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A friend and I had legally carried firearms confiscated tonight

Discussion in 'Legal' started by The Undertoad, Jun 15, 2004.

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  1. Herself

    Herself member

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    Why open carry? ...Here's why I would if I could:

    It may have escaped notice by some of you, but girls are not built the same as boys. We tend to have higher, narrower waists and more hip, and those of us who are on the skinny side don't have a lot of practical gun-concealment real estate, especially in slacks and a non-drapey top.

    So, I carry in my purse -- first target of your standard purse-snatcher -- and devote no small amount of attention to where it is vs. where children and unknown adults are.

    I have one (1) holster that fits well and works well, an inexpensive low-slung hip holster. The kind that hangs well below one's belt and has a thigh strap or two. It's great, comfy, secure, easy for me to reach...and concealable only under a heavy winter coat (or maybe a lab smock, but oh would it print).

    So there's why. Plus, bein' visible armed is (IMO) a deterrent to both serious criminals and annoying nitwits. I've been stalked and had my unfair share of mashers through the years, and there's nothin' like a shootin' iron to keep the jerks at bay! Oddly, nicer-behaved menfolk haven't seemed to mind it at all....

    (I don't think anybody noticed that I earlier suggested our two young heros had "dodged a bullet." While there is no question their actions were legal, and I believe them to be justified, open carry in most places in the US is nevertheless an action that carries known risk; young men are among the most likely to court risk, that's part of their nature, but let's acknowledge that it was an avoidable risk. WA makes a valid point but there is a time to embrace risks as well as a time to steer clear of them. It's not the same time for everyone).

    --Herself
     
  2. RealGun

    RealGun Member

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    I do not intend to be argumentative or necessarily disagree with you, but I wonder what kind of risk you have in mind. Are we talking about the risk of some citizen freaking out or are we talking about the risk of getting arrested by a cop who doesn't know the law? One risk that has been mentioned, if not here elsewhere, is that open carry is an invitation to get shot first during an incident.

    I am more interested in open carry as a temporary convenience or a concession to hot weather and light clothing. I would rather open carry than down size to a more concealable pea shooter. I am also interested in having an unintentional printing or revealment of my concealed weapon not be against the law (=open carry). I might also elect to remove a garment layer and expose a gun, if I thought the circumstances were appropriate.
     
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2004
  3. Firethorn

    Firethorn Member

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    I'm tempted to open carry to educate the masses, in this case it'd be great if those two visited the starbucks alot open carrying in the future. That was the person who panicked is more likely to be there sometime when they show up.

    1st time: Call the cops
    2nd time: wondering why they aren't in jail/prison, ask the employees, who say "it's legal, and they're regular customers, if a little wierd"
    3rd time (hopefully): Shrug, along with the rest of the patrons.
     
  4. Desertdog

    Desertdog Member

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    RealGun

    Possibly true, unless there are several people people open carrying in the area, in which case the BG would probably go to find an easier target.

    An armed society is a polite society.
     
  5. Moparmike

    Moparmike Member

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    Is this thread really going anywhere?
     
  6. RealGun

    RealGun Member

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    It's a classic in my opinion, but we may have beaten it into submission.

    The intriguing question that I think remains is whether we would use the right to open carry or whether we are so involved in the gun control environment that we think concealment is the only proper way to carry, in part to accommodate what other people might think. As individuals we may stand back, never willing to do battle with the dragon, always thinking in the shorter term. I think a coordinated resolve to carry openly on a regular basis, but not exclusively, would go along way toward educating the public, not to mention the police.

    We should take note of VA as a model in this regard. If one is not able to relate to open carry due to living in a different State, then perhaps comments poo pooing the subject should be withheld.
     
  7. .45&TKD

    .45&TKD Member

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    National Open Carry Day

    Why don't we have a National Open Carry Day for the states where it is legal?

    If the nation can put up with gay pride parades surely we should be able to exercise our constitutional rights on one designated day. It would be educational, reduce risks because of large numbers, and get media attention.
     
  8. Desertdog

    Desertdog Member

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    Sounds good to me. IMHO, should have less crime, at least for one day, in the states where it is done. All should use holsters which should look better to the public.

    Be sure and carry a copy of the revalent law that covers open carry.

    To prevent any surprises about why there are soooo many people running around with firearms, that it should be well publicized in advance.
     
  9. pinblaster

    pinblaster Member

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    Sounds good to me too! July 1 might be a good day. I wish we could open carry here in MD.
     
  10. sumpnz

    sumpnz Member

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    With the exception of the range, today was the first time I open carried in public. I was on the way home from the range and had to stop at the new Ace Hardware (on Houghton, just S of Valencia, for Tucsonans). I had been carrying my Ruger P944 in a hip holster as usual at the range. When I got the store, naturally, I didn't want to leave it in the car, so in I walked with it still on my hip. I was kinda nervous as I didn't want to have to explain to my wife why she needed to bail me out if something like what happened to Undertoad happened to me. Fortunatly, only a few people even seemed to notice, though I did pick up on the very polite and prompt response to questions about where the septic enzymes were located :p . I was very careful to project the image of a polite, courteous person, and had no problems whatsoever. The way that went, I may just open carry a few more times, if for no other reason than to get myself comfortable with the situation.
     
  11. Werewolf

    Werewolf Member

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    As sumpnz pointed out if open carry is to be used as an educational tool and a means to desensitized the populace to the sight of it then it is critical that the populace observe only correct behavior in those that choose to open carry.

    In addition I believe the choice to open carry if it is to be used to educate/desensitize involves a decision concerning where to do it. Ffor tactical reasons it would be foolish to open carry on a dark, deserted, urban street. It might very well be foolish for exactly the opposite reason to open carry in a crowded mall where the folks one is trying to educate could indeed become aroused.

    IMHO the logical choice of where to open carry for educational/desensitization purposes seems to me to be the smaller local businesses; for example a MacDonalds, hardware store, gas station, restaurant etc.

    If open carry was legal in Oklahoma that's what I would do for both comfort and to educate/desensitize. As I don't frequent places where the likelihood of needing the tactical advantage of CCW is high I would open carry 90% of the time. On the rare occasions I might have to go to a less than safe zone I'd CCW.

    Both methods are viable depending on location and circumstance. The universe isn't black and white, real life isn't digital and absolutes are pretty rare. Open carry vs CCW is no different.
     
  12. Wildalaska

    Wildalaska member

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    Great way to arouse the agenda driven into seeking to make it illegal.

    Lots of people are like me in this world...we just go on our merry way until somebody tosses something in our face, then we get pissed. Dont matter what the politics is, its the fact thats its being thrust upon us.

    To many people, open carry day would be like other "Days" and "Weeks" where politics is tossed in your face by people screaming "look at me, Look at me"..

    I dont wanna look at anybody by whats on their hip, or in their pants (or whom), or in or out of their womb, or between them and their god....

    WildopencarryonoprahtommorrowAlaska
     
  13. The Real Hawkeye

    The Real Hawkeye member

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    Considering the source, I am convinced that Wildalaska believes your idea to be a good one for our cause. Bad for his cause, but good for ours, otherwise he would have recommended you go ahead and organize it. It's always helpful when your adversary is open about what he would and wouldn't like to see happen. ;)
     
  14. TCD

    TCD Member

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    I'm not going to speak for wild, but I know as an Alaskan, open and concealed carry both apply. I'm not going to carry openly in any city of a decent size which I think the virginia law was also targeted at. However when I go hiking or do any of those activites I'll probably carry openly. Never know when you'll run into a ticked off moose. I reguarly see people carrying openly when hiking and don't give it a second thought. However I would give it a second thought if I saw a person carrying in downtown Anchorage or even in my smallish town Soldotna(5,000)

    And I think while some of us would be perfectly fine with open carry, you must remember that there are many people who arn't and that will only incourage them to get more laws on the books for them, and take the ones we want off.

    However, being that the law is the law, fight those guys with what ever you got.
     
  15. RealGun

    RealGun Member

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    If lawmakers made open carry legal or it never was illegal, I wonder what we think they had in mind. I think we are expected to use mature and honest judgment, but you can't open carry and keep a secret at the same time. I think we are used to the concealment mentality and can't quite get a grip on the open carry idea. Let me put it this way, I wan't to be able to open carry just like a cop and have people be just as accepting. I do, after all, carry for the same reason.

    In lieu of a uniform, if I have to be considerate in how and what I carry, how I dress, how I behave, body language, etc., fine, but I have a right to carry. Again, some are real cautious about this, just because the public isn't used to it. The antis win.

    It is definitely too controlling to be fussing about how others might spoil it for everyone. I don't think anyone can rightfully claim that it is any of their business.

    If a gun is just a thing until you draw it and put your finger on the trigger, why shouldn't the public understand that? I venture to say that they understand that perfectly, when referring to a cop. They probably also understand that the "thing" is loaded and ready to go.
     
  16. gunsmith

    gunsmith member

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    sumpnz

    I opened carried in Phoenix a couple of yrs ago when I was there for Christmas, it was my first time in AZ and I was a little nervous too.
    At first GF and I were in Scotsdale...no one blinked an eye,one lady gave me a dirty look the second day. After two weeks it became second nature. I didn't notice anyone treating me different and wasn't looking to see if any one was looking. It was as unobtrusive as my cellphone:cool:

    We went to a shady part of town to pick up the GF's uncle who lost his car after his latest DUI to cart him to an AA meeting. Being a NewYorker I noticed the young thugs on the corner sauntering to our vicinity probably attracted to our nice rented SUV. After I got out of the car they saw the full sized Glock on my hip they turned right around and left the block...Not bad at all,I thought to myself. If the gun had been concealed I would have had to deal with them, I would rather be left alone.
    My GF who has zero streetwise sensitivity hadn't even noticed.

    Does anyone know if Undertoad got his gun back?
     
  17. The Undertoad

    The Undertoad Member

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    Gunsmith - I did indeed get my gun back, and my friend picked up his at the same time. Each gun was in an evidence box, with pistol (slide locked back), holster, magazine, and ammo all seperated into different envelopes. Looked like it was in the exact same almost-new condition it was when it left my care and passed a functions check fine.
     
  18. Warren

    Warren Member

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    Actually this is kind of cool, in a cinematic "up yours!" to the sheeple kind of way.

    If only he had some kind of big blade hanging off his belt...now that would complete the image.
     
  19. sevenpoint62mm

    sevenpoint62mm Member

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    Undertoad get a lawyer and force him to countersue both criminal (for denying you your rights and time) and civil (for court costs and loss of professional reputation). I called called my retained legal advisor and he says you have a good case against these zealous LEOs
     
  20. Treylis

    Treylis Member

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    She probably gave you a dirty look because it was a Glock and she's a 1911 fan. ;-P
     
  21. cropcirclewalker

    cropcirclewalker member

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    Where do I get one of those "Wife Beater" tee shirts?
     
  22. fjolnirsson

    fjolnirsson Member

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    Hmm. I thought everybody knew what those are. Must be our local slang only.
    A "wife beater" is a white tank top style undershirt.
     
  23. voilsb

    voilsb Member

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    I think he was being silly. A wife beater is not a tee-shirt. Therefore, what is a "whife beater" tee shirt? Is it a tee-shirt? A "wife beater"? A "wife beater" on the left, with a tee-shirt sleeve on the right?
     
  24. gunsmith

    gunsmith member

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    wife beater tee's

    this thread is hardly on topic

    http://www.wife-beaters.com/shirts.html
    wife beater (noun) 1. tank-style underwear shirts. Origin: based on the stereotype that physically abusive husbands wear that particular style of undershirt.
     
  25. RED-DOG 40

    RED-DOG 40 Member

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    Hmmm....I wear those type tank tops all the time and I don't have a wife..:uhoh: .......anymore...:scrutiny:
     
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