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A new .22 Rimfire proposal...

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by whm1974, May 13, 2020.

  1. Johnm1

    Johnm1 Member

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    Here are the SAMI specifications for 22 LR. The COL for the Extra Long cartridge is 0.16" longer. What is to prevent it from chambering?

    22 LR SAMI.jpg
     
  2. whm1974

    whm1974 Member

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    [​IMG]
    .22_Extra_Long%2C_with_.22_Long_Rifle_for_comparison.jpg
    Looking at the picture above, the Extra Long is more then long enough to prevent chambering in Long Rifle firearms... :thumbdown::eek:
     
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  3. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

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    I kind of agree with Elmer Keith.
    If you need more than .22 LR, you should go for reintroduction of .25 Stevens Long.
     
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  4. whm1974

    whm1974 Member

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    Actually I did have the thought of why not neck up the .22 Long Rifle to .25 and lengthen the case by 1 or 2mm...

    On another note, the inventors of the American 180 submachine gun already sort of did what I'm proposing with the .22 ILARCO AKA the .22 Magnum Short.
    http://www.pmulcahy.com/ammunition/rimfire_small_arms_rounds.htm
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American-180
     
  5. HB

    HB Member

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    Ive never thought the 22 mag was useful for anything to be honest, espcially out of a pistol
     
  6. chicharrones

    chicharrones needs more ammo

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    Rifles and pistols, sure.

    But not necessarily the case in .22LR revolvers which don't have a different throat diameter in the chambers. So, as long as the revolver cylinder is long enough, such as in a Ruger Single Six, Ruger Bearcat, Heritage Arms, NAA revolvers with long cylinders, etc.

    That doesn't really matter though as the Extra Long is Extra Hard to Find. :D
     
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  7. chicharrones

    chicharrones needs more ammo

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    Pretty much need 5"+ of barrel length to get any usable speed increase, it would seem.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2020
  8. whm1974

    whm1974 Member

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    It also doesn't matter since they both are identical in performance and pressure anyway...
     
  9. Johnm1

    Johnm1 Member

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    Well, your kinda missing the point. It isn't just the length that is in question as much as it is the diameters of the case/bullet/chamber/bore. Case and bullet are nominally the same diameter (0.005"). And if you can get the bullet in you can get the case in. There is not a 'ledge' in the chamber to prevent the case from entering deeper into the chamber.

    My point wasn't that a 22 WRF couldn't be chambered but that manufacturers couldn't just make a 22 LR longer and load it hotter. Making it longer doesn't prevent the new case from being chambered in the 22 LR chamber. There is nothing in the chamber to stop a longer/hotter cartridge from going further into the LR chamber. Length would only come into play when the case exceeded 0.818/0.8751" and made contact with the bore dimension of the chamber. Up until then the bullet would just seat deeper in the chamber. Consider the SAMI tolerance of -0.004" in case diameter and a +0.002" chamber dimension that length could be a little bit longer. That doesn't consider wear on the barrel/chamber.

    Despite what Wikipedia says, I'd bet a million bucks that the 22 WRF would chamber in almost any 22 LR made. Not that that was the point.
     
  10. whm1974

    whm1974 Member

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    If I was some Billionare... And to the win the arguement, looking at Wikipedia, the .357 is only approximately 1⁄8 inch (3.2 mm) longer then the .38 Special with everything else being the same... Yet the .357 will not fit in a .38 chamber...
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.357_Magnum
     
  11. earlthegoat2

    earlthegoat2 Member

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    I have WRF ammo and a Model 17 Smith....I’m at work now though so I’ll have to test it this evening. I am curious.
     
  12. rust collector
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    rust collector Contributing Member

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    IIRC the case of the 357 magnum is wider than the bullet diameter, and therefore hits the ledge of the 38 special chamber and will not enter all the way, by design. The 22 short, long and long rifle use a heeled bullet that is the same diameter as the case, so that different lengths may be used. The 22 WMR is not designed that way to prevent chambering in 22 LR.
     
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  13. WestKentucky

    WestKentucky Member

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    Quarantine is getting rough.
     
  14. chicharrones

    chicharrones needs more ammo

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    Things are getting mixed up here. .22 WRF will go into .22 WMR, but .22 WRF will not go into .22 LR because .22 WRF brass is the same diameter as .22 WMR brass. Which is larger in diameter than .22 LR brass. (See neck diameter in those links.)

    Back to the .22 Extra Long trying to fit into .22 LR, I wouldn't expect the .22 EL to chamber in rifles or pistols unless the chambers on those guns are cut a bit longer than what's needed for .22 LR.

    Most .22 LR guns I've fired that aren't revolvers, have the rifling start in the chamber right where a chambered bullet would almost touch the rifling. In fact, I have two bolt actions with chambers cut short enough that the bullet of .22 LR actually does touch the rifling so that closing the bolt requires some extra pressure. No way will a .22 EL fit in those chambers.

    Revolvers chambered in .22 LR are a different story because the chambers aren't "stepped" and there is no rifling in those chambers. In this case, all you need is a long enough cylinder, which most .22 LR revolvers seem to have.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2020
  15. Legionnaire
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    It's pretty sweet from a 5.5-inch Single Six.
     
  16. whm1974

    whm1974 Member

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    I still call bull due to the fact that the only real difference between the .38 Special and .357 Magnum is 1/8" of length. If some damn fool tried to load a .38 SPL revolver with .357 Mag, the silly fool will not be able close the action, due to the longer cartridge sticking out enough to prevent this.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2020
  17. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

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    Not to mention .22 WSL 1903.
    I think it is the diameter of .22 WRF but shorter.
     
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