44 Special

[300Whspr]

Howdy guys,

Just getting active again in handloading after an 8~10 year hiatus... I used to shoot IHMSA silhouette competition back in the 90's... so I've got a bit of handloading experience under my belt.

CCW has gotten me back shooting again, and I just loaded up a bunch of 44 Special Unique/200gr hardcast flat roundnose rounds for practice with my CA Bulldog... it's not my carry gun, but it is my nightstand gun.

Anyway, yesterday I picked up some Speer Gold Dot 200gr 44 Special bullets.

Just wondering if anyone has any pet loads for these? Suitable powders I have on hand would be, if I can remember:

Bullseye
Red Dot
Green Dot
Blue Dot
Unique
2400
H110
Universal
Clays
AA#5
TiteGroup
Herco
I even have about half a pound of Alcan #5

Anyway, has anyone ever loaded any of the Gold Dot's for PD? What worked for you, especially if you're using them in a Bulldog?

Thanks!

Brian

 

[joneb]

I have had good results with W-231, Accurate #5, and VV- n340 for a 2.5" and 3" 44 spl neither are Charter Arms.
W-231 with 200gr XTP or Nosler JHP is potentially most accurate, Accurate #5 gives a good balance of Accuracy and velocity, VV n340 produced the most velocity with acceptable accuracy.
I like Unique but it does not meter well for me and when loading at max it made me nervous.
I have some Blue Dot I will try soon for this application I think it will work well but like Unique I will be weighing the charges.
This is from Hornady's 8th,
View attachment 217003
View attachment 217004
This maybe useful http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=679964

 

[shootniron]

I have used Bullseye, Unique and 2400 to good effect with cast bullets in 44 special. Also, my son just bought a new Bulldog this week and I have some 200gr GD's that we will be working up a load for the Bulldog, with. So, I will be sure to keep an eye on this thread to see where it goes. And, I will post our results when we get started over the Christmas holiday. We will run ours over the chrono and test them for expansion and penetration as we want the best PD ammo that we can put together.

 

[Mad Chemist]

That 200gr GD is an excellent SD bullet for for a .44spl. I had very good luck with Unique for similar applications with a Taurus revolver that was in the same size and weight class as the Charter Arms Bulldogs.

I kept the charges just barely above the mid range data.

 

[Zeke/PA]

My favorite powder with the .44's both Magnum and Specials is Unique !
I get accurate loads using this powder in both cartridges !

 

[ROAshooter]

Unique....works great in 44 special

 

[300Whspr]

Thanks guys!

Unique has been working good for hardcast 200 grainers... my old Speer manual shows Unique with the highest velocity for 200gr JHP's... but it doesn't have the gold dot bullets listed. I'll have to give it a try... and Herco too I think.

I'll post my results when I get a chance to get some loaded up to experiment with.

 

[RealGun]

Looking at your powder list and the Speer manual for that bullet, powders in order of performance, high to low, are as follows:

• Universal
• AA #5
• Titegroup
• Bullseye
• Red Dot
• Unique

I wouldn't push any Charter Arms very hard, so I would use the starting loads given. I equate 44 Special with Unique, but not in a Charter Arms, so my bias would be toward 7.0 gr Unique, ranging to 7.8. My personal load for S&W and Ruger is 7.5 in lead and max charge in jacketed.

 

[Drail]

After years of using Red Dot, Bullseye, 2400 and various others I have found that Unique always gives the highest velocities with the lowest pressures. I have also been carrying a Bulldog Pug for many years and found the best load for it is any 200 gr. bullet @ about 850 - 900 fps. Any thing over that is going to shorten the life of the gun and just makes follow up shots much harder. While I have never seen anyone blow a Bulldog from handloads I HAVE seen a number that were shot loose by hot loads. 850 fps with a 200 gr. bullet is plenty of power if you can place it where it needs to go. The Charter is a lightly built revolver and will not hold up as long as a Smith or Ruger but will give good service if loads are kept reasonable.

 

[mdi]

I've tried a bunch of powders for my .44 Special, but found best combustion/ignition at Special pressures came with powders no slower than Unique or Universal...

 

[PapaG]

That Bulldog is a lightweight. I have an original and don't stray from factory or factory equivalent loads. My favorite load is the Lyman 429421 cast about 1-16 over 6.5 grains of Unique. I carry mine on the farm when mushroom hunting with two Speer shot caps and three of those loads.
I go up to 7, 7.5 Unique for my 624 and my 44 special Blackhawk.

 

[300Whspr]

My Bulldog is a 2001 vintage... I purchased it new right after 9-11, so it was likely built mid year 2001. It has Charter 2000 roll stamped on the right side of the bbl.

Are the 2nd generation (Charter 2000 and after) a little more stout than the originals? I know there were supposed to be quite a few improvements over the originals from the 70's.

 

[joneb]

(Charter 2000 and after) a little more stout than the originals?

I don't know, but if the shell extraction is sticky that can be a sign that the load is over pressure.

 

[PapaG]

I think they are still alloy frame. Dont know if barrels have a separate shroud on the newer ones.

 

[Don McDowell]

In your Bulldog, I'ld suggest looking at loads using Bullseye or the Reddot. Unique is about the best powder for the 44 special, but in that short barreled gun the faster powders will be a bit more efficient.

 

[zb338]

The guy that said Unique hit the nail on the head. I have
a Ruger Vaquero in .44 Magnum. I loaded .44 special cases
with every kind of bullet I could think of and the gun just
wouldn't shoot. A friend gave me some of his Keith 250 grain
bullets. A max load of Unique and that Keith bullet will shoot
like gang busters.
Zeke

 

[gotboostvr]

I liked red dot for extra light loads, 2400 for heavy loads but honestly Unique will do everything from light to warm. Just not quite "mousefart" to "minimagnum"
In the 44 special one would be very well served with just Unique.

 

[300Whspr]

I think they are still alloy frame. Dont know if barrels have a separate shroud on the newer ones.

Just got out the magnet...

My Bulldog is all stainless steel... everything, even the trigger guard is stainless steel... the magnet doesn't lie

Were the original Bulldogs alloy framed?

To my eye, this revolver doesn't look any less stout than a Smith... what tends to go loose on them?

 

[300Whspr]

In your Bulldog, I'ld suggest looking at loads using Bullseye or the Reddot. Unique is about the best powder for the 44 special, but in that short barreled gun the faster powders will be a bit more efficient.

I liked red dot for extra light loads, 2400 for heavy loads but honestly Unique will do everything from light to warm. Just not quite "mousefart" to "minimagnum"
In the 44 special one would be very well served with just Unique.

I think for the PD loads, I'll load up a few with Unique, and I think I'd like to try some Herco too, just to see. I'll have to get out the chronograph and get some data. I've been playing with Bullseye and Red Dot in the wife's Smith 638 with some cast 125 RNFP's today... I like them both so far... but I've just been loading powderpuff loads for her. Red Dot seems to have a bit more bark than Bullseye. I'd like to see what they will do in the .44 Special also.

 

[gotboostvr]

Good call with the unique. Should be able to find something usable.

What charge are you using in the 638? I was using 4.2gr reddot under a 125gr plated FP bullet in my 637

 

[the Black Spot]

My dog eats 240 xtp with 5 gr of bullseye.(no gravy)

 

[300Whspr]

Good call with the unique. Should be able to find something usable.

What charge are you using in the 638? I was using 4.2gr reddot under a 125gr plated FP bullet in my 637

I loaded up 50 each of 3.3 grains Red Dot and 3.0 grains of Bullseye under a 120 grain cast RNFP. Powderpuffs for sure... not much recoil at all, even in the 638. The wifey has a bad flinch she needs to get control of... hopefully these will help her out.

 

[25-5]

I have used Titegroup for years to reload .44 spl and .45 colt. I only have a 4" 629 and only load mag brass to the different specs using lead for spl and JHP for the mags. I prefer W296 for mags, but Tightgroup works fine.

 

[PapaG]

Almost all the original Charter Arms guns had alloy frames. I think the first non-alloy one were the stainless versions. There have been a couple reorgs of the company and my experience has all been with the original guns....Bulldog, Police Bulldog, Target Bulldog, Off Duty and Undercover.

 

[Slamfire]

I have a Taurus M431 in 44 Spl, it is slightly heavier than a Charter Arms Bulldog. My 431 shoots to point of aim at 25 yards with 200 grain bullets. Obviously Taurus meant this to be used with the advanced 200 grain self defense loads on the market. My normal 44 Special loads with 240 grain bullets shot quite high. I was able to purchase 200 grain LSWC bullets, at an advertized brinell hardness of 13.

Your 200 grain jacketed will not have any issues with the same powder charges as my 200 LSWC's.

I used Unique as that is an exceptionally flexible powder, something I normally use in 44 Spl, and it did not let me down.

Since I got light leading at 6.0 grs Unique, and it shoot to point of aim with excellent accuracy, and it is the lightest recoiling of the test sequence, that is what I use in practice. I suspect I was pushing the pistol on the heavier loads.

Taurus M431 3" Barrel

240 LSWC 5.0 grs Red Dot thrown, Midway Brass CCI 500

Ave Vel = 684.1
Std Dev = 17.11
ES = 57.84
Low = 654.1
High = 712
N = 16
Shoots way high



205 LSWC 6.0 grs Unique thrown, Midway Brass WLP
T = 54 °F 11-Dec-04
Ave Vel = 789.6
Std Dev = 27.18
ES = 96.54
Low = 724.1
High = 820.6
N = 30
Accurate, shoots point of aim, light leading.



205 LSWC 6.5 Unique thrown, Midway Brass WLP
T = 54 °F 25-Nov-04
Ave Vel = 866
Std Dev = 16
ES = 52
Low = 839
High = 891
N = 11
Elevation good, but left; more leading



205 LSWC 7.0 grs Unique thrown, Midway Brass WLP
T = 57 °F 25-Nov-04
Ave Vel = 906
Std Dev = 16
ES = 56
Low = 876
High = 932
N = 15
elevation good but left: worst leading