Ammunition using propellants other than gunpowder?

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zero_chances

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Has ther ever been a cartridge that used a propellant other than a powder? Say a liquid, or vapor or something? or is this even possible?
I was thinking about this the other day and i figured I would ask you guys.
 
If memory serves, there was a Gyro-Jet pistol that fired cartridges that were like a mini-rocket, but that would fall under your solid propellant category. I seem to remember these things from a Popular Science magazine in the 1960's. The cost of ammunition and atrocious accuracy (or lack thereof) may have been the reason it went out of production. Anybody feel free to correct my memory on this.
 
Lewis and Clark used a couple of airguns on their "Voyage of Discovery." Killed big game with them. They were "repeaters."

L.W.
 
Somewhere I read about a "steam gun". It was essentially a repeating air gun that used this alcohol boiler contraption to produce a steady powering of steam. Not terribly practical but neat regardless.

Edit... here it is! The Perkins gun
 
I have a potato gun that Is actually multi-propellant. Starting fluid, hairspray, Krylon, WD40(has to be good for something).......you get the idea. Not good at an indoor range....

Jeff
 
There have been experimental artillery systems that used binary liquid propellants.

Presumably one of the advantages was that exactly the right amount of propellant could be injected for the desired range and velocity, giving you almost infinite control.

Not an actual firearm, but I own a cordless nailgun that uses butane and a battery as an ignition source. Think of it as a single-stroke IC engine. If the piston that forces the nails into the wood wasn't permanantly attached it would make a dandy projectile.

The main reason you don't see much divergance from the self-contained metallic cartridge, is that it's extremely efficient.

They're waterproof, almost completely inert when left at rest, much safer than say, gasoline, and with a minimum of care, they have a shelf life in excess of 100 years. Smokless powder cartridges are not all that energetic if accidentaly burned either.

Mechanicaly, it's a heat-sink for the gun, the ejected brass takes a considerable amount of heat away from the firearm's "system" when viewed from a thermodynamics standpoint.

In terms of redundancy, metallic cartridges are a very fault-tolerant system. If one fails, just eject it, load the next, and you're back in business. In the thereoretical non-gunpowder firearm, if the fuel-tank, battery, or whatever, fails, the entire gun is out of comission.

It's an extremely hard standard to beat, especially in man-portable arms.

Heckler and Koch, in conjunction with Dynamit Nobel, developed the first truly practical caseless ammunition for the famed G-11 rifle, however, from a chemical standpoint, the propellant was still very similar to double-base nitrocellulose gunpowder used in conventional cartridges.
 
The "caseless ammo" uses solid (non-powder) propellant.
(Primary problem with it is heat removal: ejecting metal cases an excellent way of removing considerable amounts of latent heat that otherwise overheat the chamber.)
 
There's been a lot of research over the past couple of decades into liquid propellants for artillery systems. The US Army did a major investigation in the early 1990's, and South Africa and various European nations have also conducted research in this area. I think the time isn't far off when such systems will be fielded. However, I don't think it'll be used for small arms - only for the big stuff.
 
Spring piston, pellet gun air rifles compress the air fast enough that it heats up enough to diesel any flammable liquid in the chamber. I have heard of some people putting a drop of something in the back of the pellet and they get a supersonic crack and I have heard claims of over a 20% increase in muzzle velocity.

Warnings: In some states this may be illegal and if you do it remember that many flammable liquids are solvents or are damaging to the rubber gaskets. Find a fluid that is rubber friendly, but also flammable.
Also, there is a risk of overpressure and damaging your gun, so if you have a $400 spring piston air rifle, you may want to take a pass on this one.
 
US Navy had a steam cannon

around the turn of the century. I seem to think Teddy Roosevelt had something to do with it.
 
Never hestitate to ask a question, even a "stupid question". Many problems have been solved because someone was willing to ask a question. Questions are the first step down the road of discovery.
 
Yeah there was the railgun, but it was designed to be an artillery piece. Used super magnets to launch a saboted round. The idea was to be able to create a stealth missle the soviets couldnt detect due to a lack of heat source as there was no combustion.
 
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A while ago, I heard a rumor about a real-life "plasma rifle" under development by the military. Despite its name, it does not fire energized gas; rather, a rapidly expanding liquid is injected into the barrel, where a chemical reaction occurs. This results in a liquid projectile being fired from the barrel. Has anyone heard more about this? I've tried searching for info several times, but I just get a bunch of video game-related stuff.
 
The technology exists to make a liquid based propellant for firearms, or any number of alternatives to old poudre b. But they suffer from a massive shortcoming--HEAT. By their nature they develop heat as a byproduct of the reaction, and that heat has to go somewhere. The brass cartridge of 19th century design is still the cheapest most effective way of getting rid of that heat. As a secondary function it also keeps the chambers clean of soot and crud that would otherwise quickly jam it. This is another problem that the caseless ammo prototypes had.
 
There is a theoretical orbital delivery system that is a gun of sorts. It is a very long pipe with flamable gas in it and a projectile that has an oxygen supply. As the projectile nears the end the pressure of the gas increases very quickly. With a way of opening the end in a controlled manner to prevent instabilites the velocities the projectile can achieve would allow a substantial payload to be injected into orbit....or with slight variance it can be dropped on someone or even near someone re: nukes or resupply.

Because of the erratic nature of gas propellants and the excessive complexity of the control system needed the military was not pleased with them and I think they've stopped developing them.

There are in existance rail guns that are experimental and can launch small projectiles at extreme velocity. Another variant is coil guns though I'm not sure of the current velocity that has been achieved with those.
 
I have a potato gun that Is actually multi-propellant. Starting fluid, hairspray, Krylon, WD40(has to be good for something).......you get the idea. Not good at an indoor range....

In college my housemates and I created a potatoe :D gun then started modifying it... We cracked open the physics books and made some changes to the blast chamber size, barrel length, propelent, and sparker position. We ended up making a spud gun that would put a carrot through 3/4 dry wall. We started noticing that after the blast we were hearing a fast crack crack crack crack. We think it was the carrot breaking the sound barrier.

I can only imagine a few blocks away some guy on his porch smoking a cig, when all of a sudden a carrot lands nearby.
 
You should have sold the idea to one of those companies that does infomercials. I can see it now "the fastest carrot juicer ever made. This baby supersonically turns a carrot into juice in one/one thousandth of a second AND protects your home from an invader. Take that Elmer Fudd!"
 
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