A shooting at the Range

[TimRB]

They got my point and opened the action.

So was there a round in the chamber? I have to know!

Tim

 

[Necessary_Nutrient]

Again, no one touches a firearm during a ceasefire or while anyone is downrange. I walk around all day long with a loaded and cocked it on my hip it hasn't gone off accidentally yet.

Unless you were the range master they were under no obligation to listen to anything you said

I agree that it's too late to open the action IF others are already down range. If you told someone "No" at our range and they were asking you to follow a posted rule- outside a counterbalancing situation of someone ALREADY down range- your membership would be revoked.

OP wasn't clear about whether this was a horse-out-of-the-barn situation involving people already being down range, just mentioned that it isn't closely watched.

 

[jmorris]

Absent any facts,

It makes it difficult to make any comment other than, I am sorry.

 

[MarshallDodge]

Again, no one touches a firearm during a ceasefire or while anyone is downrange. I walk around all day long with a loaded and cocked it on my hip it hasn't gone off accidentally yet.

Unless you were the range master they were under no obligation to listen to anything you said

The sign on the wall said that actions are kept open when people are downrange.

They weren't obeying the range rules.

 

[Flat Rock]

Public ranges suck
I am terrified of the general public handling guns

 

[The Night Rider]

The sign on the wall said that actions are kept open when people are downrange.

They weren't obeying the range rules.

Are you the range master? Are you employed to enforce the range rules?

This ain't Dodge City and you ain't Bill Hikock.

(Niether was James Butler Hickock )

 

[The Night Rider]

Let's assume for a second that there  was a round in the chamber.

In which case do you think the rifle would be more or less likely to fire. Laying on the shooting bench with a round in the chamber and no one touching it.

Or with somebody fiddling around with it and trying to lock the bolt to the rear while there were people downrange.

 

[BLACKHAWKNJ]

RSOs are like police, you find the right ones, they are worth their weight in gold. At the same time, in our society, as my mother once said, "People who can't spend more than 10 seconds a day thinking about anybody but themselves."
One range I shoot at, no RSOs but the range is right behind the counter, they have a large window so they can keep an eye on it. One range session I helped other shooters clear jams, etc., they thanked me for that.

 

[armoredman]

The indoor range I worked at 24 years ago had a suicide on the line, (before I started there), guy rented a revolver and offed himself on the line. After the investigation was done, they replaced that section of the carpet, and put the gun back on the rental shelf, (Ruger SP101 357 Mag, IIRC), and for some time it was popular to rent as the gun the guy killed himself with. No, I am not joking. After a time, it vanished, probably someone higher up thought that a touch too macabre. That is the only range death I have any knowledge of right now.
The range I go to is free, city maintained, and unmonitored. We have to police ourselves, and USUALLY it works well, sometimes not so well. However, no injuries or deaths I am aware of, and anytime I witness people start to become a problem, I pack up and leave. I think it's probably safer than driving down the main street when all the dadgum snowbirds are putting around!

 

[Turkeytider]

The original design/ purpose of a firearm was to kill - that design intent remains to this day. The math says that if you put enough firearms into enough human hands, someone will get shot - it is inevitable. Tens of thousands of people get killed and injured every year using a vehicle designed for benign travel - innocent point A to point B - just another day on the road. Hundreds of people a year get shot during various hunting seasons. What is thought is going to happen when you put a firearm in the wrong person’s hand - an absolute guarantee that someone will get shot. When in a concentration of firearms and people, your head needs to be on a swivel. People are notorious about taking their safety for granted - when it comes to other people and their mindless natures, that can be a very costly mistake.

The old adage, “ Familiarity breeds contempt “.

 

[243winxb]

https://templegunclub.com/


Google News- "An incident Saturday at Temple Gun Club resulted in the death Sunday of Zakary Michael Jerke, 30, from a gunshot wound to the head, the Bell County Sheriff's Office reported."

Not much info. If this is the one?

 

[lightman]

Its sad to hear this. I hope the victim was not seriously injured and recovers quickly!

Edit to add, I posted without reading the above. Prayers for the victim and his family.

 

[Ethan Verity]

Time to find another range. My club vets each member and you need to be recommended by another member.

I'm sure clubs like that are great, but how do you even get a foot in if you don't already know someone in there? I wish clubs like that could just vet the new people, without also require that a member recommends them first.

 

[Barmcd]

https://templegunclub.com/


Google News- "An incident Saturday at Temple Gun Club resulted in the death Sunday of Zakary Michael Jerke, 30, from a gunshot wound to the head, the Bell County Sheriff's Office reported."

Not much info. If this is the one?View attachment 1259473View attachment 1259474

Yes, that’s it. There are rifle ranges at 100/200, 300, and 500 yards. Pistol bays from point blank range to 100 yards and tactical bays where you can shoot 180 degrees with large berms surrounding them. I have purchased target stands so I can shoot by myself in the tactical bays without having to worry about others shooting next to me.

I don’t like the fact that the shooting positions are different for each of the rifle ranges while the target positions are static. If you are shooting from 300/500 yards, no one can shoot from 100 or 200 yards.

The shorter rifle ranges are protected from the longer ranges by very large berms even though there should be no one shooting from farther than you are.

The 100/200, 300 and 500 yard firing positions are protected by barriers which have to be removed to enter and red flags which indicate the firing line is in use.

 

[Charlie98]

but I have packed up and left the range a couple times in the past because someone was not handling their firearm in a safe manner.

I've had to do that a few times, recently... always on the weekends, which is why I prefer to shoot during the week.

@shoebox1.1 and I go to the same indoor range. We noticed on the weekends it's full of 'kids...' that is, young men and women, usually in a group of 3-4-5. One person has all the guns, and the others are there to shoot them, because, you know... John Wick, and Call of Doody and all. The others have no concept of range safety, let alone basic firearm safety, and the RSO is usually running all over the range trying to keep these kids corralled. The gun owner, because he has a captive audience, is all fast and fancy with his gun handling... because he's a Professional... just ask him, he will tell you.

Last weekend I shot there, trying to get some data on my AR loads, I finally had to pack up and leave. Gus had the same problem this past weekend, so I'm thinking I'll just leave the weekends for the kids going forward.

What's funny is... I was chastised for bringing a new shooter, and trying to 'instruct' her on the range. I had rebuilt and sold an AR I had to a friend. I sat with her for 3 hours at her house showing her the basics of AR operation, and basic use before we headed to the range. All I was really doing was talking her through the motions, keeping her safe, and giving her confidence she could do it, one-on-one. And I get told I shouldn't be doing that, that she should take one of THEIR basic courses instead.

 

[Stahlhelm 1916]

I shoot at two different public ranges in IN, both are run by the DNR. There is strict safety protocol enforced at both, especially for cease fires and unsafe gun handling. The RSO people are mostly retired military or State Police/Sheriff's Dept. Any asshattery is quickly dealt with.

 

[wayneinFL]

Again, no one touches a firearm during a ceasefire or while anyone is downrange. I walk around all day long with a loaded and cocked gun on my hip it hasn't gone off accidentally yet.

Unless you were the range master they were under no obligation to listen to anything you said

I don't want to walk in front of someone else's old bolt action rifle that I wasn't shooting, if I can't tell if it's loaded. I don't know if it's had a hangfire or if it's going to Remington 700 on me. I don't kniw anything about the old Mauser and possibly old ammunition they're using. If you want to take the chance, I guess that's fine.

You're right- you're under no obligation to listen to me. But I'm going to say something. That goes for any dangerous situation I'm in- anybody on a job site sees something they think is unsafe, they should say something and we stop what we're doing until we figure it out. A range shouldn't be any different.

So I'm going to say something. We can all walk up range until we agree your gun is safe. Or I can go back up range and I'm packing up and going somewhere else, as soon as it's safe for me to do so.

 

[doubleh]

My gunclub range is leased from the city and sits on land the army gave them after WW II when the B-17 training base was shut down. The the city took advantage of getting a private run prison that took away all the long range shooting because of where it was built. Now we have one target stand at 380 yards as it's privately owned land beyond that. The owner had let us have 400 and 500 yard targets until a couple of dummies started shooting at them while he was doing fence repair right beside them.

Our membership fees have more than tripled since I joined with the only real improvement made being a key card gate installed late last year. We did get concrete benches to replace the wood ones but they are tiny in comparison and I for one don't like them. I cured that problem with a folding table top. On the downside two of the three 25 yard stands on the rifle range went away making it crowded when more than one person is wanting to sight in a rifle. Growling about it has had no effect. They did make an allowance for geezers with a little lower membership fee though.

Finding another range is not an option as the closest one is over 80 miles away.

 

[Soonerpesek]

You're right- you're under no obligation to listen to me. But I'm going to say something. That goes for any dangerous situation I'm in- anybody on a job site sees something they think is unsafe, they should say something and we stop what we're doing until we figure it out. A range shouldn't be any different.

I don’t think the issue was of anyone saying anything….. but the fact of asking someone to manipulate a possibly loaded gun whilst people were already downrange……

…….but, I wasn’t there, just reading into what the poster was thinking…

 

[TimRB]

Let's assume for a second that there  was a round in the chamber.

In which case do you think the rifle would be more or less likely to fire. Laying on the shooting bench with a round in the chamber and no one touching it.

Or with somebody fiddling around with it and trying to lock the bolt to the rear while there were people downrange.

That's a valid point. IMHO the rifle should have been picked up and immediately pointed straight up--then bolt opened. I think in this instance the "open bolt" rule trumps the "no firearm handling" rule. The idea of people walking around in front of a (probably loaded) cocked, bolt-closed rifle gives me the willies.

Tim

 

[Sniper66]

My range with a membership of over 2,000 members requires that every member assume the responsibility of an active RO. I've seen minor infractions, like stepping out in front of a shooting bench to pick up an empty; no one was shooting at the time, but still an important rule. But, overall, it is a very safe all-outdoor club. I despise indoor ranges and have seen less than ideal behavior on indoor pistol ranges. So I never go to them any more.

 

[Necessary_Nutrient]

I don’t think the issue was of anyone saying anything….. but the fact of asking someone to manipulate a possibly loaded gun whilst people were already downrange……

…….but, I wasn’t there, just reading into what the poster was thinking…

Yes, this; people are purposely not addressing that nuance. It's pretty clear that it's too late to touch the damn gun after people are down range. It's also clear that prior to anyone leaving the firing line you open the action if one or both of the following are true:

• It's the rule
• You have common sense

 

[MikeInOr]

Many, many years ago when I was in my early 20's I was at the range and two other groups were there. A guy in his 30's on the far left bench with two children, a boy and a girl about 10yo or so, shooting a 22. I was at the middle bench. A couple of guy were at the far right bench sighting in a hunting rifle.

As I was aiming a shot the guy with two kids starts walking out to their target about 10-15 yards down range. I caught him in my peripheral vision and immediately looked at the guys on the right and yelled "DOWN RANGE" at the top of my voice just as one was about to take a shot. The shooter gave me a REALLY nasty look until he saw the father changing targets after which he promptly opened the bolt on the hunting rifle and waited politely.

When the father got back to his bench I looked at him straight in the eyes with an "Are we all clear??". After which I yelled "ALL CLEAR". The father didn't need a lecture from a punk 20 something kid but I could tell through eye contact that he got the message and learned a lesson. I would have had to been aiming at a 45 degree angle to the firing line to hit him and the other guys at an even more obtuse angle... but man, to do that right in front of his kids!

I haven't been to a range in decades, I go to BLM land when I want to shoot. The whole "we are all range officers" thing just doesn't work in my experience. I am confident the guy shot in the head the OP was referring to wasn't the one being the numb nutz.

 

[dartor]

Many, many years ago when I was in my early 20's I was at the range and two other groups were there. A guy in his 30's on the far left bench with two children, a boy and a girl about 10yo or so, shooting a 22. I was at the middle bench. A couple of guy were at the far right bench sighting in a hunting rifle.

As I was aiming a shot the guy with two kids starts walking out to their target about 10-15 yards down range. I caught him in my peripheral vision and immediately looked at the guys on the right and yelled "DOWN RANGE" at the top of my voice just as one was about to take a shot. The shooter gave me a REALLY nasty look until he saw the father changing targets after which he promptly opened the bolt on the hunting rifle and waited politely.

When the father got back to his bench I looked at him straight in the eyes with an "Are we all clear??". After which I yelled "ALL CLEAR". The father didn't need a lecture from a punk 20 something kid but I could tell through eye contact that he got the message and learned a lesson. I would have had to been aiming at a 45 degree angle to the firing line to hit him and the other guys at an even more obtuse angle... but man, to do that right in front of his kids!

I haven't been to a range in decades, I go to BLM land when I want to shoot. The whole "we are all range officers" thing just doesn't work in my experience. I am confident the guy shot in the head the OP was referring to wasn't the one being the numb nutz.

Never underestimate the stupidity of other humans. Had an older gentleman at the firing line at a pistol range once. He was shooting what I believe was a 32 auto. Gun jammed, he had it pointing my direction to try and clear it. I gave him hell about it, packed up my gear and left. Rather live to shoot another day.

OP, I hope your range is able to reopen. Shootings are just what the anti's want to close ranges.

 

[Barmcd]

https://templegunclub.com/


Google News- "An incident Saturday at Temple Gun Club resulted in the death Sunday of Zakary Michael Jerke, 30, from a gunshot wound to the head, the Bell County Sheriff's Office reported."

Not much info. If this is the one?View attachment 1259473View attachment 1259474

The club is opening the range starting Friday morning except for tactical bays 7 and 8. Still no details on what happened. There's an overhead view on the quoted post.