Am I justified in shooting an attacking pit bull in my back yard?

[280PLUS]

Fwiw

Dalmations- These dogs were originally bred to be used by the Fire Dept for keeping the crowd back at a fire. They can be very aggressive and are considered to be at the top of the list of dogs that will bite.

Unfortunately due to Disney's irresponsible act of portraying them as cute cuddly little spotted things many parents have bought these for their kids only to find out about their aggressiveness after the fact. Usually the hard way.

IIRC I have been bitten by 2 dogs in my klife. A friend's Pit mix (actuallly my fault, I was trying to separate him from MY dog and accidentally stuck my hand it his mouth) and my brother's Dalmation. He had a bad habit of letting you in the house but then biting you on the posterior as you tried to leave later. You never turned your back on that dog as you were going out the door. The dog also bit his roomate's girlfriend on the way out (didn't even break the skin) and she sued and got $12,000 no questions asked. My brother's homeowners insurance was subsequently canceled.

 

[Firethorn]

12k no questions asked? Did he even try to fight it, or did the insurance company just settle, as they have been known to do.

If you're going to define "bite" that loosely, I've been "bit" hundreds of times by my family's dogs. While playing a hand or something ends up between the jaws, etc.

But they haven't ever broken the skin. Heck, I can even grab them by the jaws. Dad even brushes their teeth, and I know they don't like that!

Heck, my grandfather's dogs once held a crook down that way. Two females on the legs, the male had his jaws arount the guy's throat. They were Boston Terriers. No skin broken. Cops didn't dare shoot they were so close. He got to wait there until Grandpa came home, as animal control was busy with a crock on the other side of town. The crook tried to sue for "vicious animals", but got thrown out of court when it was discovered that the dogs hadn't even broken the skin.

 

[280PLUS]

The insurance company settled and canceled his policy. He had no opportunity to fight anything. She sued AFTER breaking up with the roomate.

Both of my bites resulted in broken skin one from the pit on the back of my hand and one on my,,,




And did that hurt!



I just like to warn people about Dalmations when I get a chance because it's the last thing most expect, again, Thanks to Disney.

 

[Firethorn]

Sheesh, how couldn't he have an oppertunity to fight it?

That reminds me of the architectural firm that was contracted to draft plans to repair a fire-damaged mall(part of the roof&one wall or something). It turned out that a volunteer firefighter got hurt fighting the fire. He sued everybody involved in the fire. Including this firm, which had no part of the mall before being hired. They had to sue their own insurance company to make them fight it.

It later turned out that the firefighter was inebriated at the time of his injury.

 

[bratch]

I have a very loving playful 30 pound border collie. She is able to enter and leave the house as she pleases so she is outside alot if I'm not home.

That said any animal that threatens her and is not under control of its owner will meet a quick demise. I could probably run them off but they have already demonstrated 1: Their owners do not have control. 2: They are agressive and would harm another animal if given the chance. I won't give them that chance.

 

[2nd Amendment]

Of the dogs who got one "across the bow" , all left in great haste and none have ever returned.

I wish that were the case everywhere. It's always been SOP to put one across the bow but I am amazed at the number that don't leave(some don't even flinch) and even more amazed at those that come back later if they do leave at the time. In fact, I don't think I've ever had one *not* come back sooner or later unless its owner finally developed a sense of responsibility and restrained it.

Maybe there's something in the water around here that makes 'em dumber.

 

[Zach S]

Shoot, shovel and shut up. It's just beyond me why people seem to think they need to involve the police in this sort of thing?

Simple: neighbors. If one of them call, the police are sure to show up and not know what was going on. I call it in, and they say okay and dont bother coming.

 

[280PLUS]

Sheesh, how couldn't he have an oppertunity to fight it?

Apparently it was cheaper/easier for the insurance company to just settle. And you wonder why insurance rates keep climbing...

 

[slaphappy]

You took on a pit with a flashlight? You've got bigger balls than me, that's for sure.

If it were me, the pit would be dead. As far as I am concerned, if he's out of his yard or out of his owners control, he's a menace to society and should be dealt with as such. Just because the dog wasn't a direct threat to you, (and I think he was, ain't no window that can stop a dog that powerful) doesn't mean that he isn't going to maul a 6 year old when he runs off from your property. I really doubt that pit's fun was over for the night.

 

[motorep]

As others have noted- it depends on where you are...a pitbull was attacking a puppy in a Denver suburb, not up in the mountains. An acquaintance of mine walked out of his garage, grabbed the pitbull by the collar, and put a .44 Mag, 300 gr. Corbon into the back of its skull. Local pd had already been called, when they arrived said acquaintance told them the gun was on the bench in the garage, unloaded. They checked the serial #, basic good police work I think, and said "what a mess, who's going to clean this up?"

 

[XLMiguel]

A point or two for clarity's sake. I

A lot of dogs get labeled as 'pitbulls', but technically, I believe the American Staffordshire Terrier is the 'real deal'. I've know a couple that were real sweeties, but also very loyal to their families, but tough enough dags, and I wouldn't want to pi$$ one off. Then there's the generic 'pits' that are ill trained and cared for by inadequate, irresponsible persons that seem to cause more than their share of trouble and get the whole breed tarred with a bad brush. Would that one could shoot the owners, too.

If you can run the dog off without shooting, fine & dandy, but I'd call animal control and the cops and be all over the owner. I want the incident document in case there's a next time. Shooting someone's pet, even justifiably, is bad ju-ju.

Justifiable shooting a Threatening dog IMO is like justifiable shooting a person - they must have means, opportunity and intent of mortal injury or grave bodily harm. A pitbull, by reputation and history, has the means,and if it was close enough to smack, it clearly had the opportunity. As for intent - that's a judgment call, and I'd be inclined to err on the side of caution (and self-preservation), but if yelling at it and hitting it didn't deter it, I'd consider it hostile intent and seek to neutralize the threat most thoroughly and expeditiously.

I also understand theing rationale behind shoot a dog that is threatening one's livelihood (i.e. livestock), but that wasn't part of the original scenario.

 

[slaphappy]

A pane of glass was between an agressive pit and the home owner's cats (dinner). If that's not a threat to you and your home, I don't know what is.

 

[Hardware]

Pits can be excellent family pets. Anybody remember Pete the pup from Little Rascals? He was a pit bull. In fact, he is one of the foundation dogs in the AKC stud books when they originally registered the American Staffordshire Terrier. Nipper, the RCA mascot dog was a pit bull. Helen Keller and Teddy Roosevelt owned pit bulls. Suffice it to say the breed is not all bad. The illegalization of dog fighting put most of the reputable pit bull breeders out of business. Uninformed back yard breeders took over and the result was generations of ill bred, unstable dogs. Anybody remember the Doberman Pinscher problem back in the '70's? Same source, same problem, back yard breeders.

All that aside, in my location shooting a dog in your yard that isn't attacking you or someone else would probably get you in trouble. You'd probably be cleared eventually, but who needs the hassle. Take the cat out of the window and run the dog off. Sounds like you handled the situation pretty well.

 

[kbheiner7]

I've heard all the pro-pit arguments and none of them fly for me. They are relatively rare, but make up a large percentage of attacks. A few of these attacking dogs I personally knew and were of the "not trained to attack, good family dogs, great with kids" variety. Something in those critters heads just snaps and they go nuts.

I'm not sure if it's related, but I had a springer that got very aggressive later in life. Upon some research, I found that springers are inclined to develop a disease called Enraged Canine Syndrome.

 

[Can'thavenuthingood]

"Personally, GSDs are highest on my list of dogs I wouldn't want to screw with, but GSD owners tend to be less irresponsible training their animals. If you get on the bad side of an angy GSD though, watch out."

I'm lost, what's a GSD?

DAWA

Vick

 

[stevelyn]

At least where I live it's "my property, my rules". You don't want your dog shot? Keep them on your own land. Display of hostility just lessens what little reluctance I may have in killing it. Leash laws are in effect to reinforce this.

 

[meef]

I'm lost, what's a GSD?

German Shepherd Dog.

 

[280PLUS]

Just to set the record straight

I received this via PM from a member who can identify themselves if they desire. Apparently I was mistsaken on the actual history of Dalmations. Apparently they had a job BEFORE working for the Fire Dept's. While they were not BRED for it I do believe their purpose as fire dogs was in fact crowd control per an article I read once but couldn't find today.

Hey, just a comment about Dalmatians. The reason the fire department adopted Dalmatians as their fire dogs was they were easy to train to run between the rear wheels of the old horse-drawn fire wagons. The reason they were easy to train to do that was they were bred to run between the rear wheels of horse-drawn carriages. They were bred by the people in the balkans to run with their coaches to help defend the coach from highwaymen, BGs who would jump out on a deserted road and hold up the carriages carrying wealthy people. They'd have a couple of footmen hanging on the back of the coach with weapons, plus the driver and coachman and two dogs.

Sorry for the misinformation.
__________________

 

[El Rojo]

What if it ends up killing some kid in the neighborhood a couple of days later?

What if it runs in front of a bus, the driver swerves, and 30 kids die? What if, what if.

If you can get it out of your yard without shooting a gun, you are better off. I still find it interesting that so many members on here seem so eager to shoot any strange or even familiar dog that wanders onto their property, like it is a badge of honor to just shoot other people's dogs all in the interest of property rights.

Make no mistake about it, if someone's dog was attacking something it shouldn't be, I would be the first to put a 165 gr. Federal Hydroshok in it. But if it is just wandering about or even chasing cats, that is what dogs do. If you can persuade it to leave the area without using your firearm, you are better off in my opinion. Of course you can disagree and set up your M2HB on the lawn to take care of any marauding canines because no dog comes onto your property without permission!

 

[No_Brakes23]

What if I just shoot it in the balls with a BB or .177 pellet? That is what I have used for pest control before here in the PRK. Not much noise there. Of course if you are safe enough to shoot it with an airgun, you are probably safe enough to wait on animal control. Hmmm, maybe it is time for a new band on the slingshot...

 

[Byron Quick]

My father's girlfriend unlocked a chain link fence gate and neglected to lock it back. She just latched it. My fawn Doberman, who looked like the Schwarzenegger of Dobermans, could open a latched gate with his muzzle. My neighbor shot him with no other provocation than it being on his property.
I was told by the police that the only law that he violated was discharging a firearm in the city limits. He wasn't charged.

Now some here have tried to make a link between self defense laws and shooting dogs. I don't know about your state but I've never seen a statute that mentions animals in relation to self defense. Once again, your state could certainly be different than Georgia. It's like brandishing or printing...nothing in Georgia statutes about either one.

I've never looked up applicable laws but law enforcement and municipal government is on the side of the property owner who kills someone's dog here in Georgia. I've seen this more than once. I've never heard of anyone who killed an animal on their property asked,"Was it attacking you?" or"Why were you in fear of your life or grave bodily injury."

Sounds like some state legislatures might have been infiltrated by PETA.

 

[2nd Amendment]

I still find it interesting that so many members on here seem so eager to shoot any strange or even familiar dog that wanders onto their property, like it is a badge of honor to just shoot other people's dogs all in the interest of property rights.

Please try to avoid the hyperbole. Just because you don't understand the situation is no reason to try and color opinions. This morning I lost two more chickens to the neighbor's dog. He's been warned. He's too stupid, and yes I use that word specifically because he is indeed after years of drugs and booze too stupid, to control the animal. Moreover there are other dogs around here that run with that one.

Also, in rural areas we don't have a viable "Humane Society" and the cops don't have the time nor interest(not that I would allow them on my property if they did). Add in a coyote problem and a sporadic feral dog pack problem and you get what has been SOP for American history: Shoot the offending animal. It has nothing to do with any idea so terribly foolish as a badge of honor. It is though about property rights: Control your property, do not destroy mine or expect to lose yours.

Simple equation, eh?

 

[El Rojo]

This morning I lost two more chickens to the neighbor's dog...Control your property, do not destroy mine or expect to lose yours.

If a dog is attacking you, your pet, or your livestock, then shoot the dog. I never said don't shoot dogs, in fact I said I wouldn't hesitate to shoot an attacking dog and would most certainly step out and help anyone that is experiencing a dog attack. If a dog is killing your livestock, take it out. There is nothing wrong with that.

What I have a problem with is just shooting someone's pet for no other reason than it is your property and you have a "right" to do what you want on your property. Byron Quick had a good example of his dog being shot simply because it was out. Sometimes dogs get out, I would be very appreciative of a neighbor who worked with me on getting my dogs back alive. I know I would want to declare war on any neighbor that just hauls off and shoots my dogs because they are on his/her property. If my dog gets out and starts to attack a little kid, shoot it (the dog not the kid!).

Please try to avoid the hyperbole. Just because you don't understand the situation is no reason to try and color opinions.

I understand the situation. Maybe you should re-read my post and debate my points rather than making claims about my understanding that are unfounded.

 

[2nd Amendment]

Ya know, I went back through and read the whole thread again. I can't find a single instance of a single person advocating shooting them just because they are there. I can find lots of talk about being attacked, having animals or property destroyed, etc. Even noting putting one across the bow to try and run them off prior to punching their clock.

The first person saying anything about casually shooting any dog was you. The only person to imply anything "honorable" about it, even if needed, was you. And like I said, someone is always doing this sort of thing. Thus why I said the hyperbole and generalization was completely unnecessary and in this thread just plain wrong. Seems like there always has to be someone these days to question what not long ago would have been accepted withouty need to question, and that bugs me. Sorry...

 

[TonkinTwentyMil]

My Pit Bull Incident

A few months ago, I was out for my nightly 2-mile stroll. Since the spouse was ill, I was alone, so I took the opportunity to carry/test 2 new flashlights. As it turned out, they saved the day. Here's what happened:

While walking through an area of upscale suburban homes, a Pit Bull suddenly leaped at me from between 2 parked cars in a driveway. As I had both (!) flashlights (SL Scorpion and SF C2/KL1) in my hands, I just reflexively (and instantly) "spotted" the dog -- with both lights. For about 10 seconds, he just stood there on the sidewalk, barking/snarling/fang-brandishing -- 5 feet from me. As the lights seemed to disorient/hold him at bay, I was able to slip one of the flashights into a coat pocket and (fumbling nervously) replace it with a canister of O.C. Without hesitating, I douched his face with the peppergas -- and that did the trick, turning him away.

The next day, I reported this to the local Animal Control officer. He investigated, then told me he could find no such dog at that address, OR nearby!

LESSONS-LEARNED:
1. Dog attacks can happen FASTER -- with zero warning -- than the typical street mugging (and I've been through a handful of both).
2. Being INSTANTLY prepared (with O.C. and/or a bright FL in hand) may be your only shot at avoiding a painful, bloody result (for you). Living in Condition Yellow/Orange alertness ("Paranoia" to the victims-in-waiting Sheeple) is highly recommended.
3. Bright, high-quality, instantly-deployble FL's (that are always with you) are worth their weight in gold. This was about the tenth time in the past 2 decades when I've used one to Save The Day.

Now, when I'm out for night walks, I always have a good FL in one hand and an O.C. can, or ASP baton, or Spyderco Civilian in the other -- nanny-state "weapons laws" be damned. Yeah, I know a .38 158 JHP +P would be more effective, but I live in a marginally "blue" Lib-snot/Bambi-ist/grass-eater area now, and the subsequent legal hassles would be significant. Despite Sceramin' Howie Dean's assertions that Gun Control is no longer on the Dems' (national) agenda, many local politicians wouldn't shrink to use ANY gun incident to polish their image for career advancement up the national-politics ladder.

The dog that attacked me had tags on its collar, so it apparently was another irresponsible owner's on-the-loose pet. That dog -- and its owner -- are still out there.