.45 ACP w/ 230gr Rainier and Remington Primers

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I really wanted to try W231. Might have to run down to the gun show this weekend and grab a pound. I currently use xtreme 230 gr rn plated with 4.8 gr bullseye.
 
Thanks since I started on this forum my powder list is now has gone up. I usually get 800x and 700x for shotgun and just bullseye and 2400 for pistols and revolvers. Now I added unique & w231.
 
Thanks since I started on this forum my powder list is now has gone up. I usually get 800x and 700x for shotgun and just bullseye and 2400 for pistols and revolvers. Now I added unique & w231.
Like Walkalong said, two of the best all around powders.

My favorite pistol powders are W231 (HP-38), W540 (HS-6) and W296 (H110) even though I use at least a half dozen others for special applications. (like replica loads)

I could easily get along with W231, HS-6 and W296 as easily as others can get along with the other "powder trinity", Bullseye, Unique and 2400.
 
I finally got some chronograph data this afternoon:

Rounds: 34
High: 740.5
Low: 689.2
ES: 51.3
Avg: 715.7
SD: 11.8

The rounds were once fired Winchester brass, Remington 2-1/2 primers, 4.7gr Bullseye, and Rainier 230gr PRN. Just checked what's left of that batch and they're mostly 1.270" OAL, so maybe a little long. They chamber and cycle fine in my SA Champion Loaded, and I believe my friend ran some through a new Kimber this week with no problems. (I need to keep better notes.)

The brass wasn't too badly scattered or far flung, but it also didn't fall into a neat pile. A few of the cases hit me in the cheek. I noticed no pressure signs--still, I'll toss the cases into the tumbler and give them a close look in the morning.

My inclination is to load another batch at 5gr, shortened to 1.260" OAL. I've also got 1.260" 4.7gr that I haven't chronographed. In addition to better notes, I need to do a better job of defining my goals before going to the range. I was going to do some single-handed shooting, and then didn't. OTOH, I'm having fun with the new pistol and managed to drill a hole in the black dot today.

I came home from the gun show this weekend with Rainier 230gr PHP, Trucast 180gr SWC, and Trucast 230gr RN. I'll be playing with those over the next couple of weeks.

I threw a tennis ball out on the range this week. My third shot was a good one, and the ball bounced over the berm. Bummer. I thought it was a pretty dead tennis ball, but evidently not. Do you load them up with pennies before shooting them? I like aluminum cans--they jump pretty good if you hit them right.

Legs up... I think I learned that expression from my grandfather, who was a big horseracing fan. God bless him... his nickname was Riskit. He was a beautiful soul. He also loved golf and soccer. Thank you for prompting very nice memories.
 
Sherri,
I think I would take one smaller step before going to 5.0gr of Bullseye. Shorten the OAL to 1.260" with the 4.7gr then do the same thing with a 5.0gr loads, 1.270" and 1.260".

What you will learn is just how OAL (really, seating depth) affects pressure and velocity. Now, since this is from a 4" tube and not the 5" Government model, that is why you got a little less velocity than I did. 1" of barrel length with Bullseye is equal to about 30fps, depending.

Really, if your bullets feed at the longer OAL, I would leave it there as long as it doesn't hit the lands of the rifling. Getting bullets to feed in the 1911 has caused some folks to loose their hair. You must be doing something right! Congrats!

As for calibers to go to from here, any pistol caliber carbine would be a good choice. 357Mag, 44Mag or even one of the Marlin semi automatics in 45ACP.

Then all you will need is a companion revolver and ....... you will be good to go! (until the next "need" arises!)

Enjoy!
 
My inclination is to load another batch at 5gr, shortened to 1.260" OAL. I've also got 1.260" 4.7gr that I haven't chronographed.
I agree with Skip_a_roo, try the 4.7 ones before loading 5.0.
 
Went to the range yesterday and fired 4.7gr Bullseye 1.260" rounds:

Rounds: 40
High: 741.0
Low: 700.4
ES: 40.6
Avg: 724.1
SD: 8.3

I thought they felt a tad snappier. They also consistently struck the target below where I aimed.

I then shot a magazine each of 1.260" (this batch) and 1.270" (from the batch mentioned earlier) rounds using a support. The 1.270" rounds seemed to be more accurate.

Would you tinker with this further, and if so, how?
 
The numbers I look at when building/working up a load are the ES and SD numbers. Here is what I do to "pick" a load to start with. I have a bullet chosen first, that gives me a weight to start with. Then I look for a desired "normal" velocity. After that a powder that will produce that velocity in the middle range of it's load data.

Usually, most powders work best at the top of their data. Bullseye is one that will work well all the way through it's, again, usually. If I get single digit SD's, I am good to go.

Now, after that number satisfies me, I look to accuracy, not highest velocity. After SD, accuracy. If accuracy is good then I go to velocity. If it is below what I want, I will still have room to work up, again, usually. It may be that I have pressure signs at the middle and I have to work back down, not usually. :)


At any rate, the shorter barrel of your Champion is the culprit for the different points of impact, a little velocity, a little less dwell time in the barrel........usually a bit more recoil......may mean a lower strike on the target.

How does the load satisfy you? Is it what you want in a handgun load? How are follow-up shots? Does your hand hurt after a range session? Is this load combat accurate or tack driving accurate? Can I keep all of my shots in the 10 ring on a B27 target at 7 yards? Does the firearm function reliably with this load?

Just some of the things you can ask yourself as you work up loads, especially for self defense or self defense "games".

Personally, I think you have found the perfect load for your firearm. Of course, it is the perfect load I use in mine too! :)

Enjoy and be safe!
 
I think as far as where to go next skip a roo hit the nail on the head, get yourself a nice lever and a nice six shooter in the same caliber and have some fun down at the range.
 
For a cross-reference on the other data, here is Sierra's data on those powders at the 230gr bullet weight (from 5th edition):

Unique
5.2gr 700fps
5.6gr 750fps
6.0gr 800fps
6.4gr 850fps
6.8gr 900fps

Bullseye
4.0gr 700fps
4.3gr 750fps
4.6gr 800fps
4.9gr 850fps
5.2gr 900fps

Power Pistol
5.4gr 700fps
5.9gr 750fps
6.4gr 800fps
6.8gr 850fps
7.3gr 900fps

I've loaded a few thousands of them, via Dillon 650, metered, to .2 below max on both Bullseye and Unique before. I've loaded each to max on those powders when weighed individually by hand. I never load to max when metering on either the turret or progressive presses, flake powders tend to be +/- .2 grains on my Lyman powder tosser depending on how much powder is in the hopper pushing down on it. The Dillon is a bit tighter, but still, I see no reason to take a chance so I always err on the side of caution. I'm a programmer by day, so I need my hands to remain pretty. :)

EDIT: I've found as a general rule of thumb, starting lighter than the mid-point on Sierra's book will typically result in failure-to-eject stoppages on most semi-autos, so don't load up a big mess of light loads or you may have a frustrating day at the range. I've always skipped to the half way point in their book to start with, but that's my own decision.

I've never used power pistol, can't comment there.
 
I threw a tennis ball out on the range this week. My third shot was a good one, and the ball bounced over the berm. Bummer. I thought it was a pretty dead tennis ball, but evidently not. Do you load them up with pennies before shooting them? I like aluminum cans--they jump pretty good if you hit them right.

If the ground ever freezes where you live, and there's nothing in the way for a LONG way out, try tossing some golf balls out on the frozen ground; 15 yards out or so, you don't want to be shooting close to you, bullets hitting ice do very weird things. We're out in the country here, and the shallow part of my lake has a nice 80' hill behind it, with nothing but trees for miles behind.

For summer time fun, a sheet of plywood on the ground will give the balls something to bounce off of when they are hit, to much the same effect.

Those balls fly FOREVER. The bullet goes in, but doesn't come out the other side (we've found a couple, bullet inside). The golf ball captures a huge amount of the kinetic energy, the ice keeps it from burying itself in the ground... just all around good fun.

Tiger woods ain't got nothing on a well placed 45 ACP. :)
 
I appreciate the thoughtful responses. Thank you.

How do you determine the desired velocity for a given bullet?

The only information I've seen about desired bullet velocities was in Ayoob's Concealed Carry, where he talked about what's been effective for LEO in various calibers. That's all well and good, and advice taken to heart, but it doesn't help with what to shoot for with the 180gr LSWC I brought home this weekend. (I ordered a copy of Lyman's cast bullet manual, and I get that I've got the cart before the horse...)

My friend loaded some of these up with 5gr Bullseye at 1.275" and we ran them over the chronograph. We were getting good SD readings, but shooting too few rounds--it was late afternoon and the light was running out. They were difficult to load in the magazine, so a little shorter.

None of this sends me home with a sore hand and it's all been good cycling the slide.

I like pretty hands, too. Although, as I look at my hands, they're pretty neglected.

And now I must devote my attention to hosting my family for Christmas.

Have a very merry, everyone. Peace be with you.
 
What else could I do?

How do you determine the desired velocity for a given bullet?

Depends on what I am going to shoot it out of and the desired results.

Usually, I am trying to duplicate factory ammo; weight for weight and velocity for velocity.

Sometimes I am just trying to get that ornery cast boolit to put a nice hole in a piece of paper or move a tennis ball around a bit.

Maybe I am trying to slay that fire breathing dragon (read deer or hog) with a one shot drop.

I guess what I am trying to say is, depends! :) (Lots of help, ain't I! :) )

I do have a funny story pertaining to a 45ACP load though; goes like this:

Work, work, work! Man, that is all I have done in the past year, WORK!
It was getting in the way of my hobby, friends! :mad:
Well, I decided I was going to end the long dry spell of sending magnitudes and magnitudes of projectiles downrange!
So, the other day, I made a trip by the indoor range and gun store just to say "Hey" and let them know I was still alive. Talked with a bunch of the guys there and when I went to leave, one of the younger fellows hollered: "Hey, what kind of brass do you need?"
I tried to be humble and said: "Awe, I haven't been here in awhile and.... you don't need to do anything special and..... I have all I need and........." He said: "Wait a minute."
So, trying not to be rude, I did just that when low and behold, he came out with this:
45ACPcases.gif
Well, what could I do at that point? Let me ask you what you would do! Proudly proclaim: "I said I didn't need any brass?" Well, brothers and sisters, not me, I just said: "Thanks, thanks a lot!" and left.
What do you do when you get gifted about 1000 mostly once fired 45ACP brass? I'll tell you just what I did. I sent the wife out on a mission to find me something new to shoot it out of!
Since I had to work so much, I thought I would do some phone shopping and found just what I wanted:
G2145ACPcases1.gif
This is a Glock 21. It is the "SF" (short or slim frame) variety. I have had another G21 but it was the regular grip style and I had a hard time shooting it well. I wanted to try the smaller, different angled grip of the "SF" version.
This one was bought used. It has Glock night sights too and all for just a bit over $450 with tax.
Thursday night, I took it, son #2, son in laws #1 & #2 to the range with me and we "let fly" with some bullets! OH WHAT A TIME!
And this thing is a tack driver! Shooting the same loads out of it that I do my PT1911 and get great groups too.
Well, let me qualify that a bit, 4.7gr of Bullseye under a 230gr TMJ (Berry's).
I am not a big fan of striker fired handguns, I just don't usually shoot them well. This one I shoot almost better than my PT1911! (Not any of my wheel guns though! ;) )
Need to clean this baby now and look for an after market barrel so I can shoot my cast boolits out of it!

:D
 
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