A VERY disturbing development at the indoor range

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by GeoDudeFlorida, May 11, 2021.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. GeoDudeFlorida

    GeoDudeFlorida Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2020
    Messages:
    2,073
    The IDR where I shoot pistols mostly has a new policy forbidding reloads. They exempted old timers who they know to be responsible reloaders/handloaders - myself included - but the owner told me they have had far too many ka-booms with newby reloaders and at least once a bystander got hurt so no more reloads. Last year they put a "no steel cases" policy in effect after a couple of pistols went ka-boom with Chinese steel ammo. This is a good shop with smart, savvy gunowners for owners not given to over-reaction so I know it's bad. Has anyone else heard about or seen directly increased problems with handloads at your ranges? I understand a lot of people here only shoot on their own land. I'm mostly asking the people who use public ranges, private clubs and indoor shop ranges.
     
    ThomasT likes this.
  2. BreechFace

    BreechFace Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2020
    Messages:
    1,415
    Not surprising with the ammo costs the way they are...

    A non-reloader looks over at those who are still shooting thanks to being reloaders and thinks, I'll get into reloading. It's as simple as primer, powder and bullet, right?
     
  3. Typetwelve

    Typetwelve Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2019
    Messages:
    629
    Personally, no, I have not...but I'll admit that it makes sense. I've lost count at the "first time reloader" threads here and on other sites since 2020 hit. So many have taken to it recently thinking that its a loophole out of the current ammo crunch.

    As we all know, reloading is a side hobby all its own...it takes just as much time, attention, and honestly, even more attention to detail than shooting itself. It is silly easy to pop something if you get in a rush, or do not respect proper procedures/rules. Add that to the lack of supplies and you're asking for it. I cannot imagine how many first time reloaders are currently substituting powders or projectiles because of limited availability. We all know that is seriously dangerous if you do not know what you're doing. I consider myself a budding reloader and even after years and 1000's of rounds, I will not do that.
     
  4. Mark_Mark

    Mark_Mark Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2021
    Messages:
    2,543
    not my club, almost every staff members are reloaders.

    Factories are cranking out ammo as fast as possible. I wonder if QC is keeping up
     
    Akula69 likes this.
  5. 375supermag

    375supermag Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2013
    Messages:
    1,219
    Location:
    Southcentral Pennsylvania
    I do not know of any indoor range that will allow handloaded ammunition.
    Typically they require that you buy factory ammunition from them to use on their indoor range or in their rental guns.

    Just some of the reasons I don't use their indoor ranges. Cost is another.
    Having memberships in two gun clubs is another.
    Restrictions on how quickly you can fire rounds is another.
     
    shoobe01 and GeoDudeFlorida like this.
  6. Bazoo

    Bazoo Member

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2021
    Messages:
    131
    Location:
    Cecilia, Ky
    Well, I have a slightly off subject idea. Maybe you could offer the idea. That, the range could offer a reloading class, and which once passed, you could shoot your reloads there. There would be money made to offset less range usage, there would be an increase in safety of new reloaders, and finally, allow the new reloaders to use their reloads.

    But to address the query at hand, no. I'm a private land shooter.
     
    PWC, lordpaxman, ms6852 and 7 others like this.
  7. unwashed

    unwashed Member

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2021
    Messages:
    85
    Once a year I have to get certified for my HR218, there are two groups who run the classes to certify us. My recent class(1/27) there was no mention of reloads but found out later on the other group just banned reloads due to an incident and the person was banned from the range, don't know the details but banning sounds pretty serious. I myself do not use reloads for these classes and spent $50 on a box of 9mm for my class. I did give the instructor a headache, since I insisted to go last so I could police up all the brass :evil:
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2021
  8. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    29,423
    Location:
    Florence, Alabama
    My Local says:
    "You may bring your own eye protection, ear protection, and ammunition (No steel core, steel jacketed, incendiary, or tracer ammo allowed | no buckshot, birdshot or snake shot ammunition)"
    No mention of handloads, but you do have to buy their ammo to shoot in their rental guns.

    The next nearest, which I only visit for their indoor USPSA matches, says
    "The use of hand-reloaded ammunition is prohibited. Members in good standing may apply for a waiver subject to qualification."
    If they got huffy about that, they would lose nearly everybody who shoots that weekly match and lose a good bit of revenue.
     
  9. milsurpguy

    milsurpguy member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2021
    Messages:
    551
    Most of my reloads could pass as factory ammo.
     
  10. Skeptic13

    Skeptic13 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2019
    Messages:
    534
    Location:
    Colorado Springs
    I have never heard of such a thing. I also don't see how they could possibly police or enforce a rule like that especially when there are exception. And then how do they determine who is an 'old timer' and should be exempt? What do they do if one of their 'old timer' ends up blowing their face off with a hand load? You can't create enough rules or pass enough laws to regulate stupidity or carelessness. They may be solving one problem and creating a dozen more in it's place. And a pile of red tape to go along with it.
     
    merlynski and OhioShooter75 like this.
  11. Skeptic13

    Skeptic13 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2019
    Messages:
    534
    Location:
    Colorado Springs
    This sounds more like a marketing ploy that safety rules.
     
    EMC45, higgite and .308 Norma like this.
  12. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    29,423
    Location:
    Florence, Alabama
    Yes, for every KaBoom averted, they must make thousands and thousands of dollars on ammo sales.
     
    1KPerDay, DukeConnor, higgite and 2 others like this.
  13. WeekendReloader

    WeekendReloader Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2020
    Messages:
    432
    Location:
    SE Michigan
    Local indoor range requires you to purchase their ammo for use in their rental guns. Makes sense to me.
    Then there are reasonable restrictions about maximum caliber allowed and no armor piercing or steel core ammo allowed to prevent damage to the range building and bullet traps.

    No mention about using reloads in your own gun.

    I imagine after a few incidents resulting in injury, their insurance company may force them to restrict using reloads in order to retain insurance coverage.
     
    Dudedog and GeoDudeFlorida like this.
  14. GeoDudeFlorida

    GeoDudeFlorida Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2020
    Messages:
    2,073
    The problem being, right now they don't have enough ammo on-hand to make money turning people away. I suspect an insurance company or tort lawyer is really behind the new policy.

    That's been a rule for a while and I think it's pretty reasonable. I wouldn't expect anybody to let me shoot my handloads in their guns and I don't shoot other people's handloads in mine.

    But probably not as much as one lawsuit. Even if they won the civil case in court, the lawyer's bill would bankrupt them. We don't have a "loser pays" law in Florida. :(
     
    Jesse Heywood likes this.
  15. CapnMac

    CapnMac Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2009
    Messages:
    11,042
    Location:
    DFW (formerly Brazos County), Texas
    Some of those rules are out of the Range's ability to choose, and are imposed by their insurance carrier.

    The insurance carrier bears no onus for unenforceable rules. They just want to be able to come in after the fact and go "coverage denied." The Range's only option is to pay more for insurance (if any such is actually available), or really pay through the nose for "underwriter" insurance.

    Most of these rules were probably already in place, but not as much noticed until the present "pinch."
     
    Skgreen and GeoDudeFlorida like this.
  16. JO JO

    JO JO Member

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2011
    Messages:
    2,524
    Location:
    U.S.A.
    Both the ranges I go to one is indoor allow home rolled
    But these are private ranges not open to the public
     
    GeoDudeFlorida likes this.
  17. unwashed

    unwashed Member

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2021
    Messages:
    85
    Specking of insurance my local indoor ramge has been for at least 4-5 years has everyone initial and sign a whole page of waivers before using the range. So I guess their insurance company is satisfied with that instead of banning issues.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2021
    GeoDudeFlorida likes this.
  18. Rule3

    Rule3 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2010
    Messages:
    7,773
    Location:
    Florida
    None of the Indoor ranges around here allow "handloads" nor steel cased ammo. (only 3 that I know off) Some require that you buy factory ammo at their facility, others allow you to bring your own factory ammo but they inspect it.

    Been that way for years.

    The insurance and liability of a gun range is incredible.

    Indoor ranges are not for me for many reasons
     
    Hartkopf, AgPilot and GeoDudeFlorida like this.
  19. Craig_VA
    • Contributing Member

    Craig_VA Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2007
    Messages:
    795
    Location:
    Arkansas
    This thread relates directly to the recent (3/30/21 start) and very active (4 pages and counting) thread
    Range Rules

    Craig
     
    GeoDudeFlorida likes this.
  20. CQB45ACP

    CQB45ACP Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2020
    Messages:
    811
    Location:
    Northern Virginia at the Beltway
    I shoot at three indoor ranges and all permit hand loaded ammo. Id have to double check but I don’t think they expressly say “we permit handloads” but they do say collecting your own brass is permitted. So the presumption is clear.

    I recall the NRA HQ range where I mostly shoot had reloading classes prepandemic. Oh yeah and they also sell used brass.

    There are only two other ranges within 35 miles and I believe they too permit handloads.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2021
    GeoDudeFlorida likes this.
  21. reddog81

    reddog81 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2014
    Messages:
    1,399
    Location:
    Iowa
    i have a few "factory" boxes of ammo laying around for use at the local range that requires factory ammo. However I generally just avoid that indoor range because you aren't supposed to use reloads. Not allowing reloads seems like a bad business idea since reloaders are typically the people who visit the range the most.
     
    bersaguy, Mark_Mark and CQB45ACP like this.
  22. CQB45ACP

    CQB45ACP Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2020
    Messages:
    811
    Location:
    Northern Virginia at the Beltway
    Yeah mine too but when I scurry around picking up my brass it’s a sure giveaway.
     
    kcofohio likes this.
  23. George P

    George P Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2018
    Messages:
    7,560
    That's been the rule at every indoor range that rents guns
     
    GeoDudeFlorida likes this.
  24. GeoDudeFlorida

    GeoDudeFlorida Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2020
    Messages:
    2,073
    I agree about private ranges making their own rules. I'm not chuffed about the rule - their range, their property, I don't have to go there - I'm just really shocked at the spike in accidents involving handloads. This family has owned the indoor range for almost a decade (maybe over?? time flies!) with no mention of problems with handloads. Now it's a big enough problem to ban them. And, it was mentioned some bystander got "hurt" - but nothing specific. These are good people so I trust their judgement. I'm just shocked people can be so irresponsible with ammunition and not know when they have a squib or stuck bullet. Did they not notice there wasn't a new hole in the target? :thumbdown::eek:
     
    ThomasT and George P like this.
  25. unwashed

    unwashed Member

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2021
    Messages:
    85
    That's one thing that makes me the most paranoid, I check all my cases at least 3 times for powder during reloading. Once as it is poured in the case, once all are filled and in the tray and once right before the bullet gets seated.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2021
    GeoDudeFlorida likes this.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice