Are Smith & Wessons diminishing in quality?

[snooperman]

Mustang Steve , My sentiments on the revolver is similar to yours

I like the nicely blue revolvers the best and have quite a few of the older guns. I grew up during the 40's and 50's when that workmanship was in its hayday. I do have some made of stainless steel but it took me a long time to get use to them . My wife and I hunt with them frequently. I have 2 semiautos, one old Colt 1911 and an old Colt .380, but rarely shoot them or bother to carry them as I prefer the reliability and simplicity of the revolvers. I still carry the old Colt detective special , in the pants holster, and have done so for a long time and do not feel that I need anything more.

 

[snooperman]

CNC machines

Computer numerical control milling machines are not new and have been around since about 1960. However the new machines are run by digital and analog computers which has allowed for improved usage to make firearms to save man hours in the manufacturing process. That is fine with me but I do not buy into the idea that they more precise because of this process. I do believe we are getting firearms made of better steels and alloys that make them stronger but that in essence has nothing to do with "CNC" miiling of the said metals at all. Nor is it an excuse for S&W not to finish the product in a more refined way either. It simply saves money to do it the way they are doing it. The guns made , in my opinion are no better than they were made before, they are made cheaper and faster and their profit margin greater.

 

[orionengnr]

What's with the lock hate?

Seriously, do a search and you will still be reading come New Year's Eve.

Now, as much as I dislike The Lock, I have to admit that my 25-13 (with ILS parts removed) is more accurate and has better fit/finish/blueing than my 1980s model 25-5.

If you can be objective, there are both plusses and minuses to the new S&Ws. If you stick with pure emotion, some will say that nothing made after WWII is worth owning.

In theory, I'd rather buy a pre-Lock S&W. In practice, I will take it on a case-by-case basis.

I have fired many Ruger revolvers but have never seen one that is superior to an S&W.

Just my .02 worth...

 

[ttheel]

i hate those locks to!

Seriously, I had reservations about buying my wife a model 60 because of the lock but I went ahead and did it about a year ago. It has been shot alot and carried around on trips etc and it has never been a problem whatsoever. I dont know why I worried about it so much. Things(changes) tend to get blown out of proportion. I would have absolutely no reservations about purchasing another one at this point.

 

[Confederate]

I'm not at all sure modern S&Ws are more accurate than the classic models. It's more a situation where S&W is cutting corners over older models. Tolerances are only improved if eqipment is calibrated often. With demand being what it is, I doubt calibration is much different than changing the oil/fat at McDonald's. Already S&W makes hammers and triggers out of cheaper materials, they've changed the bluing to a more environmentally-friendly and cheaper baked on finish, changed the external hammer to a frame-mounted hammer and now incorporate tacked-on front sights rather than the integral front sight that was part of barrel. I don't know what they're making their rear sights from, but they used to be steel and may still be. In other words, they've tried to cut corners without affecting the product as a whole.

Ruger also has cut corners on the GP-100s, eliminating much of the grip. Where the Security-Six had the grip as part of the frame, the newer .357 replaced the grip with a stem that extends from the frame. It doesn't affect quality, but was a way of making the gun cheaper.

 

[ironvic]

During the Bangor-Punta years, I had seen a few bad Smiths. My Model-28 from that era spit lead and tended to bind on rotation of the cylinder a lot. I also had a Model-18 .22 Combat Masterpiece from the era that had cylinder binding problems related to the release that never quite could be fixed. That said, they were both accurate shooters.

S&W guns under Lear-Siegler ownership during the 1980s tended to be rough in my experience. Even at trade shows, I found S&W guns of the era, especially the semi-autos to have gritty trigger pulls.

Under current Saf-T-Hammer ownership , I have a nice example of the Model 686 Plus-a nice gun, just as primo as any Smith has turned out. It's slick in every respect with a trigger that reminds me of the Smiths of old, even with the lock.

I recently tried some S&W J-frame newly manufactured "Lemon Squeezer" revolvers, brand new, at a local gunshop. The triggers were gritty and not at all like one would expect from a Smith & Wesson revolver. The guns just felt rough and not what you want in a high dollar revolver.

I guess each gun has to be evaluated on its own, but I'm especially careful when checking out a S&W and primarily buy them used these days, especially considering a history of multiple ownerships and regimes that focused on everything from forensic kits and shotguns to police bicycles.

All things considered, I've owned more delightful S&Ws than bad ones over the years.

 

[ironvic]

During the bangor-Punta years, I had seen a few bad Smiths. My Model-28 from that era spit lead and tended to bind on rotation of the cylinder a lot. I also had a Model-18 .22 Combat Masterpiece from the era that had cylinder binding problems related to the release that never quite could be fixed. That said, they were both accurate shooters.

S&W guns under Lear-Siegler ownership during the 1980s tended to be rough in my experience. Even at trade shows, I found S&W guns of the era, especially the semi-autos to have gritty trigger pulls.

Under current Saf-t-Hammer ownership , I have a nice example of the Model 686 Plus-a nice gun, just as primo as any Smith has turned out. It's slick in every respect with a trigger that reminds me of the Smiths of old, even with the lock.

I recently tried some S&W J-frame newly manufactured "Lemon Squeezer" revolvers, brand new, at a local gunshop. The triggers were gritty and not at all like one would expect from a Smith & Wesson revolver. The guns just felt rough and not what you want in a high dollar revolver.

I guess each gun has to be evaluated on its own, but I'm especially careful when checking out a S&W and primarily buy them used these days, especially considering a history of multiple ownerships and regimes that focused on everything from forensic kits and shotguns to police bicycles.

All things considered, I've owned more delightful S&Ws than bad ones over the years.

 

[Sir Aardvark]

I purchased a 629 a few years ago (circa 2004) and the double-action trigger pull was over 14 pounds, very gritty, and very rough! If there was ever a revolver screaming for an action job, this was it.
I also ended up sending this gun back to S&W because the MIM hammer was warped to the left and would contact the the frame on it's way to the firing mechanism.

My 340PD also had a horribly gritty, rough, inconsistent trigger pull - the same with my brother-in-law's 340PD.

A previous 629 I had from the 80's had a smooth, consistent double-action trigger pull of around 9ish pounds and had absolutely no issues (and no MIM).

I am not a fan of the post-lock, full-of-MIM, revolvers that S&W is currently producing.

With the pre-lock, all-steel guns, you could actually get away without having to do a mandatory trigger job on them - not so with the new ones (IMHO).

All in all, I do believe S&W is doing the best it can to still produce an affordable product, and their customer service cannot be beat, but please be aware that your new revolver most likely will need a trip to the gunsmith for some action work before it begins to compare with what was once a factory offering.

 

[WVfishguy]

I'm 53, bought my first S&W in my early 20s.

I can't imagine anyone my age or older preferring new Smiths to the old ones.

Forget the IL. New Smiths just don't feel right. They're - they're just WRONG

Sorry for the rant. Thank God there are so many good, old Smiths out there. God, I love looking through out-of-the-way gun/pawnshops, searching for that minty Model 58, or a good 13-1.

The S&W Model 27-2, the finest revolver ever made (and I'm including the Colt Python as well):

What a great country we live in.