Quantcast

Anyone else agree that the price of black powder guns is waaaaay out o' line ?

Discussion in 'Blackpowder' started by BADUNAME30, May 24, 2012.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. BADUNAME30

    BADUNAME30 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2009
    Messages:
    1,876
    Location:
    Neshannock, Pa.
    I've heard all kinds of theories on this subject.
    Such as...
    Now that S&W owns Thompson Center, they are sellin out to the antis by makin the price of T/C BP guns unafordable for the average buyer.
    They are makin the prices so high so that the average buyer won't want one therefore he/she won't be owning any 'explosives', as in ,black powder.
    Therefore they can curb the ownership and keep better track of the powder.
    S&W is just outright greedy.
    S&W wants rid alltogether of BP firearms.
    S&W wants to be rid completely of all civilian sales and sell strictly to Military and LE contracts.

    Now as for the Ruger Old Army.
    The theory i hear most is that since a .45LC cylinder can be purchased for that gun and a black powder gun is not an FFL regulated gun that people denied a firearm purchase do to criminal records can buy a ROA and then simply purchase a drop in .45 LC cylinder and now have an unregistered center fire handgun.
    Also, law abiding citizens can also do the same thing and have posession of a firearm that does not require registering. Hence, a gun ,'under the radar' for when this country finaly reaches the point of 'feces being violently propelled from the ocilating device'.:rolleyes:

    Whatever the reason(s), The price of BP firearms is indeed way out of control.
    NOTHING justifies a T/C Hawken flintlock rifle being worth $700-$800 :mad:

    What say ye on these matters ?
     
  2. hang fire

    hang fire Member

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2012
    Messages:
    1,089
    One can buy excellent Pietta BP revolvers from Cabela's for a ridiculously low price.

    Just my opine, but the Peitta 1858 Remington is the best of the lot, (other's mileage may vary) I find it hard to believe at $200.00 or less, is the price for a revolver of that quality.

    I have a Pietta 1858 target model, yeah, I know Remington never made one, but I wanted to see just how accurate the 1858 could be with a set of adjustable sights. At 25 yards with RB and BP, it can more than hold it's own for accuracy with modern top of the line handguns.


    Two taped hole were sight adjusting shots.

    Target.jpg
     
  3. Tim the student

    Tim the student Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2009
    Messages:
    3,428
    Location:
    IA
  4. JohnBT

    JohnBT Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2002
    Messages:
    13,233
    Location:
    Richmond, Virginia
    "They are makin the prices so high so that the average buyer won't want one therefore he/she won't be owning any 'explosives', as in ,black powder."

    Or maybe some folks will skip buying the gun and just stock up on black powder with the savings. Do they make you show your gun to buy black powder where you live?

    John
     
  5. Slamfire

    Slamfire Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2006
    Messages:
    10,130
    Location:
    Alabama
    You have lived too long. Money is just not worth what it used to be when you were young.

    Live long enough and you will be buying a cup of coffee for $100.00.

    I remember those $12.00 Lee Enfields and $89.00 Garands.
     
  6. T Bran

    T Bran Member

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2010
    Messages:
    920
    Location:
    Homestead FL
    To be honest the only conspiracy is to take $ from your pocket and put it in theirs.
    I say this because you can make your own BP if you really want some bad enough to put in the effort.
    It does make me wish I'd have stocked up better years ago but as they say hind site is 20/20.
    T
     
  7. joecil

    joecil Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2012
    Messages:
    782
    Location:
    Lexington, Kentucky
    You need to set up a group buy, like my group did. We paid on a 25 lb order the following prices which I bought 2 lbs of each. Oh and we could order what every brand or size powder we wanted. I'm sorry I don't know where they got it but will try to find out as they ordered on a Monday and had it on Thursday.

    KiK 2f $13.00
    Goex 2f $14.50
    Schuetzen 2f $15.00
    Swiss 2f $22.30
     
  8. Carl N. Brown

    Carl N. Brown Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2005
    Messages:
    8,697
    Location:
    Kingsport Tennessee
    And how much is it due to inflation? or the cheapening of the dollar?

    A lot of us oldsters sometimes remember old prices, like Mauser 98k for 29.95, and complain. But I remember when I griped about the prices of military surplus when imports resumed after the FOPA, I was reminded that between 1968 and 1986, the inflation in all prices was 360%.

    Look over a longer span of years, the $2 allowance I got in 1960 as a kid could buy what $15 would buy in 2010.
     
  9. FROGO207

    FROGO207 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2008
    Messages:
    7,968
    Location:
    Mount Desert Island Maine
    It's them dang civil war enthusiasts gearing up for reenactment day or the recent popularity of gong shooting with smoke poles that are raising the prices don't ya know.:D

    Seriously I don't see the big problem. I see better built firearms for a reasonable price in today's market. Along with the dollar loosing ground with the countries that export said firearms.
     
  10. HGUNHNTR

    HGUNHNTR Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2006
    Messages:
    2,541
    Location:
    Georgia
    Yeah dude, firearms companie have a lot to gain by pricing products outside of the reach of their target market. If there is one thing in this world that trumps politics, its profit.
     
  11. dev_null

    dev_null Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2002
    Messages:
    1,338
    Location:
    Austin TX
    I'm out of tinfoil, will Reynolds Wrap do? ;->
     
  12. JSpear

    JSpear Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2011
    Messages:
    173
    ^^^^^i had to clean off my comp After that!! Soda everywhere!!
     
  13. scythefwd

    scythefwd Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2008
    Messages:
    3,599
    Location:
    Manassas Park, VA
    This is wrong. Any gun that has a drop in center fire conversion is considered a firearm and requires a background check as if they were buying a center fire firearm. Encores, Contenders, CVA Optima Elite, CVA APEX... all require background checks even if they are considered BP firearms by most (legally, they are centerfire because the frames can become centerfire without modification).

    If you cant afford a TC, look to other brands.. there are plenty that aren't 400 yet.
     
  14. Mike OTDP

    Mike OTDP Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2007
    Messages:
    1,939
    Location:
    Somewhere in Maryland
    It's a crock. The makers set the price it takes to turn a profit. The dollar has lost value thanks to the last 3.5 years. It'll be interesting to see what happens with the Euro taking a hit in value...especially if Italy leaves it.
     
  15. Hanshi

    Hanshi Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2010
    Messages:
    935
    Location:
    Maine
    Many bp guns are over priced IMHO; but not all. The Lyman GPR costs less than the T/C Hawken and the GPR prices vary as much as $200 depending on where you buy them. Myself, I have three that I bought years ago at cheap to very good prices. Now it seem harder to find a good deal. The last few BP guns I bought were bought directly from a custom builder and weren't all that much more than a comparable Pedersoli (which are well made, by the way).
     
  16. oneounceload

    oneounceload member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2008
    Messages:
    15,710
    Location:
    Hot and Humid FL
    NOTHING is over priced if folks are buying the item. YOU might be "under-funded", or living in the past as regards what regular pricing is, but that's about it. It's the same when folks scream about "gouging" on items they voluntarily bought
     
  17. HGUNHNTR

    HGUNHNTR Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2006
    Messages:
    2,541
    Location:
    Georgia
    ^^+1 Tru dat^^
     
  18. wanderinwalker

    wanderinwalker Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2003
    Messages:
    2,237
    Location:
    SW NH
    What about them makes them so much less expensive to manufacture than centerfire firearms? They have smaller production runs but the tooling still needs to be changed over. This costs the manufacturers money. The TC and Ruger are American-manufactured firearms, I suspect the companies actually have to pay their employees every payday.

    Seriously, it is the price to pay to play. I cannot for the life of me understand why people complain about the cost of items manufactured stateside even when they want to buy American. I bet you would be thrilled if your employer cut your wages just to offer the products you make at a lower price point.

    Sorry, I get into the same rant mode when people say "It's only a .22, why so expensive" or "Why pay that much for a bicycle?" (Or anything that is "overpriced" for that matter.)
     
  19. mr.trooper

    mr.trooper Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2005
    Messages:
    1,829
    Location:
    Midwest
    Conspiracy abounds.
     
  20. treg

    treg Member

    Joined:
    May 6, 2012
    Messages:
    53
    So start making them and selling them for $500.
     
  21. Davek1977

    Davek1977 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2008
    Messages:
    2,569
    quality goods demand quality prices....would you rather pay x amount for somehting safe, reliable, and one can take pride in ownership in....or would you rather 1/2 the budget for dodgy, unsafe, gun that may or may not go boom when you want it to.....or even worse, one that goes boom when you DON'T want it to? I don't buy the conspiracy theories in the slightest. Black power guns have gone up in price.....but.....SO HAS *EVERYTHING* else. Gas, milk, raw materials, you name it....its gone up in price. Why would black powder firearms be the one item to buck the trend of prices climbing upwards?
     
  22. MAKster

    MAKster Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2006
    Messages:
    2,351
    In general, mass produced black powder guns are very inexpensive. The only exception seems to be the TC Hawken. You can buy almost identical rifles made by Investarms of Italy under the Cabelas and Lyman brand name for $200-300 less.
     
  23. Cosmoline

    Cosmoline Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2002
    Messages:
    23,648
    Location:
    Los Anchorage
    There are a lot of factors at play. For starters the Euro went absolutely crazy for a few years there, creating a major leap in imports esp. the higher end ones. This has calmed down a bit thanks to Greece. But the days of cheap production in Italy are probably gone. You can, however, still get used Italian C&B's for very reasonable prices. Pedersoli smoke poles--not so much.

    The US makers are mostly custom or semi-custom, and because production levels are so low there's going to be a hike in price. In most cases you are actually buying from *A GUY* or a guy in his family. I believe the true factory US makers are either out of black powder or getting out if. Ruger no longer makes the OA, and TC has been on the skids for years.

    Of course, there are cheap alternatives. From India! But I'm not going to open that can o worms right now.
     
  24. pat701

    pat701 member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2005
    Messages:
    174
    Location:
    chicago
    I sure do agree.
     
  25. zimmerstutzen

    zimmerstutzen Member

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2009
    Messages:
    1,073
    Location:
    banks of the Susquehanna
    When I first started in muzzleloading in 1973, I bought a CVA flint pistol kit for $29 dollars. A color Tv set cost $400 dollars. A new import economy car was about $2,000.00. A new american made vehicle was about $500 more. A brand new fancy Bear Target bow cost $120.00. IIRC a barrel of oil went up to $14. One thing that helped CVA was incredible price, a crazy lopsided exchange rate in which the dollar could buy a lot. Spain is no longer the backward place it was.

    I still think it is possible to make reasonably priced quality PLAIN muzzle loaders for under $400, maybe even closer to $300. But the problem is whether there are sufficient buyers to justify the tooling expense, insurance, payroll, etc.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice