Anti-freedom stance by Florida gun shop

[Florida_Cracker]

This past weekend Pickett Weaponry of Newberry, Florida held their “Annual Fall Expo.” Over the years I have purchased several firearms, ammunition and accessories from them. (http://www.pickettweaponry.com/)

As I entered their store I noticed a sign stating: "NO FIREARMS except for on duty Law Enforcement Officers" or words to that effect.

I was then greeted by two gentlemen posted at the door and asked if I was armed. I was then told to leave my concealed weapons in my vehicle. Were such a request made by Walmart or Target or Lowe’s or Home Depot, I believe that most of us would be angered and offended.

I have informed the proprietors that I will never again spend so much as a penny in their establishment. I would have taken the same action against Walmart, Target, Lowe’s or Home Depot if they had so greeted me at their door. I would encourage others to consider taking similar action.

The hypocrisy of a business that makes its living selling firearms to the public attempting to restrict the carrying of concealed weapons by duly authorized civilians on their premises surpasses belief.

I was able to carry on an email discussion with one of the owners. To his credit he did respond to my concerns. To my view all the compelling reasons (excuses) he presents for this extremely hypocritical stance do not justify it. If anyone is interested in the details, I will email you a text file of the entire exchange if you send me your email address.

Essentially the owner asserted that: "This is a special weekend 'expo' we only require this one weekend a year. We have many more people in the store and many untrained temporary sales people."

I understand that the owner was concerned about safety . . . there are ALWAYS compelling reason for disarming us, whether they come from Babylon on the Potomac, the Brady Bunch or a gun shop owner.

Molon Labe,

 

[xd45gaper]

they do the same thing with gun shows around here. im actually glad they do it if you have ever been to a gun show in jacksonville, there are so many "mall ninjas" there its not even funny i could only imagine get some punks carrying a "9" showing it off to some vendor or another mall ninja and there is an AD.

 

[AirForceShooter]

my favorite Florida gun shop has a sign in the door of "No Loaded Weapons except LEO's".
I can live with that.
and yeah, Florida gun shows plastic tie your CCW at the show so it's not loaded.
Damn'd ninja's screw up everything.

AFS

 

[mp510]

While I haven't noticed this trend locally, I noticed that a lot of gunshops and every show that I have been to has a similar policy. Some say, 'If you are carrying a gun, don't handle or draw it in the store', others simply say 'no loaded firearms'. For the first, one gunstore owner said the policy is for his customers protection, so that he doesn't shoot a customer, mistaking an innocent gesture as a threat.

 

[xd45gaper]

there is a gunstore i frequent with a no loaded weapons sign on the door. i brought my 642 in to find a belt holster they didnt say much about it other than what do you need. the other stores i frequent though are more friendly towards CCW.

 

[tanksoldier]

If you disagree with thie strongly enough, then don't give them your business.

However, it is unfair to lump them with the Brady bunch or others who attempt to legislate our rights away. The shop owner is exercising HIS rights as a private property owner. His decision has no impact on your rights, because you have no right to enter his store in the first place. You enter with his permission. His decision is not preventing you from carrying elsewhere that you DO have the right to access. If you want to access his property you have to follow his rules, just as he would if he wanted to enter your home or a business you owned.

I understand that the owner was concerned about safety . . . there are ALWAYS compelling reason for disarming us, whether they come from Babylon on the Potomac, the Brady Bunch or a gun shop owner.

 

[Sleeping Dog]

If this restriction is something the store owner does one weekend per year, I'd cut him some slack. He's not anti, just a little jittery about the crowd that might show up.

Regards.

 

[rbernie]

However, it is unfair to lump them with the Brady bunch or others who attempt to legislate our rights away.

I disagree. Disarming me 'for my safety and the safety of others' is, well, what it is - regardless of who does it. Turning a blind eye to it because it's done by gunnies make no sense to me. Either us'n CCWers are trusted to carry, or we're not. You can't play both sides of that fence.

He's not anti, just a little jittery about the crowd that might show up.

Then he should post that unlawful possession or carrying of loaded firearms is not permitted. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater - that's EXACTLY what the Brady Bunch would do. 'It's for public safety'. Freakin' spare me.

I cut my gunshows some slack, because they can't get event insurance any other way. But a gun store 'open house'? For shame....

 

[El Tejon]

His store, his rules. However, remember, people go into the gun business not to further our rights or to make money; people go into the gun business to tell other people NO!

 

[Florida_Cracker]

Thanks to everyone for their input and comments.

As I understand it, "No Firearms" signs or "No Concealed Carry" signs have no legal standing in Florida. However, I will honor this shop owner's desire . . . and as I stated earlier, he has seen the last of my business.

I suppose if it was just a sign I probably would have entered anyway, but he had two men at the door specifically asking all who entered if they were armed.

There are always excuses, but what would our reaction be if this was being done by Walmart? I fail to see why it is not as bad if done by a gun shop. To me it is simply blatant hypocrisy and it sets a terrible example and precedent for all other commercial enterprises.

 

[mpmarty]

I carry in gun shows, Wal Mart, and everywhere else that lacks a metal detector. If I am asked if I am carrying I inform the person that it is none of their ****ing business and if they offer to pat me down I offer to press sexual assault charges and suggest that they must be gay and trying to touch me.

 

[crucible]

A gunshop that requires me to disarm will never get any of my money-for anything. Yes they can do so as it is thier shop, but that makes them no better than anyplace else that does, and in my mind, a hell of a lot worse for being a "gun store". ("See! Even gun shops don't allow CCW").

If they are concerned about a weapon being discharged within thier premesis, then I submit they can and should change their sign language to something different, say barring the drawing of loaded concealed weapons unless given permission...or some alternative.

Gun shops in particular should go out of thier friggen way to entice CCWers as they are very apt to spend regularly opposed to just anyone walking through the door; purposefully alienating them is very self-defeating strategically, and damned poor business sense to boot.

 

[bogie]

I'll bet that at one time or another, some bubba went in, said he wanted to buy a holster, then whipped out his loaded portable boomstick, finger on the trigger, and swept half the customers and all the help with the muzzle...

 

[Rumble]

The shop I frequent the most has some interesting signage. They teach CCW courses, but their signs are all over the place:

Do not uncase or unholster a firearm without permission.
No loaded firearms outside the range.
No holstered firearms inside or outside the range.
All firearms must be cased or holstered when outside the range.

In all honesty, though, I've never had a problem. I carry on their range, and I'm sure they've seen the carry piece from time to time, but they don't seem to really care. However, I suppose it might be worth it to point out their signs are somewhat inconsistent.

 

[tanksoldier]

There is no fence. You have the right to enter a public library. Therefore the govt should not be able to restrict your access by putting condions on it that infringe on your other rights. Which doesn't mean that you can go into a library and raise a ruckus... the other patrons have a right to the quiet one expects in a library.

You have no right to enter a private business, and the business owner has every right to put conditions on you when you enter. He could require that you submit to a search before you enter, he could require that you remove your shoes, he could require that you wear one of those paper breath masks. It's a conflict between your right to be armed and the property owner's rights... and on his property his rights come first, as it should be. If you don't want to follow his rules, don't go in.

If you come to my house and I ask you to remove your shoes, it would be extremely rude for you to walk in without doing so, and I would be perfectly within my rights to ask you to leave and have you charged with trespassing if you refused to leave. Likewise, fi I knew you usually carried a gun and I asked you not to bring it when you come to visit, you may not like that but I'm not infringing on your rights. If you bring it anyway you're infringing on my rights in my house. If I come to your house I would abide by your rules just the same or leave.

Private entities cannot infringe on your rights, only the govt can do that. If the govt bans a music video from being played, that's censorship. If MTV refuses or restricts a video, that's not censorship... it's a private business making a business decision. Anywhere a private entity has power over you is a place you have no intrinsic right to be, usually on property owned by that entity.

If the conditions that a private person puts on you to access their property seem excessive to you then don't go there, and if it's a business don't spend your money there... but don't expect a person to give up THEIR rights just so you can exercise yours.

I disagree. Disarming me 'for my safety and the safety of others' is, well, what it is - regardless of who does it. Turning a blind eye to it because it's done by gunnies make no sense to me. Either us'n CCWers are trusted to carry, or we're not. You can't play both sides of that fence.

 

[Wes Janson]

On the gripping hand, I've had so many gun store clerks hand me weapons without checking them, that I'm no longer surprised when it happens. Any time a weapon enters your hands, check it! I'm sure that's the reason for the zip ties at the local gun shows-because someone was an idiot and assumed something to be unloaded. And customers aren't always the idiots pulling the trigger.

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

I see no problem with this

I am afraid I can understand where they are coming from. They are a business with a great deal of inventory and a lot of cash on hand.

Their primary goal is to make money and maintain a safe enviroment; not to make a political statement. Just be glad you have gun shops that you can still go to and buy the firearm of your choice and don't jump on a soapbox everytime a private owner takes precautions to help ensure the safety of his/her employees and his/her business.

 

[MechAg94]

Who is being Anti-Freedom here?

A) You, who want to force the property owner to comply with your wishes?

Or

B) The Property Owner who wants you to comply with his rules on HIS property?


Everyone else is not supposed to have to give up their freedoms just so you can do anything you want. If it were a public building or space, I would agree that you shouldn't be restricted, but not on private property.

 

[Jim K]

I am torn a on this one. I can see people being ticked off that a gun shop seems to be anti-gun.

On the other hand, I have worked in a gun store and have had customers point guns at me (not a robbery), sweep everyone in the store, put a bullet into the ceiling, etc. And that was in a state where CCW licenses are very hard to get.

One guy came in to buy "bullets" for his rifle; when I asked the caliber, he raised the gun and pointed it right at my head so I could see what size it was! I had a cop draw on me and aim at my chest so I could admire his new gun. So yes, I can see why a gun store might ban bringing guns in unless cased and/or even ban concealed handguns.

Jim

 

[Waitone]

Ever been in a gunshow when some idiot accidently lets one go? Neither have I and I want to keep it that way. Too many people too close together handling too many firearms. It ain't got nuthin' to do with rights and has everything to do with safety. You may be the epitome of safe gun handling. You can not say the same for those on either side of you.

 

[crucible]

Their primary goal is to make money and maintain a safe enviroment; not to make a political statement.

Thier very existance in most cases makes a political statement, and their on-going everyday business is political in nature as well (selling guns! to people!); something I'd bet every gun store owner recognizes (particularly in less gun friendly places).

Just be glad you have gun shops that you can still go to and buy the firearm of your choice and don't jump on a soapbox everytime a private owner takes precautions to help ensure the safety of his/her employees and his/her business.

I *am* glad for shops that exhibit good business sense not to purposefully alienate what could be some of thier most loyal customers, of whom by practice and law (here in Va. at least) are probably the most law abiding and capable than the vast majority of the folks that walk through thier doors. But that very same logic ("ensuring the safety" by banning outright) can be applied to just about any place against firearms legally being...even owned (sound familiar?), and we all know that criminals (and idiots) obey laws and signs against similar things well too eh?

Still, it *is* thier place, and as private property rights are the backbone of western civilization, they can and should set thier own rules as they see fit.

But for the ones that do set that kind of rule (banning outright), the internet is a great place to shop for *all* my needs-and is bound to be cheaper to boot. And I won't feel bad in the slightest when they go out of business.

Isn't freedom grand?

C-

 

[carterbeauford]

I carry in gun shows, Wal Mart, and everywhere else that lacks a metal detector. If I am asked if I am carrying I inform the person that it is none of their ****ing business and if they offer to pat me down I offer to press sexual assault charges and suggest that they must be gay and trying to touch me.

Do you think that makes the rest of us that OC look professional?

I had a bad OC experience in VA over the weekend but I didn't handle it like that. Read about it on opencarry.org

"No guns" in a gun shop is about a catch-22 if I've ever seen one. I will open carry into any gun shop in the commonwealth, if they ask me to leave, they're probably not going to get any of my money. They can decide which is more important.

 

[geekWithA.45]

Gah, here we go with the libertarian "it's private property, so the proprietor can do whatever he wants" shibboleth again.

It's not PRIVATE property. If it were PRIVATE, you wouldn't be there.

It is privately owned property of public accommodation, and this calls for a different balancing of interests than someone's residence.

 

[Limeyfellow]

The shows that I been to in NC tend to just require you not to have ammo in your firearm you are concealed or open carrying. Most the stores allow you to stay armed that I been into, though since they are so far away to find a decent store I rarely go to them.

 

[Sistema1927]

Not sure that it is "anti-freedom", but it is certainly not good for business. I would also express my displeasure with a gun store with this policy, even if it is his right.

If you can't trust me with my CCW in your store, then I won't trust you with my money. Both of us have a choice, but I won't be the one going out of business.