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Are we crying wolf

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by jbkebert, Feb 26, 2009.

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  1. jbkebert

    jbkebert Member

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    I am wondering with all of the cries of Obmanation are we becoming overly paranoid. Yes I am as concerned as everybody else about keeping up our RIGHT to bear arms. That being said I can hardly imagine given the state of the economy that the Obama campaign is going to one day take away that right. Please correct me if I am wrong but to me the only things that are taxed as highly as guns and ammo is Gas, Tabacco, and Alcohol. I think the propesed AWB is horrible and I in no way agree with the proposition. Then on the other hand I can't believe that one day all firearms manufactors, ammo companies, optics companies are going to be told to shut down fire all of thier employee's and retool to make hybrid car batteries. There if nothing else is to much tax revenue to be lost.

    I am not writing this thread to be called a dumb###. I just want to know your opinions on this matter. Perhaps I am living to sheltered of a life in rural Kansas. Yes crime here is bad: Topeka shamefully had a higher muder rate per-capita than NYC a few years back. I do carry CCW and I to think that guns bans will do nothing to reduce crime rates. I also know that I am not going to be making any friends while asking this. Lets try and keep on subject though.
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2009
  2. twoclones

    twoclones Member

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    Given that one bill had already been introduced to require gun owners to have $1,000,000.00 insurance coverage, for even neglegent use of firearms, I'd say we are not crying wolf. Since no company would offer such insurance, we could not buy it and therefore could not legally own guns.

    The wolf is in sheep's clothing...
     
  3. prelaw09

    prelaw09 Member

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    Nope

    I'm a bit of a history buff. Remember the last AWB? this one will make the last one look like a walk in the park. Just look at what the great o did in his state and the bans that were in effect there.
     
  4. klcmschlesinger

    klcmschlesinger Member

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    Everyone just needs to do what they can....

    I don't think anyone is crying wolf. I believe over the next 4 years it will be a battle, a scary battle to not just keep our right to keep our guns but wart off the "tactics" to make it so difficult to keep our guns that people can't or won't be able to afford it.
    Everything that comes from this administration needs to be looked at carefully. And no judged for what they advertise, judged for its content.
     
  5. CoRoMo

    CoRoMo Member

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    Have you seen today's headline?

    NEW: Obama wants assault weapons ban, other controls...

    I recall several Pro-Obama THR members saying things like,

    I don't think he'll take our guns, but we'll have to wait and see.
    He's got too many larger issues on his plate to enact another AWB, blah blah blah.​


    He's been POTUS for 37 days now, and here we go.
    Thanks a lot guys.:cuss: Pro gunners supporting an anti.:banghead::banghead:
     
  6. DeathByCactus

    DeathByCactus Member

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    No, not with what I have seen. They are going to flank the second amendment and CHL laws as opposed to taking them on directly, imo. From some of the bills I have seen or heard about so far, he is the enemy in terms of 2A. I say enemy loosely, he is still our president and a citizen of this country. So don't take that in some extremist form please.

    In other words, I am expecting to see more laws that would strip us of the second amendment right should we "break new laws or restrictions on laws," among other ways of deception.

    I could be paranoid though, I am not as seasoned as some of the people on these forums who have been there and done that.
     
  7. twoclones

    twoclones Member

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    Since Mexico has drug related violence, law abiding citizens in the United States can no longer buy 'assult rifles'... That's a bizzare bit of reasoning.
     
  8. Zoogster

    Zoogster Member

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    No. It is not something new. Obama has a very clear voting record created over many years. You can trace his voting record back to his early days in Chicago and the one thing he has been is consistent. Consistently for as much gun control as possible, from outright bans on handguns, to assault weapon bans and anything else that has been targeted.

    I like hearing Obama speak myself, he is a great speaker even if his views are not to my liking, a much better speaker than Bush.
    His voting record however was not an accident. His views did not magicly change just because he had to be more popular for election.
    He is thoroughly anti, has been for for many documented years. He comes from Chicago, a very anti firearm place, with further roots in Hawaii, also not a bastion of firearm freedoms.
    He was on the Joyce Foundation Board of Directors for several years, an organization that funds a large number of our anti-gun groups. He was one of only 12 Board members making the policies and deciding how to fund anti-gun efforts around the nation.
    He appointed an extremely anti invidual as the top LEO in the nation, Attorney General Eric Holder. The person already calling for bans, and the person the ATF and the FBI will be answering to.


    You better believe new laws/ enforcement policies, increased stings, and a lot of new harassment of FFLs and others is in the near future.
    Things are still new, Obama has yet to even appoint the head of the ATF, but with his appointment of Eric Holder as Attorney General it appears it is going to be a very rough future for firearm rights.

    The pace is already significantly more rapid than the Clinton administration, and they have learned a lot since then.
    The left who vote most solidly for gun control currently have all three branches of federal government. You cannot even defeat the legislation in one branch of government without Democrats standing up for gun rights and against "reasonable compromises to save lives. :barf: " Are you counting on that?


    The top LEO in the nation just called for permanent bans. He is surrounded by likeminded people, and his ideas should face minimal resistance from the democrats.
    You think he is crying wolf?
     
  9. everallm

    everallm Member

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    TwoClones

    The Op is asking about Federal issues, your point is a dead bill in IL.

    CoRoMo

    This is just the usual regurgitation of a sound bite and last I checked the AG can neither resurrect non existent laws/expired bills nor draft, sponsor or vote on bills.

    I'm willing to bet this morning the AG is having a little chat with his boss who is reminding him who is the Executive and that he has enough problems with Biden's mouth as it is........
     
  10. ArmedBear

    ArmedBear Member

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    And that IS the scary part. It's become clear that (as many of us who aren't easily snowed by a smooth-talking guy in a suit expected) he has no clue how to handle them -- or he's just "handling" them by rushing to flow tax dollars to every Democrat interest group he can before too many people notice.

    Those who bet real money on the future of the US, however, HAVE noticed. The DJIA has continued its slide downward, with only a few upward blips to be followed by drops soon after. The dollar is down vs. the Euro and Pound again.

    There is absolutely NOTHING going on that would justify even considering changing gun laws in this country. This is simply pandering to the anti-gun groups that send money to Democrats. However, Obama-Reid-Pelosi are going gangbusters to do EXACTLY that, in eery area, while they still have political capital to spend.

    Nobody is or ever was "our president." We employ him to do a job; we are not his subjects.
     
  11. RX-178

    RX-178 Member

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    I honestly think our last, best chance is going to be the state sovereignty movement.

    I don't think there's any question that there will be federal bans in place during the next 4 years.
     
  12. rbernie
    • Contributing Member

    rbernie Member

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    The official party plank for the current administration, and the current administration's own web site, states categorically that they do value and intend to pursue implementation of additional gun control. They have laid out their agenda for all to see. There is ZERO debate in that.

    The question is not, 'Do they want to?'

    Of course, they do.

    The question is, 'Can they make a go of it?'

    Well, that's where we come in. If we're smart, and we actively and consistently work to remind our elected officials that we disagree with the current administration's position on the RKBA, then maybe we have a chance to ensure that the goals of the current admin remain just that - goals, and not accomplishments.

    The current admin has a lot of things to worry about. If we make it hard enough of a fight, then maybe they will simply decide NOT to engage in that fight and drain resources away from the other fights that they need to pursue. Holder can rattle his sabre all he wants; the question is whether the administration wants to burn political capital in Congress trying to push an anti-RKBA agenda. Our job is to make them NOT want to pay that price.

    I do believe that we, as a community, spend far too much time bellyaching over things and not nearly enough time doing something about it. I sometimes wish that I could implement a virtualized version of the 'cuss jar', only instead of putting a dollar in the jar every time somebody cusses we contribute a dollar to NRA-ILA every time somebody starts another thread of 'OH, NOES - the eviiiiil <insert derogatory nickname for our current president> bastid wants to ban YOUR GUNS!!!!!'.

    <sigh>
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2009
  13. twoclones

    twoclones Member

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    No. My point is that the bill, taking an indirect yet potentially effective approach, was introduced. Not that it might pass.

    BTW - This morning I have written to my Senator reminding her that I oppose reinstating the assult weapon ban. I urge others to do the same.
     
  14. jbkebert

    jbkebert Member

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    I agree completely with this statement. I wish that it was not even an issue. I do believe that states like Kansas, Wyoming, Montana, Texas, Oklahoma and many others have far to much to loose by banning guns, therefore banning hunting. Granted gun owners are becoming more outnumbered by the day. Hunters are even more outnumbered. As long as every state map I see for Kansas still have advertisments for duck hunting and deer hunting I am willing to bet it is vital to our economy for both in state and out of state hunters to come to Kansas. Yes they could find diffrent resources and tourism to replace those dollars in the long term. In the short term I don't think with a suffering state budget they would roll over and let the money go without a fight.
     
  15. Gardien

    Gardien Member

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  16. 2ndAmFan

    2ndAmFan Member

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    We're not crying wolf. Our rights as Americans are threatened again by people who have no clue what they are talking about, and in this case want to treat a symptom rather than the cause, and do so by denying us our Constitutional rights. I will be emailing my elected officials, who are Republicans and not likely to like what Mr. Holder said anyway.
    As one who had a gun pulled on me once when I was unarmed, and by the grace of some training and luck was able to disarm the BG, IMO the idea of penalizing Americans because Mexico is a mess makes about as much sense as outlawing the English language in the US because Mexico is a Spanish-speaking nation. The Mexico thing is only a blind to advance an agenda they planned to pursue anyway.
    Mexico is politically corrupt from the top down and we didn't make it that way. If they want our help in cleaning up the mess they must be willing to do the hard work themselves; something they've avoided for decades by citing their Constitution. Why is it we must respect their Constitution when our officials are preparing to stomp all over ours...again!
     
  17. Just Jim

    Just Jim Member

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    The real answer is in the Character of the president. BHO talks a smoothe game but can you believe what he says? His first bill that he signed tells you.

    He signed a tax on smokers for 32 billion to finance the health care that includes pregnant illegals and illegal kids. That bill raises 65cents a pack on smokes but because there are not enough smokers 22 million more have to start to fund this bill.

    BHO promissed to not raise taxes on the poor and middle class. Obviousely this tax bill only affects the poor and middle class. However since there are not enough smokers all you guys are going to be paying for this, one way or another.

    The character issue is the man is a liar. You can't trust a word he says so your guns are not safe nor are you. He is a smoothe salesman but then most good liars are.

    We all just have to be high road enough to point out and accept the truth.

    jj
     
  18. BCCL

    BCCL Member

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    In his entire political career, Barack Obama has never voted pro-gun, and has actively sought to infringe on gun rights and self defense rights at every possible opportunity.

    Eric Hold his AG is a virulent opponent of gun rights, and most of his appointees are also.

    So no, the wolf is here.
     
  19. TimRB

    TimRB Member

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    "We should all stop posting these messages and write to our lawfully-elected representatives."

    This doesn't work everywhere. For example, in California our US Senators are Dianne Feinstein and Barbara Boxer. I know from sad experience that if you send a pro-gun letter to Feinstein, she will send back a semi-polite form letter telling you to go ^*&# yourself.

    Here, the best approach is to support lobby/litigation groups such as the NRA and state associations. Remember, there are about 80 million gun owners in the country, yet the NRA is one of the top lobbies with only 4 million members. Imagine what we could do if even a *quarter* of the gun owners joined up.

    If the legislature is strongly anti-gun, as it is in California, the avenue of change is litigation, not legislation.

    Tim
     
  20. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    Heck no. They want all our guns, period.

    They will take and/or restrict anything they can pass a bill on. the Q here is what they can pass. We must fight now harder than ever as this is a crucial time in America for gun rights, as well as rights in general.
     
  21. jbkebert

    jbkebert Member

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    Great since I seem to do nothing to protect our 2nd amendment.
    I am a US Army Veteran.
    A life time member of the VFW
    NRA shooting instructor
    NRA Range Safety Officer
    NRA member
    Member of international hunter ed instructors association
    Member of Kansas Hunter education instructor association
    Kansas Hunter Education Instructor
    A proud gun owner
    A hunter.
    I take on my own time and own dime 1-2 sometimes three students from hunter ed classes hunting. I take them on everything from dove, pheasant, turkey, deer hunts. Teach them how to set stands pattern shotguns, sight in rifles track deer, scout for stand placment, field dressing, butchering and everything in between. I do this because I care. I want these kids going through our hunter safety classes to carry on this tradition and become gun owners to become hunters.
    So my friend do not ever make the mistake that I just sit on my ### and whine about my rights being infringed on. I am not some privlaged youth thinking that the world owes me something.
     
  22. Just Jim

    Just Jim Member

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    The democrats in power have run amok, they will not listen. Those who voted for them brought this on us. You reap what you sow, kiss your guns goodbye.

    jj
     
  23. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    As so many others here. Good for you. The ones we bring into the fold are the future. the Libs have been winning by teaching their mess to our kids in school. We must educate outside the schools until we can somehow get the schools straightened out again.
     
  24. Glockman17366

    Glockman17366 Member

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    Here's the White House phone numbers...call 'em!
    Comments: 202-456-1111. Switchboard: 202-456-1414

    Holder's Office phone number:
    202-353-1555


    They might ask for your name...if you don't have the balls to tell them your name, don't bother calling. Be polite but make your point!

    Copy these phone numbers to every pro-rights sites you know. A few million phone calls may get their attention.
     
  25. Lone_Gunman

    Lone_Gunman Member

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    There were many gun owners, including a few here, who foolishly believed that Obama would leave guns alone, because he had bigger issues to deal with. They bought into his platform of change without looking at the details. These people will be shown to be fools.
     
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