A Carbine Dilemma

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by Beyrouth, Sep 21, 2022.

  1. Beyrouth

    Beyrouth Member

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    Hello,
    I’m new to the forum so please forgo any protocols I may break.
    I don’t want to take too much of your time so I’ll just cut straight to the chase.
    I’ve been given the choice between a Colt US Military issued M4A1 or M16A1 that’s had its barrel shortened to match the length of the M4 (Shortened by the US Special Forces in Iraq for CQB).
    They’re both full auto (a feature I’ll probably never use) and brand new in the box. I’m having a hard time deciding which one to choose. Honestly leaning more towards the M16 but would like your opinions and pros + cons.

    Cheers
     
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  2. Electrod47

    Electrod47 Member

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    Brand new "In the Box" Full Auto's and your never going to fire them Full Auto? and you want us to tell you what to do???
     
  3. Beyrouth

    Beyrouth Member

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    Poor choice of words lol
    I’ll scarcely use is more like it. Bullets are expensive
     
  4. trackskippy

    trackskippy Member

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    The M4 will give you more options for optics, and just more options all around.

    With the carry handle on the M16, you're stuck with basically what you have. If you wanted to add an optic later, there are some options, but youre limited.
     
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  5. General Geoff

    General Geoff Member

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    Need more info to make a reasonable choice. Who is giving it to you and for what purpose? Are you a SOT? In law enforcement? AFAIK there are no fully transferable NFA registered M4s on the market, so we need more info.
     
  6. trackskippy

    trackskippy Member

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    I get the impression hes not in the US.
     
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  7. Heir Kommt Die Sonne

    Heir Kommt Die Sonne Member

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    Pick the shortened M16. That buttstock is really hardy.

    If you're law enforcement you might want the M4 because it's easier to mount in vehicle...
     
  8. Beyrouth

    Beyrouth Member

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    I don’t live primarily in the States anymore, it’s being given to me specifically as a CQB instrument. Our organisation acquired them from the US military, they were originally designated for Iraq in 2015. Anyways a bit off topic there.
     
  9. Heir Kommt Die Sonne

    Heir Kommt Die Sonne Member

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    Im leaning towards M16 in this scenario...
     
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  10. Robert

    Robert Administrator Staff Member

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    The OP is NOT in the US, at least not according to his IPs.

    I'd take the M4.
     
  11. Dave DeLaurant

    Dave DeLaurant Member

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    Welcome to the group!

    I'd go with the M4 variant in your situation, assuming both rifles are in the same condition.
     
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  12. Beyrouth

    Beyrouth Member

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    Thanks Dave
    I’ve uploaded a photo of the M4 and will upload the M16 in a couple of days. They weigh the same believe it or not but the M16 has more “heft” to it. I appreciate all the advice. We don’t have anything fancy like Special Operators over here, and we’ve been doing CQB/CQC for a little over 5 years which is nothing compared to the two+ decades the Green Berets have. But we live we learn.
    Cheers
     

    Attached Files:

  13. jrmiddleton425

    jrmiddleton425 Member

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    If you can legally own it, all else held equal, I'd go with the M4 for the adjustable stock.
     
  14. someguy2800

    someguy2800 Member

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    Welcome. I too am glad we are no longer occupying whatever country you are in.

    I would take the M4 as it will give you more options to mount an optic if you can get one.
     
  15. Beyrouth

    Beyrouth Member

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    I’m from Beirut and the US has never occupied us. I’ve also lived in Texas for 18 years so I consider myself an American as well. I appreciate everyone chiming it, seems like the M4 is the clear winner. Will ultimately decide after zero’ing and testing at the range
     
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  16. JShirley

    JShirley Administrator Staff Member

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    I originally had an AR15A2. When I joined the US infantry, I learned to love the M4.
     
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  17. Demi-human
    • Contributing Member

    Demi-human maybe likes firearms a little bit…

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    Ridiculous and petty politics aside, since we are here for firearms and not myopic world views, I would choose the M4.
    We have made changes for a reason.
    (Though my nostalgia would love a real, 20”, M16.:))

    I would be interested in hearing the range report and which one you’ve chosen, if possible.

    Godspeed to you, and your crew.:thumbup:
     
  18. Bcwitt

    Bcwitt Member

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    M16. All the way.
     
  19. Swampman

    Swampman Old Fart

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    An M16 A1 is going to have a 1/12" inch twist barrel that'll be inaccurate with SS109 type projectiles or anything much longer than M193 ball.

    The M4 should be good even with M856 tracer or 77 grain HPBT's.
     
  20. 12Bravo20

    12Bravo20 Member

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    I have seen some 1-12 twist barrels do just fine with 55 grain bullets and some even do fine with 62 grain bullets. Though a 1-9 twist will definitely be better for 62 grain M855/M855A1 ammo.

    For any use where you will be shooting the 64grain M856 tracer rounds, you will definitely want the 1-7 twist of the M4. The only reason the US Military went with the 1-7 twist is the fact that the longer M856 trader rounds would not properly stabilize out of a 1-9 twist in certain climates.

    So for the OP, if you will be using M855 FMJ and M856 tracers, then you definitely want to go with the M4 over a M16A1.
     
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  21. mljdeckard

    mljdeckard Member

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    I have always felt that the M-4 always made more sense than an M-16. Intermediate-powered cartridge.....medium-sized rifle.
     
  22. Swampman

    Swampman Old Fart

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    I would hope so since 55 grain M193 ball is what they're designed to shoot...
     
  23. Beyrouth

    Beyrouth Member

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    :thumbup::thumbup:
    I agree with you, especially when factoring nostalgia hehe. I will give my full assessment when I go to the range. In reality we will only engage targets from the 0-80 yard mark, our training has taught us that we have to dictate the parameters and perimeter, anything beyond 100 yards will be a no go for us. Then again not everything goes to plan and will be handy to have your rifle hit targets efficiently from 100-300 yards.
    Appreciate everyone, almost everyone, keeping it civil. I know topics like this can get sensitive sometimes. Cheers to all :thumbup:
     
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  24. Demi-human
    • Contributing Member

    Demi-human maybe likes firearms a little bit…

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    Absolutely the M4 then. The ability to mount a red dot for those conditions would be invaluable. I find mine to be much quicker. As well, a low power scope enables finer aiming in dense environments. A illuminated low power variable optic being the greatest, I think.

    While tracers won’t be a thing for you, the added versatility of the seven twist barrel increases your ammunition options, should you be allowed to choose your own.

    (My own 75 grn match bullets were impressive when I found a few had ricocheted through a birch thicket. I imagine some of the newer, heavier, factory rifle loads to be equally effective.)

    In addition, rails are nice. Any rifle can be changed around, but the one with rails already makes it easier. Lights are a necessity here, as we enter into the fifteen hours of night season.
     
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  25. Beyrouth

    Beyrouth Member

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    Excellent response. I wholeheartedly agree however the M16’s that are available have already been modified by US sf, no red dots or anything like that but they’ve added rails on them. So it will be easy to modify it further, when I test them I’ll take photos of the M16’s because I’m sure some people are scratching heads as to how it’s been modified by the sf. All of our 5.56 ammunition are 55 grains. I definitely agree that a LPVO is the best option alongside perhaps a canted reflex red dot, and I’ll definitely need to install lights, mainly to disorient the target more than use of visibility
     
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