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5.7x28mm? Pfft, that's a piker/wannabe round...

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by GunGoBoom, Jul 24, 2005.

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  1. GunGoBoom

    GunGoBoom member

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    look at this one:

    http://www.reedsammo.com/Page.html

    From the site owned by a THR member, a Mr. Reed, no less. I've already emailed him to ask to hold a barrel for me.

    :what: :D
     
  2. GunGoBoom

    GunGoBoom member

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    Anyone have a comment?
     
  3. Third_Rail

    Third_Rail Member

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    Kind of like the .450 Bond one? 2200FPS out of a pistol, 45 caliber bullet, 100 grains.
     
  4. Coronach

    Coronach Moderator Emeritus

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    Interesting.

    And me with a CZ-52.

    Hmm.

    Hmm hmm hmm.

    Mike :D
     
  5. Onmilo

    Onmilo Member

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    I still don't get it,,,,,,,
    Are we trying to sell our proprietary wildcat here????
     
  6. KriegHund

    KriegHund Member

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    FUUUUUUNNNNNN!!!!!

    Still like the 5.7x28mm better though :D
     
  7. Medusa

    Medusa Member

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    5.7x28 was specially designed to be a light and fast round able to penetrate soft body armour (CRISAT) up to 200m, same time minimizing collateral damage - round doesn't penetrate human body as the round flips its nose up like 7.62 russian and thus making a mortal wound. Or short, shoot to kill with 1 round regardless what the BG is wearing.

    Short answer.
    5.7x28 is a combat round and designed as such, any .22 is not. Thus this comparision is similar to Bradley vs SUV
     
  8. KriegHund

    KriegHund Member

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    But it would still be fun.

    What about really long bullets for your .22, WOuld that not cause quite a bit of tumbling?

    With a max limit of at least 60 grains it seems like it could be done relativly easily.

    Accuracy though...heh....

    Taht was probably a stupid idea. Wouldnt the length cause the bullet to become unstable and go AWOL?
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2005
  9. Brian Williams

    Brian Williams Moderator Emeritus

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    Somebody has been loading up the 30 sabots for 22 for a while in 7.62x25 and they look to be a hoot this 22 Reed follows suit without the sabot.
     
  10. Medusa

    Medusa Member

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    5.7x28 is quite accurate up to 200m due to low loss in speed and thus a flat trajectory, after that it looses the speed tremendously, thus limiting it's effective range to beforementioned 200m. it goes awol indeed after that, but low speed and light weight makes it not too dangerous. .22 sabot is a different thing from .22 bullet, as usually the sabot is more like a flechette with small cross section coupled with high speed. This is not a try to bring down the .22, but more like reasoning the 5.7x28 beings. Anyway, the 5.7x28 is an originally intended military/LEO round, not a civilian one, maybe this is a main difference. Anyway I would prefer the 5.7 over a .22 anytime :evil:
     
  11. pauli

    pauli Member

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    sounds a lot more like cargo van vs suv... and all anybody here is doing is hauling.
     
  12. GunGoBoom

    GunGoBoom member

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    Medusa, I take some exception to your assertions:

    As a general proposition, bullets don't lose/shed velocity at different rates at different ranges (other than can be accounted for as a factor of actual velocity, and thus wind drag). But a poor-BC bullet is a poor BC bullet at all ranges, an intermediate is intermediate at all ranges, and a good is good at all ranges. Therefore, your statement is quite misleading. And the little pill in the 5.7 has a fairly poor BC. It does indeed have a pretty decent trajectory due to its high speed, but it is losing speed "tremendously" all the way along, both before and after 200m. In fact, being a fairly poor BC shape/SD, it loses much more relatively at shorter ranges, due to more wind drag, due to more velocity. It's just that it has a high speed to begin with, and so still shoots *somewhat* flat out to 200. In any event, the Reed round with a 45 grainer would have loads and loads more energy than the 5.7 at 150+ yards. Now, to the extent that this defeats the purpose of the 5.7 round (safety to innocents in the crossfire downrange, etc.), then this is a *bad* thing, not a good thing. But if your principal concern is lethality, and fear of harming bystanders is low on your scale of priorities, the Reed round might be superior. And, one could select a bullet choice which tumbles, since one has to reload the round anyway. To that end, IINM, I've seen bags of bullets for sale at gun shows which are pulled bullets from 5.45x39mm rounds (the poison pill). I know I've seen pulled penetrator .223 bullets (steel core), and I *think* the 5.45 ones as well (although I could have faulty memory on that score, since it wouldn't make sense to sell a .221 bullet instead of a useful .223/.224 bullet). But at the very least one could use the identical bullets to those in a civilian config 5.7 - same bullet that tumbles, going faster, is still gonna tumble, and cause more damage doing it.

    I'm not sure what you mean, since the 5.7mm round *IS* "a .22".

    The 5.7x28 (in its mil config) is a Lexus LX 2006 SUV, and the Reed round is an Lincoln Navigator. The .223 is the Bradley. :)
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2005
  13. DrDremel

    DrDremel Member

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    Quote:
    Short answer.
    5.7x28 is a combat round and designed as such, any .22 is not. Thus this comparision is similar to Bradley vs SUV

    5.56 NATO is a .22 and it is a combat round. Just because it was not designed for military use does not mean it will not work well.
     
  14. Medusa

    Medusa Member

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    Well, at this side of the big pond, .22 means 22LR and 5.56 is a .223, and this was the basis of the comparision. What of the regards of the speed loss, I have undestood that the 5.7 stability degrades during the flight thus creating the increasing rate of speed loss. Anyway thanks for the argument:) besides, 5.7 and .223 are created for different weapon platforms, pistol and rifle, namely.
     
  15. GunGoBoom

    GunGoBoom member

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    Hmm, perhaps - I've never heard that, but its possible I guess.
     
  16. sumpnz

    sumpnz Member

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    This particular round (the .22 Reed Express) is a centerfire round, not a rimfire. They are claiming, using the same type of bullet as the 5.7x28, higher velocities from the same length barrel, or the same velocity using a heavier bullet (27gr in the 5.7x28 vs 45gr in the Reed Express). IOW the .22 Reed Express is hotter round than the 5.7x28mm. From a combat or delf-defense standpoint, while I would prefer a .40S&W or .45ACP, I would rather have a .22 Reed Express than a 5.7x28 (assuming the same type of bullet was used in both).
     
  17. KriegHund

    KriegHund Member

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    So the .22 Reed Express bullet is not the same as the .22 LR bullet.

    How eactly is it different? I Notice it has a nice jacket and is nice and poiny, but is the bullet longer? Is it Truly .22 or is it a little fatter?

    Why not just use a .223 bullet? Is the Reed Superior?
     
  18. sumpnz

    sumpnz Member

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    KH - It looks like they're using the same bullets one would use in a .223 (which is also what the 5.7x28 would use). The advantage to the Reed is the velocity you can get from a 5" handgun even compared to the 5.7x28, and that you can use the CZ-52 platform (less than $100 depending on where you get it, plus whatever they charge for the new barrel) rather than the FN fiveseveN ($900ish).
     
  19. The_Antibubba

    The_Antibubba Member

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    I'll wait for more data. I like the choice of platform, though-it seems appropriate, an we know the CZ is sturdy.
     
  20. DmL5

    DmL5 Member

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  21. BluesBear

    BluesBear member

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    The .22 Long Rifle is an all lead, outside lubricated, heel base bullet.
    It is used in no other cartridge except the .22 long rifle rimfire.

    The Reed cartridge uses a conventional jacketed high velocoty bullet.
     
  22. GunGoBoom

    GunGoBoom member

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    .22 Reed express

    Got my bbl & die set from the brown truck of happiness man today. Great service by Ron Reed's company - thanks! And included is the load data and other info in the die box - sweet.

    I'll dig this up and post again after I make some and chrony them.

    -CZ 52....$150
    -.22 Reed Express barrel & die set - $319
    -Knowing I have better-than-5.7x28 performance in a handgun for 1/2 the price of an FN pistol....Priceless

    :D
     
  23. Crosshair

    Crosshair Member

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    *Note to self: Buy extra CZ-52 and mags.*

    GunGoBoom

    Got my bbl & die set from the brown truck of happiness man today.


    It's the brown truck of sh*t for me. They lost my K-31 for 3 days. Finaly got it today. Then there is the time they lost 500 rounds of 30-06 for over a week. :mad:
     
  24. Reed1911

    Reed1911 Member

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    The brass can be formed in one pass into the FL die. You do not have to anneal it, but we strongly suggest it. If you don't it will show stress cracks and begin to split pretty fast in re-loading. We finally got all our annealing equipment in for it; so ammunition should be ready pretty soon.
     
  25. GunGoBoom

    GunGoBoom member

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    Sounds good - anyone have a link to a procedure for home-grown annealing in the oven, until Ron is geared up to make brass?
     
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