1.560 in.
    Cylinder length
    1.62 in.
    Min. thickness between chambers
    Front, .170 in. - back, .130 in.
    Barrel length
    2.50 in.
    (my measurements and subject to review)

    Powders in inventory:
    Bullseye, Unique, 2400, HS-6, HP 38, Tite-Group, IMR 4227 & Trail Boss

    Looking forward to reading more and will contribute what I can when I can.
    JJ
     
  15. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    When I was a kid, the majority of folks in my area of Alaska ( the site of the last battles of the war of northern aggression with the Confederate States Cruiser CSS Shenandoah ) were of direct southern heritage. I am on both sides of the family...
    Although now that we have made some of Alaska safe for city folks, the carpet-baggers have been arriving in force.

    Sounds like Unique and HP38 will be first up on your dance card..

    Are you measuring the barrel from where it starts at the forcing cone by the cylinder?
     
  16. ironhead7544

    ironhead7544 Member

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    The Skeeter Skelton load with a 250 gr Keith gave 845 fps from a 3 inch S&W 696. Should go about 800 fps in you 2 incher. For practice, I used a 200 gr lead bullet with a light charge of AA#2. Saves the gun and your hand.

    I was told by a Hornady rep that the 180 gr XTP 44 bullet was designed for the 44 Special velocities. It will begin to expand at 750 fps. Might be one to look at for a defense load.

    The Speer 200 gr Gold dot is also for the 44 Special. Factory 44 Special load went 820 fps from a 3 inch. There is also a 44 Magnum load for short barreled revolvers that goes about 1000 fps but I havent chroned that load yet.
     
  17. ArkieVol

    ArkieVol Member

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    Night Guard

    S&W 396 NG

    Yes, measured with the cylinder open from the face of the forcing cone to the muzzle...Cabela's calipers.

    Without benefit of a chrono, the following are a few log notes on the 396:

    Missouri Bullets RNFP 200g

    Trail Boss 5.3g - med/heavy recoil in 396, med in 21 4"
    Bullseye 5.5g - good round
    HP-38 4.6g - accurate, med recoil, shoots low in 24 6.5"
    Tite-Group 5.0g - snappy in 396, good carry
    HS-6 9.0 - NO in 396, very stout

    Missouri Bullets SWC 240g

    HP 38 4.6g - snappy in 396, med in 624 4"
    Tite-Group 4.7g - med/heavy recoil

    Penn Bullets DEWC 185g (Will not reorder)

    Trail Boss 5.7g - stout, good carry 396
    Trail Boss 3.2g - Charter Bulldog (sold) ok
    JJ
     
  18. 3006mv

    3006mv Member

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    I loaded up a few Lee 429-214-SWC w/ HS6, lubed w/ Rooster Jacket (no longer being produced); but forgot to run them through the LFC die (I don't crimp with it, I just try to smooth out the brass) {When I first loaded for my only .44 special, a Charter Arms bulldog circa current 2012, I ran them through the Lee sizer and used the Lee FCD, this caused a leaded barrel} so I usually just tumble lube then load and run through the sizer part of the FCD just so they chamber in my cylinders, I think they may be kinda tight. So at my last range session I only got to shoot about half of my loads. They were hitting low, I may adjust my charge, I may look for a TL design too in another weight possibly before I go filing down my front sight.
     
  19. the Black Spot

    the Black Spot Member

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    Hey another Arkansan!
     
  20. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    I have a couple boxes of both, but my snubbie does not like them. The old 6.5 inch M-24 likes them fine... Too bad that is not the other way around...
     
  21. the Black Spot

    the Black Spot Member

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    Checked out more blackpowder rounds today. Shot these from my 7.5" uberti.
    255 gr wheel weight cast bullet - cci 300 primer- win case
    Bullet sized .429 lubed with 50/50 beeswax/olive oil
    Compressed load
    15 yds two hand hold kneeling - both loads shot to point of aim
    25 gr of 2f - @730 fps - 4" group
    25 gr of 3f - @800 fps - 3" group
     
  22. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    I wonder how pistol Pyrodex would work... ??
    I have a can or Clean Shot or Clear shot around here someplace... The stuff they made for short while before the factory burned down...I tried it in the past in my old 38 WCF (38-40) and it really worked well.

    I had planned on loading tonight, but the wife made me come into the house to act civilized... Maybe I can toss together some more loads in the morning...

    The problem is that I am out of a couple powders that I wanted to try... HS-7 and 2400
     
  23. the Black Spot

    the Black Spot Member

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    Pyodex is a little cleaner but works well sometimes more accurate than bp.
    The clean shot or (American pioneer powder) is good, supposedly don't even have to use lube with it.

    My CA bulldog did well with 2400 and 200 gr cast bullets.
    My bulldog is next up for black powder rounds.
     
  24. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    WENT OUT AGAIN TODAY...

    Today was jacketed Hollow Point 180 grain Hornady XTP day....

    My snub nose generally hates them. All shot 5 to 7 inches low from the Taurus. But some loads made nice groups.

    Temp 25 degree, light snow. Target 15 yards, chronograph at 10 feet.

    Bullet: 180 grain Hornady XTP
    Brass: Winchester, 3rd firing
    Primer: Winchester Large Pistol
    COAL: 1.485, Heavy Roll Crimp into cannelure.
    average of ten shots each gun
    Taurus M-445 2.1 inch barrel and S&W M-29 6.5 inch barrel

    10.6 grains AA#5 = 887 fps for Taurus 2 inch group. 959 fps for S&W, 1.0 in grp. Clean Load

    7.0 grains TiteGroup= 880 fps from Taurus (0.75in grp): 930 fps S&W (0.50in grp) Clean load.

    7.3gr TiteGroup= 896fps from Taurus (0.50in grp) 975fps from S&W (0.40 one hole) Very Clean

    6.5gr Green Dot = 830 fps (1.0 in grp) Taurus: 886fps S&W (0.75 in grp)
    Clean Load


    6.7 gr Green Dot = 886 fps (1.5 inch grp Taurus); 930 fps and 1.0 inch S&W.

    8.0gr Hodgdon Universal= 850fps (1.5in grp Taurus): 960fps and a 0.50in grp S&W. Some soot.
     
  25. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    Has anyone tried some of the Vihtavouri powders in the 44 SPECIAL ???

    I have never been able to figure out how to pronounce the name....


    The way things are going, the 44 Special might make another come-back in 5 and 6 shot coat pocket thumpers...
     
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