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An extremely reckeless situational awareness exercise

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Jiggle, Jan 8, 2008.

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  1. Jiggle

    Jiggle Member

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    I'll start by saying that I visit this forum multiple times each day. I have learned so much valuable information here, and I truly believe that I am a more responsible gun owner because of it. However, I'm young and ignorant, so I've kept my mouth shut so far. I was involved in an incident last night that I thought may serve as a lesson to others, and I thought I'd post it. But first a little background info:

    I was at my best friend's [BestFriend] girlfriend's apartment hagning out after work. One of BestFriend's other friends [Moron] came over with his girlfriend. I have never really been fond of Moron, as he is the type who will do anything for attention. He has been carrying concealed weapons (illegally) since he was 18. A few months ago he had an AD at his house, which sent a 45ACP round through 2 doors and into his water heater. If a gunfight breaks out on a TV show, he'll pull his weapon out, fully loaded, and pretend to shoot all the bad guys on the television. He is now 23, and is considered the loser of the group. After all, he hangs out with a bunch of 20 years olds. Also, Moron is a police dispatcher, so he thinks that:

    1. He is an LEO, and
    2. He is invincible


    So anyway, the three of us (BestFriend, Moron and myself) sat around the kitchen table for a bit and talked about various aspects of gun ownership. After a while I got bored of Moron's incessant rambling and laid down on the floor to doze off for a minute. A minute later, I hear a chair hit the wall. I look up in time to see Moron pull his Kahr 9mm from his waistband and shove it into Bestfriend's temple. BTW, the gun is fully loaded with a round chambered. BestFriend, who has pretty good defensive reflexes, immediately pushes Moron's hands, with the gun, up toward the ceiling and plows him back into the kitchen counter. At this point, I had no clue what was going on, so I ran over and tried to get the gun out of Moron's hand. Bestfriend backed off, and I looked down and realized that not only is the gun pointed directly at me, but Moron's finger is on the trigger. I let go. After a second to cool down, I am told that they were talking about situational awareness, and Moron decided to see how good BestFriend's was. I immediately left the apartment and vowed never to step foot in the same room as Moron again.

    I also sent him a rather nasty email telling him that he should immediately stop talking to the people he cares about so he doesn't get them killed.

    BestFriend now has a bruise from where the gun hit him in the head, and scraped up knuckles from trying to wrestle it away from Moron. How the gun didn't discharge, I have no idea. With three people wrestling for it, things could have turned out very bad.

    If I could do it over, I would have called the police and hopefully had his firearms rights revoked for life.

    It is truly a shame that we have people like this on "our side".


    Moral of the story: If somebody's firearm etiquette, or lack thereof, makes you nervous, please just avoid them. It's not worth getting killed over.
     
  2. siglite

    siglite Member

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    :what:

    Wow, just wow. That guy has a name in his future. It's "inmate."
     
  3. Spyvie

    Spyvie Member

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    You should still file a police report! If Moron works for a LE agency, his employers need to know about his actions, particularly the CC without a permit part. (and possibly the felony menacing part)
     
  4. Jiggle

    Jiggle Member

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    He actually does have a CWP now. He just got it maybe 2 weeks ago.
     
  5. Fn-P9

    Fn-P9 Member

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    wild story. I guess not only was it a reckless situational awareness test on morons part but you ignored you own. Moron with gun = whaddaya expect. Sorry cant really harp on you being that I have been knowen to hang around stupid people sometimes myself. Thanks for sharing the story.
     
  6. antsi

    antsi Member

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    Somebody needs to drop a dime on this dude.

    Call his PD employer and let them know they have a dangerous nut job working for them.
     
  7. CombatArmsUSAF

    CombatArmsUSAF Member

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    Somebody needs to put a boot to this guys rear end. This guy truly sounds like a textbook moron. If that had been me, (Sorry got to keep it to the high road)
     
  8. Heywood Case

    Heywood Case Member

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    I had a neighbor once with a similar problem. He ended up dead, at the hands of his best friend. My 2 cents:

    Thanks for sharing this frightening story. I agree with your last recommendation.

    Avoiding "Moron" is only part of what you need to do. If "Bestfriend" is also "Moron"'s friend, some hard work is in order. It is easy to blame it all on "Moron" but you need to reconsider the judgment of your best friend and your own judgment if you don't want this to happen again.

    Nasty emails are not a very good way to resolve this type of situation. In my experience, it's best done face to face or not at all.

    Good luck. Please read the responses to your post very carefully. You will get some good advice but it may not all be easy to read.
     
  9. Unisaw

    Unisaw Member

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    You need new friends. And, you should go ahead and file a police report.
     
  10. Leanwolf

    Leanwolf Member

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    You already know this Moron is a tragic accident on the way someplace to happen....

    Why in the world are you hanging around with him????

    L.W.
     
  11. Jiggle

    Jiggle Member

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    I am aware that I did not handle things exactly the correct way. If I wasn't ready for constructive criticism I wouldn't post on this site. BestFriend really does not like hanging out with Moron either, but Moron's GF is good friends with BestFriend's GF. He wasn't invited by either of us, he came with his girlfriend. I have told my friend that I refuse to go anywhere with Moron from now on, and he completely understands, but I doubt that he will make the same decision. Don't get me wrong, he was furious, as was I, but for some reason he keeps Moron around.

    The email I wrote wasn't meant to accomplish anything, I just had to let him know how PO'd I was. As soon as this ended I stormed out of the apartment before I could do something stupid (you know, aside from wrestling for a loaded weapon lol) and I never got to get my feelings out.

    I told my friend later that I couldn't believe the gun didn't go off. He replied with "I know, I should be dead". He also said (I'm aware there are many things wrong with this, but I do see the logic in it as well) that he was actually trying to pull the trigger. He said as soon as he got the gun pointed in the air, he figured the best thing to do would be to empty the magazine. BTW, we were on the top floor, so there was nobody above us.
     
  12. Spyvie

    Spyvie Member

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    If this story is just as you have told it, I believe you have a moral responsibility to report this guy to the police.
     
  13. mr hanky

    mr hanky Member

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    Wow. I agree that a police report is in order. Even if Moron's gun rights are revoked I still forsee moron doing more stupid things with guns. You can't reprogram for stupid seeing as how he has been doing things like trying to kill friends and illegal CCW. Police Report and new friends at the minimum.
     
  14. Dr. Peter Venkman

    Dr. Peter Venkman Member

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    Report it NOW...it might be too late because of your inaction, however.
     
  15. mekender

    mekender Member

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    yeah thats a tough one... on one hand i say go for it, file a report... on the other hand, he might have some LEO friends that are as moronic as he is and they could make your life hell...

    probably best to just not go around him any more
     
  16. Jiggle

    Jiggle Member

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    How would I go about filing a report 2 days after this happened?

    And please keep in mind that Moron is not, nor has he ever been, my friend. Somehow, he occasionally shows up at a party or get-together. I generally try to avoid him, or at the very least convince him to leave his gun in the truck (which he will do, if asked to). I don't feel that I should get a whole new group of friends because one idiot somehow gets himself invited to things that we do. I have made the decision to never go anywhere with him again. I will try to convince my friends to do the same. I think that is the best I can do.
     
  17. bogie

    bogie Member

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    1) He thinks he's a cop.

    2) He thinks that makes him competent.

    3) Suggest to his bosses that he get a nice rubber gun until he is given adequate training.
     
  18. Jiggle

    Jiggle Member

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    Not only that but his dad was in LE for 30+ years, so he feels he already knows everything there is to know. I think all I would have to do is tell his dad what he did and he would surely get the beating of his life.
     
  19. siglite

    siglite Member

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    Something that's not being taken into consideration with all the "file a report" posts, is that this guy's a dispatcher. LEOs can say 'till they're blue in the face that he'd be treated like anyone else, but depending on the department (and the size of the department) that's NOT a given. How big is the town? How big is the department? Are you talking 2 officers? 20? 200?

    Honestly, in a smaller town, this might be something best handled "back door." Unless you're an LEO yourself, you don't have TRUE access to the circle so to speak. But you can get their attention. And this is how I would handle it.

    Assuming a department smaller than 100 officers or so:
    I'd call in sometime when this guy's not at the radio. I'd ask to speak to the shift commander. He'll probably not be available, but I'd leave a message, he'll probably call back. Once I got him on the phone, I'd tell him that I had an "incident" I wanted to talk about. But I would not elaborate on the phone. I'd then offer to meet him in person anywhere in town, any time. When I met him, I'd thank him for taking the time to talk to me. Then I'd lay the story out EXACTLY as it happened. No embellishment. No exaggeration. Just the facts. I would frame it as "I just want to give you guys a head's up."

    If there have been prior incidents, and his perception is that this guy's a clown, he might ask to write out an official statement. This might be the incident that confirms all of their suspicions and opinions.

    But most likely that won't happen. However, what WILL be accomplished, is that they'll be aware that one who is "sort of their own" might be a problem. And believe me, a lot of departments treat their dispatchers as "one of their own." In larger departments, I don't know how true that is. But in small and medium departments it's really the case in my experience. The officers will likely talk about it amongst each other. One of them likely ask him about what happened and get his side. It's unlikely they'll tell him who spoke up. None of this will happen on paper. But if you stick purely to the facts, chances are, you'll come off credible. As you well should. And if they ask him, they'll know if he's BSing or trying to downplay what was a terribly dangerous situation. LEOs are people persons. They know when they're being b$'d. And they'll talk. And they'll watch him. And if he lies to them he'll find that radio room is a chillier place.

    If it's a much larger department, I have no idea how practical this is. Maybe someone can chime in with experience in/around a big dept.
     
  20. gravis86

    gravis86 Member

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    THEN DO IT

    Many times people do things just because they can get away with it. If his dad didn't know he was illegally CCing since he was 18, he should.

    And if you truly believe that filing a report with the PD would hurt you more than it would him, I think telling his dad is his (and your) best bet.
     
  21. Ragnar Danneskjold

    Ragnar Danneskjold Member

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    If any friend, colleague, battle buddy, etc ever points a weapon at me, I don't know him any more. We're done.
     
  22. Jiggle

    Jiggle Member

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    Thanks for the post, Siglite. I'm in Palm Beach County, but the PD he works for is very small. They have no more than 3 or 4 officers on duty at a time. I know that he goes out drinking with all the guys at his PD, so I doubt very much that speaking to somebody there would accomplish a whole lot. I have met a few of them before and it seems that they all just screw around together. As for talking to his dad, I would love to. I just don't want to come off as the random kid who kocked on his door to tattle-tale on his son. That makes me look like the crazy person. It would be different if I had actually met his dad and he knew that I was a credible person. I have heard stories about that man, and he doesn't seem like the type you want to irritate. You'd think his son would've turned out better...:rolleyes:
     
  23. siglite

    siglite Member

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    Well, if you don't feel you can get a shift commander or one of the officer's ear without repercussions, your only option is to just disassociate yourself from the guy. But you might find problems with your conscience. I don't know. I'm just thinking out loud on that. If they have 4 officers on duty at a time, that's probably a 20-ish officer department. It also means that it's a big enough jurisdiction that they have more to worry about than "some punk that tattled on their dispatcher."

    I think if you get a sergeant or lieutenant's ear for ten minutes, you'll be taken seriously. Again, it's unlikely that anything will happen on paper. But you'll plant the bug. And that bug can go a long ways in a department that size.
     
  24. Heywood Case

    Heywood Case Member

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    It's great that you are interested in getting constructive criticism. Perhaps you should print out this thread for your friend to read.

    Are the girlfriends in question prepared to sacrifice your best friend for "Moron"'s sake? This is not about being furious or living up to the standards of anonymous people on the internet (however much you may value their advice), it is about staying alive. I hope you can find a way to help your friend understand the risk he is taking. It sounds like he doesn't fully understand it himself.

    Only you can decide the "correct way" to handle the situation. We can only offer advice. It's easy to say "get new friends", but it is not so easy to turn your back on someone you care about. But don't assume that what you have already done or decided is the best you can do. Most likely, you're capable of much more.
     
  25. eliphalet

    eliphalet Member

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    Keep yourself where "moron" isn't no matter the cost now, friends g/f's or whatever, they will be short term costs. Like Leanwolf said this guy is a problem looking to happen and those costs could be life long. Be smart don't be part of it.
     
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