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Any dream calibers that don't exist?

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by JDMorris, Dec 22, 2010.

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  1. RonE

    RonE Member

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    Well, so much for the practical, how'bout necking down the .50 BMG to .30 cal and shooting 220 gr bullets at 4,000 fps?

    Or maybe necking the .378 Wby Mag down to .204 and shooting a 40 gr bullet at about 5,000 fps?

    I think that there is already someone necking the .50 BMG up to .700 or thereabouts and shooting 6-700 gr bullets.
     
  2. JDMorris

    JDMorris Member

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    I went through my replies to some peoples' comments when I first joined,
    I cringed, I posted some disrespectful, and non-needed comments, and I apologize for that, I guess I just thought this forum was another group of computer guys.
    Boy was I wrong, great forum, great people.
    I just didn't grasp that off the bat.
    Now, it feels like a little community more than a "forum"
    Way to go THR :D
    Best gun website out there.
     
  3. HOOfan_1

    HOOfan_1 Member

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    I think the McMillan people took a 20mm case, shortened it a bit and necked it down to .50
     
  4. JDMorris

    JDMorris Member

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    Wow, that's crazy.
    Those guys at McMillan are super mall ninja.
    Pshh. 1000 dollar stocks..
     
  5. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

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    Yo, JD.

    See if you can get a copy of Cartridges of the World (CotW) for Christmas.
    It has a lot of the sort of stuff you are talking about.
    Mr Ackley's books, mentioned by coug, will show you even more.

    I was 13 when I got my first Gun Digest - the 1957 edition - and I still went back and referred to it occasionally until it was lost in a fire last January. Good books are pure pleasure and not everything is to be found on the Internet.
     
  6. JDMorris

    JDMorris Member

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    I'll look into it, thank you sir. Haha.. at the "Yo".
     
  7. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator Emeritus

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    JDMorris, you probably should make a call out to Ohio and volunteer to do an internship sweeping up the shop or something for JD Jones.

    I think I'm not too far out of line in considering him the king of modern wildcatters -- though he heads in a different direction than the old guys: http://www.sskindustries.com/cartridges.htm

    The one to beat would HAVE to be the 14.7mmJDJ. There's just a certain something about a bullet moving 2,700 fps, when it weighs 1,173 grains (well over 2-1/2 oz.) Or a puny 700 grainer breaking 3,000: http://www.sskindustries.com/14_5.htm
     
  8. HOOfan_1

    HOOfan_1 Member

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    How about take a .30 T/C neck it down to .257, .264, .277 or .284 and build a youth bolt action around it. Would get my vote over the .243 for sure. Wonder how many wildcats are based on the .30 T/C. Or take the original 1906 .30 Remington and do the same thing.
     
  9. JDMorris

    JDMorris Member

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    I don't think that would work.. Ohio is a little out of the way.
    But he's cool to think up and create those rounds.
     
  10. Coal Dragger

    Coal Dragger member

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    I would like to see factory versions of necked down .375 Ruger in 7mm, .308, .338, and .358.
     
  11. Funshooter45

    Funshooter45 Member

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    Usually, as we shoot more and experiment more, we gain wisdom and realize that trying to get an extra 200 fps out of an overbore case just isn't worth it.

    Usually, but not always. I have a friend who lives down the road who has shot a variety of cartridges in fine rifles for the last 30 years. He is an excellent marksman and a meticulous reloader who has taught me a lot. You would think he would be immune from silly teenager thoughts about super hi velocity cartridges. But nope. He has a custom rifle he had made that shoots a .22 cal bullet from a necked down 7 MM Mag case. He told me what the chronograph says but I don't believe it. But it does shoot fast because he said the biggest problem he had at first was to find a .22 bullet that didn't separate from the jacket as it exited the barrel. Basically, he shoots a solid copper bullet now with not HP or any enhancements.

    Totally worthless, but kinda interesting anyway.
     
  12. JDMorris

    JDMorris Member

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    thats crazy, I bet that gun will get less than 1000 rounds before the barrel expires, but the cool thing, that guy probably knows that and doesn't care.
     
  13. Funshooter45

    Funshooter45 Member

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    Yep you nailed it. He doesn't care if he has to rebarrel after 500 rounds. The only thing important to him is that in his mind he has the fastest rifle in the county. Yeah, he can shoot extremely well, better than me anyway. I think he could shoot the same coyote just as dead with his other rifles but this makes him special I guess.

    Anyway, it doesn't fit with the original question. It's not a dream caliber that I would dream of. After a lot of shooting, I think I am coming back to kind of boring cartridges kind of intrigiung me. Well, except for my WSM cartridges, they are kind of cool really.
     
  14. JDMorris

    JDMorris Member

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    My next rifle will either be a .223, or a .300 win mag or other magnum round, with a heavy barrel if it works out like I want it to but It'll be half way through the new year most likely. I have a .308, I need to have to other ends of the scale. Either a varmint round, or a magnum.
     
  15. oldfool

    oldfool Member

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    not a handloader myself, but if you roll your own, interesting things could be done with a 22-250, quite different than a 308
     
  16. Jason_W

    Jason_W Member

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    I've thought a rimless version of the .357 magnum tuned to function in an M1 carbine style gun would be cool. That was sort of already done by Winchester with their .351 Win in the early 20th C, but I think it's an interesting concept to revisit.
     
  17. Johnny Guest

    Johnny Guest Moderator Emeritus

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    Re: The side topic about the proposed 2) .25-08 cartridge --

    HOOfan
    JDMorris
    fireman 9731

    Not to be dismissive of the .25-08 idea, but - - Yep, .308 case (7.62x51mm) is rather shorter than the .257 Roberts case. As a matter of historic interest, the .257R is the 7x57 mm Mauser, trimmed a bit and necked down to .257. It became a Remington factory cartridge in 1934 after several years as a wildcat. The parent case is nominally 56.77mm (2.235".) The .257R is 56.72mm (2.233".)

    As an aside, the .25-08 would be very like the .250 Savage (.250-3000.) The parent case is 48.56mm (1.912") in length. The proposed .25-08 could certainly be loaded (for bolt guns) to higher pressures than the .250 Sav, which is held to 45,000 CUP max, in deference to the Savage 99 lever actions and the like.

    Just thinking out loud, y'know?
    Johnny
     
  18. redneck2

    redneck2 Member

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    There are two books you guys may want to consider (Christmas maybe?)

    As noted, Cartridges of the World lists most everything that's been developed. If you think you've got a new idea, you can go to that book and find out that someone has most likely done it.

    The other, The Handloader's Manual of Cartridge Conversions has about every wildcat you can imagine.

    Simple physics comes into play with a lot of these hyper velocity rounds. A 10% increase in powder capacity typically only gives a 2 1/2% increase in velocity. The extra energy goes into burning up your barrel quicker. Years ago, the guys at Handloader Magazine made up a (IIRC) .416 Rigby necked down to .22 to try to exceed 5,000 fps. I believe barrel life was less than 100 rounds.

    Also, no matter how you reshape a case, a given ratio of powder/bullet weight/diameter is pretty much going to be the same. Calibers like the BR's do a little better, but in the end it washes out close.

    The WSM series tried to make you think they had some magic formula for effeciency. All they did was stuff a faster powder into the case and run at increased pressure to get very slightly more velocity. This all comes at the cost of more muzzle blast, sharper recoil, and shorter barrel life. Barrel life may not be much of a factor as I suspect that most of them end up sitting in a gun cabinet instead of actually being used.

    In the real world, changing the shoulder angle by a few degrees is pretty much meaningless. A .30 bullet @ 2,700 fps kills an elk just the same no matter what magical caliber launched it.

    IMO.....If most guys spent their time practicing instead of dreaming up new calibers, they'd be better shooters. But, I suppose it gives one something to do on a winter's day.
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2010
  19. Johnny Guest

    Johnny Guest Moderator Emeritus

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    Oh yeah, the Soupers

    I'd forgotten about the .25 Souper. I have zero experience with that cartridge. It's pretty easy to miss, though. It's not even shown in Cartridges of the World 11th Edition.

    Attn: JDMorris
    GREAT idea. That's one of the very basic reference works. You'll catch yourself reading it just for fun. Heck, it's so worthwhile, you'll be glad if you buy it for yourownself. Check at Amazon. Cabella's had the 12th edition on sale last month, too.

    Johnny
     
  20. kludge

    kludge Member

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    I think a .204 Hornet/K-Hornet would be cool. Never seen it done. .17 Hornet, yup already done.
     
  21. JDMorris

    JDMorris Member

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  22. 68wj

    68wj Member

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    .256 Win Mag, the magnum's magnum :uhoh::D
     
  23. grace2u

    grace2u Member

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    I would like a .223 equivalent in rimfire for coyote during deer seasons.
     
  24. Tentwing

    Tentwing Member

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    Since we're just posting ideas for fun... how about a 17-06 :uhoh:

    FEAR no Squirrel....;)
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2010
  25. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

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    "I would like a .223 equivalent in rimfire for coyote during deer seasons."


    Probably not technically feasible considering the case volume and chamber pressures required.
    Do you have legal requirements that limit you to rimfires on varmints during deer season?
     
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