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5.56 in .223?

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by xstuntman, Aug 31, 2009.

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  1. xstuntman

    xstuntman Member

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    I'm thinking of getting my first AR from DPMS and I heard from someone at work that 5.56 will not work in a .223 chamber. Truth?

    Thanks, Mike
     
  2. jpwilly

    jpwilly Member

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    Shouldn't do it...223 in 5.56 is okay not the other way around.
     
  3. hadmanysons

    hadmanysons Member

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  4. Frankl03

    Frankl03 Member

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    Most ARs are chambered in 556. You can shoot 223 in a rifle chambered in 556.
     
  5. Big44mag

    Big44mag Member

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    You can also use 5.56 in a 223 Wylde chamber which a few manufacturers use like White Oak, Rock River, Rainier, JP to name a few.
     
  6. BornAgainBullseye

    BornAgainBullseye Member

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    once again to all you so called internet experts.... If either round. is so different in pressure.... then wait for it......... WHY does both have the same muzzle velocity given the same weight bullet (55grain vs 55grain) ???? if either operated in a different pressure range then velocity would be up or down... We or anyone who has a micrometer has already established that the external dementions of 5.56 and .223 rem are external matches. The only difference is thickness of brass in some cases and a crimped primer which is NATO standard. The difference and only difference lies in the chamber. the nato chamber is a little long strictly for battlefield conditions and aiding in reliable extraction in very very cold or dirty weather. Once again My round count on my and my friends AR chambered in 5.56 is in the thousands yes plural. and we still hit MOA. We are reloading using a RCBS .223 remington small base die set. ZERO failures due to ammo. Only a few Pro Mag failures, but we solved that with a garbage can..... so now all you nay sayers bring the heat if you have your thong in a wad. Experience speaks for myself.
     
  7. longdayjake

    longdayjake Member

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    Okay, first of all they are saying that you shouldnt shoot 5.56 bullets out of a .223 chamber. You are shooting .223 reloads from a 5.56 chamber so your argument is moot.
     
  8. briansmithwins

    briansmithwins Member

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  9. Mr_Pale_Horse

    Mr_Pale_Horse Member

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    SAAMI - Sporting Arms and Ammuntion Manufacturing Institute = 5 parts marketeer, 4.5 parts lawyer, .5 part technical anything

    That link above contains 95% pure bunk, based solely on A) we want to sell ammo and can't compete against milsurp prices and B) the "we don't want to get sued" mentallity.

    First of all, many of those proscribed combinations simply will not chamber in the first place.

    Second, read and follow the manufacturer's recommendation on ammunition and not follow some third party industry lobby.
     
  10. CZguy

    CZguy Member

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    You beat me to it.

    Sometimes people don't let physics get in the way of a good opinion. :D
     
  11. Mr_Pale_Horse

    Mr_Pale_Horse Member

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    The rest of the story:
    Ken Warner, editor of Cartridges of the World, 6th Edition, 1989, by Frank C. Barnes

    sporting emphasis added by me

    File this one under "old wives tale."
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2009
  12. Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow

    Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow member

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    An AR with a match .223 chamber IS a "sporting rifle".
     
  13. Mr_Pale_Horse

    Mr_Pale_Horse Member

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    Sporting was emphasized by me to denote they want you to buy pricey sporting or match ammo, rather than cheap ball.

    A match ANYTHING will prefer custom, fire formed, neck turned, neck sized, handloaded, precision made rounds, to which every SAAMI manufacturer (other than reloading suppliers) says "Nay".
     
  14. taliv

    taliv Moderator

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    as a reloader, perhaps you can explain why published maximum pressures vary by powder for the same bullet.

    hmm....
     
  15. JonB

    JonB Member

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    If I recall correctly, SAAMI measures pressure differently than military. So the pressure argument isn't necessarily an apples to apples comparison if your measuement systems are different.

    Anybody know the military spec for velocity/pressure for 5.56mm 55gr pills?
     
  16. Tim the student

    Tim the student Member

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    Pot, meet Kettle. Kettle, this is pot.

    Um, so you are shooting .223 in a 5.56 chamber? Well, Mr. Pot, that is what is considered as safe.

    Thanks for verifying.
     
  17. taliv

    taliv Moderator

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    oh, and in my experience with the chrono, actual m193 shoots way faster than your run of the mill 55g 223rem like winchester white box or UMC
     
  18. Uncle Mike

    Uncle Mike Member

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    Obviously there may have been, in isolated and unique circumstances, failures of such...

    This would lead a agency such as SAMMI to issue precautionary or even mandatory directives concerning the matter. Cover your a$$, is a policy that extends to every governing body...

    As any of us who reload, test and monkey around with...even being drunk monkeys, various ammunition we see that only in very limited cases 5.56 being loaded to grossly higher pressures than good .223.

    I was told by an old timer...WOW, I have some stones to be talking, "old timer"... that
    .223 was indeed not as aggressive as 5.56 in the pressure category, reason being the military is concerned with reliable function...after all the AR/M-16 platform was designed as an 'use and toss' system.

    I do not adhere to that theorem!
     
  19. briansmithwins

    briansmithwins Member

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    Got any citations of manufacturer's saying that 5.56 NATO is safe in .223 Rem chambered weapons?

    Links?

    BSW
     
  20. CMP

    CMP Member

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    Well xstuntman you can be on the safe side and get it in 5.56 to begin with, my DPMS is in 5.56.
     
  21. Mr_Pale_Horse

    Mr_Pale_Horse Member

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    Ruger:

    The Mini-14 manual states that the .223 Remington(5.56mm) or 6.8mm Remington SPC cartridge models are:

    Conversely, the manual specificly states:

    Their emphasis, not mine this time.

    So, put away the broad brush. Read your owners manual. Not all 223 models can, but not all cannot use 5.56 mm Ball.
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2009
  22. Onmilo

    Onmilo Member

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    The word is all new non match grade DPMS rifles now come with 5.56 NATO chamber dimensions.
    Older DPMS rifles should be headspace checked for NATO chamber, many or most will display chamber closer to commercial .223 Chamber.

    Bolt action sporting rifles should never be fired with NATO dimension cartridges but any rifle with a non chrome lined chamber can be easily reamed to 5.56 NATO dimensions which will aloow commercial or NATO dimension cartridges to be fired safely.

    The gunsmith reaming any chamber should also clearly mark the chamber 5.56 NATO to avoid confusion.
     
  23. Neo-Luddite

    Neo-Luddite Member

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    Get it in writing from the maker of the specific weapon you are buying.

    As said, with Ruger being a GREAT example; most Mini's are marked .223 but WILL handle 5.56 NATO. THEY SAY SO.

    Call the company--get it IN WRITING.
     
  24. CoRoMo

    CoRoMo Member

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    Anyone ever heard of a single instance where 5.56 ammo caused a problem in a .223 gun?

    Anyone believe litigious apprehension was not a factor in SAAMI's position?
     
  25. JonB

    JonB Member

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    Never heard/read of an instance where 5.56 caused an issue in a .223. I would have thought that such a story (if exists) would have certainly popped up here or over at arfcom.

    May have been a factor years and years ago, but does anyone believe that gun makers don't factor in 5.56 pressure when designing a .223 gun?
     
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