Quantcast
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

AR-15 accuracy

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by Bartkowski, Feb 3, 2008.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Bartkowski

    Bartkowski Member

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2007
    Messages:
    1,616
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Search feature is not working for me at the moment so I will just ask. What kind of accuracy should be expected from a standard ar-15 with a 16" barrel? Bushmaster vs. RRA vs. Stag?

    RRA says that their "entry tactical" will shoot MOA at 100yards which is plenty accurate for me. But then I hear stories of a standard bushmaster shooting 4-5 MOA at 100yards. All insight is welcome.
     
  2. Bartholomew Roberts

    Bartholomew Roberts Moderator Emeritus

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2002
    Messages:
    14,613
    Location:
    Texas
    First, in measuring accuracy by MOA, you need to know:

    Distance
    Number of rounds in the group (5 minimum, 10 preferable)
    Type of ammunition (most cheap FMJ ammo is only 3-4MOA from a top notch barrel)
    Shooting position
    What the shooter can do at their best

    Pretty much any of the rifles you mention has more inherent mechanical accuracy than most shooters are capable of appreciating. I suspect all of them are capable of 1-1.5MOA five round groups at 100yds with match-grade ammo that they like (you may have to try a few to find what it likes best).
     
  3. cracked butt

    cracked butt Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2003
    Messages:
    6,986
    Location:
    SE Wisconsin
    There's a poster on another board that I visit that was complaining about only getting 4 moa out of his Bushmaster M4gery. He admitted that he's only shot Wolf ammo through it and didn't want to spring for some premium match ammo to get a better idea of what his rifle was capable of.

    My analogy about buying a high end sports car then being too cheap to put anything but the lowest grade gasoline in the tank comes into play...
     
  4. Fast Frank

    Fast Frank Member

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2007
    Messages:
    1,087
    Location:
    Houston, Texas (Woodlands)
    My M4gery (Smith and Wesson) doesn't have sights that tend to give great bench rest groups.

    It's setup for getting fast hits on moving targets.

    With the EOTECH, from the bench, It's done just under an inch at 50 yards with Remington 55gr soft points.

    Call that 2MOA and get on with it.

    Good enough for a combat rifle.
     
  5. W.E.G.

    W.E.G. Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2006
    Messages:
    7,392
    Location:
    all over Virginia
  6. Ridgerunner665

    Ridgerunner665 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2005
    Messages:
    3,393
    Location:
    Upper East Tennessee
    From my Smith & Wesson M&P 15...

    10 shots at 100 yards...iron sights...with a scope this group would shrink. These were handloads using 55 grain FMJ-BT bullets

    [​IMG]

    10 shots at 200 yards...

    [​IMG]

    10 shots at 600 yards, iron sights...4 missed the paper, the wind was blowing pretty hard that day...the quarter is roughly the center of the group. The paper was taped to a Cadillac hood...which was my POA...I cant see a sheet of paper at 600 yards. I fired 1 shot, then my son placed the paper over the bullet hole, then I shot the group using the same sight picture...

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2008
  7. garrettej8

    garrettej8 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2007
    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    that's pretty damn accurate for using just iron sights, nice job. I'm picking up my stag tomorrow so hopefully it's close to that accuracy. unfortunately I won't be able to go to the range for maybe a week.
     
  8. trigga

    trigga Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2007
    Messages:
    1,021
    Location:
    WI
    wow if i could shoot like that at 100 yards i wouldn't need optics... very impressive.
     
  9. Ridgerunner665

    Ridgerunner665 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2005
    Messages:
    3,393
    Location:
    Upper East Tennessee
    You can...it just takes a few years of practice. I grew up shooting iron sights (couldn't afford a scope)...by necessity I learned to use them. Its all about sight picture and being familiar with your ammo's trajectory. (not really that simple...but to put it in a nutshell)
     
  10. lencac

    lencac Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2007
    Messages:
    1,068
  11. Don't Tread On Me

    Don't Tread On Me Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2004
    Messages:
    2,213
    Location:
    FLORIDA
    Wow....I have 20/15 vision and cannot even see that at 100 yards.

    That group, made with a S&W MP (non-match grade barrel) rivals the performance of match-grade barrels, but was also shot iron sights?

    I'd have to be there to believe it.
     
  12. cracked butt

    cracked butt Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2003
    Messages:
    6,986
    Location:
    SE Wisconsin
    You mean that you don't take everything you read on the internetz at face value either.
     
  13. gcpd

    gcpd Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2008
    Messages:
    19
    I have the RRA Entry Tactical. You won't be dissapointed if using quality ammo.
     
  14. HJ857

    HJ857 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2007
    Messages:
    573
    I have a Bushmaster M4. I've only shot my own loads, which are slightly lighter than max with a 55g soft point. With a cheap Leapers 6x scope I can shoot an average 1.25" groups at 100yds. I was originally hoping for 2.5" or better, so I'm plenty happy with this upper.

    Mine is not chrome lined, does not have M4 ramps and the ramps are not polished, I only use PMags, and it's absolutely reliable.
     
  15. Ridgerunner665

    Ridgerunner665 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2005
    Messages:
    3,393
    Location:
    Upper East Tennessee
    Dont Tread On Me...if you were here I'd gladly prove it to you. I'm not your "average Joe" shooter...but since you don't believe me I wont explain any further.
     
  16. lencac

    lencac Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2007
    Messages:
    1,068
    Not to make this thread take a fork in the road, however, ridgerunner is to be congratulated for a job well done. I have seen and I have done with iron sights groups that others can't do with scopes. So don't kid yourselves into thinking that just because you can't shoot iron sights that everyone else is likewise unable. As stated it's all about sight picture, knowing your set-up and repeatability. Having a trained eye to focus at the correct spot at the correct time is somewhat the trick. It takes practice. Picking an arbitrary spot that allows visual cues can help also.
    This is a pic of a group I shot at 100 yrds. off the bench with my national match Swede, CG63, and iron sights, 6 rds. Also some iron sights are better than others. These iron sights are like optics without the optics.
    http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/3098/img2456qa4.jpg
    http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/4954/cg63nationalmatchswedebs2.jpg
    Is ridgerunner's pictured group his best? Perhaps. I know I don't take the time to photograph crappy groups.
     
  17. Dave P

    Dave P Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    1,600
    Location:
    North Florida
    "then my son placed the paper over the bullet hole"


    Hold real still now, son!
     
  18. Ridgerunner665

    Ridgerunner665 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2005
    Messages:
    3,393
    Location:
    Upper East Tennessee
    LMAO...he taped it there.
     
  19. Ridgerunner665

    Ridgerunner665 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2005
    Messages:
    3,393
    Location:
    Upper East Tennessee
    Is ridgerunner's pictured group his best?

    So far, with this rifle it is...I've only had it a few weeks.
     
  20. briansmithwins

    briansmithwins Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2005
    Messages:
    4,063
    I checked a friend's DPMS 16" upper with 2 types of ammo he's interested in on Monday. Target was at 50 yards, 2 groups on left were 62gr PPU, 2 groups on right were 75gr OTM from PPU. Point of aim was the center bottom edge of the 3" post-it, grid is 1". Rifle had YHM iron sights and I wasn't real happy with the light, but if you shoot in OR in the winter you take what you can get. BSW

    edited to add: Carbine was sandbagged and has a 1/7 barrel. Perma-mounted FH and the crown looks like 7 miles of bad road. BSW

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2008
  21. Guitargod1985

    Guitargod1985 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2007
    Messages:
    1,322
    Location:
    Florida
    briansmithwins, what twist rate is that barrel that you used?
     
  22. lencac

    lencac Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2007
    Messages:
    1,068
    As brainsmithwins stated it is a 1 in 7 inch twist. That is also what my AR is. I have literally tens of thousands of rds. through it and can confidently say the heavier the bullet the better it shoots. 75 gr. Hornady and especially Sierra 80 gr match kings work the best. It will shoot 55 and 62 gr. ok but nothing to write on THR about.
    Where about you at in Or brainsmithwins? I shoot at the JCSA range by Merlin. It is the best range ever!
     
  23. Bartkowski

    Bartkowski Member

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2007
    Messages:
    1,616
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
  24. dm1333

    dm1333 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2005
    Messages:
    971
    I would believe Ridgerunners groups. At 200 yards with iron sights and Wolf Ammo I was able to shoot 6 inch groups on a windless day. My groups tightened up to 4 inches with 75 gr. Hornady. With a 1 in 8 twist those Hornadys may have been a little too heavy for my rifle. The only other round I have put through that gun was a box of 45 gr Winchesters and I had a pretty nice pattern going!
     
  25. wcwhitey

    wcwhitey Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2006
    Messages:
    1,010
    No reason to not believe Ridgerunner, that is good shooting. Good quality practice done often can do that. I only have one gun that is scoped, my DPMS LowPro 16" Bull. It will leave them touching if I load the 52 SMKs right. I have yet to find a load that will get my Bushmaster to do the same. It has A1 sights and will shoot 1-2" with the same 52 SMK handloads. Most surplus and FMJ handloads will do on the better side of 2" and 3-4" with Wolf. Find a load they like and either buy a truck load of it or warm up the press.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page