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at school yesterday

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by belton-deer-hunter, Mar 7, 2006.

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  1. belton-deer-hunter

    belton-deer-hunter member

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    well i went to school yesterday and not much to my suprise they had the drug dogs come in and search the school and our vehicles now the dog is trained to pick up on gun powder so of course he hit on my truck i get called to the office and they search it and in my truck they find about 50 rounds of .22, 12 gauge, and 30-30. and they even found a 20 gauge which i dont even own a 20 gauge anymore long story short i am not aloowed to carry ammo in my truck it is against the rules they say now does this fall under the 2nd? also i am not aloowed to have knives if my truck as long as it is on school grounds now does this sound like bull to any of yall?
     
  2. GTSteve03

    GTSteve03 Member

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    Don't park in the school parking lot, find somewhere across the street or something. Then they can't force their Socialist agenda on you anymore! :evil:
     
  3. belton-deer-hunter

    belton-deer-hunter member

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    that is what i was thinking unfornatly the parking lot across the street belongs to the county court house and am quite sure they might have some laws against that to
     
  4. HankB

    HankB Member

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    Whatever you do, don't get caught scattering gunpowder, gunpowder residue, Hoppe's #9, or anything else around the parking lot, on administrator's cars, or down the school hallways - searches of their own cars and lockers would inconvenience the people in charge.
     
  5. mr_dove

    mr_dove Member

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    when i was a youth I would have found it hilarious to spread gun powder all around campus. Not sure if it would be effictive to spread it on the ground though. I'd probably have to find a way to get some inside peoples cars or lockers.
     
  6. wdlsguy

    wdlsguy Member

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    If you are an employee, it's probably in the employee handbook. If you are a student, it's probably in the student handbook. So how much trouble did you get in? Did they fire / expel / suspend you?
     
  7. belton-deer-hunter

    belton-deer-hunter member

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    hank i love you i really do that was the hardest i hav laughed all day but it is still early to any way the princelple is a good friend of mine who hunts and owns guns so he only gave me a day of iss and he told me that if i went to the regular high school that i would have been sent to the distrect alternitive education campus so he saveed my butt but i still think that in my truck what i have is mine and none of there bisnuess
     
  8. Bobarino

    Bobarino member

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    last i checked, the 4th amendment didn't get negated on school grounds. perhaps you should bring a copy of it and show it to the administrators, along with your lawyer's contact information if they have any more questions.

    Bobby
     
  9. belton-deer-hunter

    belton-deer-hunter member

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    they have probable cause when the dog hoits on my truck he is trained to smell gun powder and drugs so it is fair but i dont see how a bullet with no gun is harmful what am i going to do throw them?
     
  10. simon

    simon Member

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    They probably don't search the faculty breakroom or lockers.(do they? ;^D)
    get some plastic straws, fold and tape an end, fill w/powder, just a little, and tape other end.
    Now, any rabidly anti-gun facilitators/teachers there? Know where their lockers are? Cars? Desks?purses/lunchbags? you follow?
    Unruly students?

    Frankly, if you negate they're reasons for the searchs, no, thats not what I'm trying to say, if they are getting too many hits on the school grounds, not only might they stop doing them ,but the media might make a fuss.

    Burn the evidence...
     
  11. 1911JMB

    1911JMB Member

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    "Whatever you do, don't get caught scattering gunpowder, gunpowder residue, Hoppe's #9, or anything else around the parking lot, on administrator's cars, or down the school hallways - searches of their own cars and lockers would inconvenience the people in charge."

    Thats hillarous. A friend of mine did a different but similarly funny thing. He saw what he knew to be K9 units roll up to his high school along with cop cars from several different agencies. He told the teacher "I'll be right back. You'll know why I'm gone in a second." He then ran down the halls yelling "THE DRUG DOGS ARE COMING, THE DRUG DOGS ARE COMING." I don't know if he managed to warn anybody in time to prevent any contraband from being seized, but he did manage to forwarn most of the school about a drug search that was supposed to be a complete secret to all but a few people.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2006
  12. Thefabulousfink

    Thefabulousfink Member

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    Personally I don't think haveing the K-9 sniff you car in the school parking lot is justified under the 4th Amendment. It is the same as stopping everyone on the road and giving manditory drug tests. If no crime has been committed then they have no reason to be searching for evidence. If the police had reason to believe that some kid was selling drugs on campus, then a search would be justified. This sounds like a regular every-day search and is total BS. They are just looking for reasons to get people in trouble which is the type of Police-State actions that the 4th Amendment is suppose to prevent.

    However, keep in mind that you are a highschool student, under the age of 18 (I assume), you are NOT a US citizen. You are NOT subject to all the rights and privlages of the Constitution. You ARE under the direct authority of your parents and administrators. And most of all, you CAN be subject to all the penalties of a FULL citizen, as well as any penalties the school thinks up. So try and stay out of trouble until you are a US citizen, then you can fight for your rights.:cuss:
     
  13. sturmruger

    sturmruger Member

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    I would ask for a copy of the rules in writing so that you know that they aren't blowing smoke.
     
  14. ChefGW

    ChefGW Member

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    This kind of stuff just burns me up. I remember when I was still in school, we had gun racks in the back windows of our trucks. I kept a fishing pole in one slot and a 22 in the other. That was only 10 years ago. I really am not looking forward to what my son is going to have to face in his lifetime. It's just sad anymore that an honest, upright American who wants to legally own a gun has to jump through flaming hoops to get one while criminals can buy one for 50 bucks from Jose or G-Dawg out of the back of their car!

    Oh, sorry about that rant. Hope everything works out for you BDH.
     
  15. Azrael256

    Azrael256 Member

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    My grandparents tell stories of shooting rabbits at recess. *sigh* How far we've come.
     
  16. asknight

    asknight Member

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    Thefabulousfink, just because you are under the age of 18 does not mean you are not a citizen. What are you thinking? How do you explain all of the pregnant illegals jumping the borders to have their babies? They know that their babies will be "natural born citizens", with full rights... to welfare, public education, etc.

    Why do we have all of these needy children on Medicaide, WIC, etc if they're not citizens? Why are we wasting all of our tax dollars taking care of non-citizens?

    I'm sure you now see the error in your thinking, I hope.
     
  17. c_yeager

    c_yeager Member

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    If it's a private school then the lot is privately owned property, and the dogs are legally OK. It would be like having your dog smelling around cars that are parked on your lawn. If its a public school I agree that the search is out of line. Regardless of what kind of school it is I dont think the hit from the dog is enough grounds for a search, I bet they asked the poster for permission, possibly on the threat of school sanctions (which should be held in the same light as a warrantless search without permission, but it wont be).
     
  18. Braden

    Braden Member

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    I sort of had the same thing happen to me when I was in high school (a whopping 11 years ago....man I'm getting old).

    Dogs came, I got called to office, sheriff's deputy asked to search my truck and I complied. I lived in a small, rural town at the time so the stuff they found was no surprise to anyone. A box of shotgun shells I had stuck behind the seat from my last hunting trip had apparently set the dogs nose off. They were less concerned about that than they were the 10" fillet knife I had in my tackle box (I used to keep my fishing rods and tackle box in my toolbox "just in case" I happened upon a good fishing hole).

    The principal kept my knife until the end of the day and then suggested that I leave it at home next time. Nothing ever came of it, but I didn't complain because it got me out out of class for a little while. ;)
     
  19. belton-deer-hunter

    belton-deer-hunter member

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    i am 18 and that is what i told the pricipal that i was 18 and believed in 2nd and he said "well so do i but that doesnt mean that i can bring a gun to school" but there was no gun! that is what eats me up but i am thinking just few more years and i can getr my ccw and my new colt .45 any way even in texas we still have to fight to keep what is ours



    and the same thing with me they even searched my tackle box their wordxs were " why you are quite an outdoorsamn arent you"
     
  20. ALHunter

    ALHunter Member

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    US Supreme Court ruling

    In these days of those idiotic "zero tolerance" policies, Belton is very lucky he didn't get expelled and and find himself at the mercy of some mandatory assignment to an "alternative school."

    There are dozens, probably hundreds, of cases addressing the 4th Amendment and school searches. Suffice to say, students are subject to searches of their person (athletes getting urine tests for drugs) and vehicle searches. The US Supreme Court has weighed in on this and the 4th Amendment implications many times. A quick search on Westlaw revealed an intersting case from 1985. Relevant to this thread is the following:

    New Jersey v. T.L.O.
    469 U.S. 325, 105 S.Ct. 733, 83 L.Ed.2d 720 (1985)

    “We join the majority of courts that have examined this issue in concluding that the accommodation of the privacy interests of schoolchildren with the substantial need of teachers and administrators for freedom to maintain order in the schools does not require strict adherence to the requirement that searches be based on probable cause to believe that the subject of the search has violated or is violating the law. Rather, the legality of a search of a student should depend simply on the reasonableness, under all the circumstances, of the search.”

    Note 2 from the case states:

    “State and federal courts considering these questions have struggled to accommodate the interests protected by the Fourth Amendment and the interest of the States in providing a safe environment conducive to education in the public schools. Some courts have resolved the tension between these interests by giving full force to one or the other side of the balance. Thus, in a number of cases courts have held that school officials conducting in-school searches of students are private parties acting in loco parentis and are therefore not subject to the constraints of the Fourth Amendment. See, e.g., D.R.C. v. State, 646 P.2d 252 (Alaska App.1982); In re G., 11 Cal.App.3d 1193, 90 Cal.Rptr. 361 (1970); In re Donaldson, 269 Cal.App.2d 509, 75 Cal.Rptr. 220 (1969); R.C.M. v. State, 660 S.W.2d 552 (Tex.App.1983); Mercer v. State, 450 S.W.2d 715 (Tex.Civ.App.1970).

    At least one court has held, on the other hand, that the Fourth Amendment applies in full to in-school searches by school officials and that a search conducted without probable cause is unreasonable, see State v. Mora, 307 So.2d 317 (La.), vacated, 423 U.S. 809, 96 S.Ct. 20, 46 L.Ed.2d 29 (1975), on remand, 330 So.2d 900 (La.1976); others have held or suggested that the probable-cause standard is applicable at least where the police are involved in a search, see M. v. Board of Ed. Ball-Chatham Community Unit School Dist. No. 5, 429 F.Supp. 288, 292 (SD Ill.1977); Picha v. Wielgos, 410 F.Supp. 1214, 1219-1221 (ND Ill.1976); State v. Young, 234 Ga. 488, 498, 216 S.E.2d 586, 594 (1975); or where the search is highly intrusive, see M.M. v. Anker, 607 F.2d 588, 589 (CA2 1979).

    The majority of courts that have addressed the issue of the Fourth Amendment in the schools have, like the Supreme Court of New Jersey in this case, reached a middle position: the Fourth Amendment applies to searches conducted by school authorities, but the special needs of the school environment require assessment of the legality of such searches against a
    standard less exacting than that of probable cause. These courts have, by and large, upheld warrantless searches by school authorities provided that they are supported by a reasonable suspicion that the search will uncover evidence of an infraction of school disciplinary rules or a violation of the law. See, e.g., Tarter v. Raybuck, 742 F.2d 977 (CA6 1984); Bilbrey v. Brown, 738 F.2d 1462 (CA9 1984); Horton v. Goose Creek Independent School Dist., 690 F.2d 470 (CA5 1982); Bellnier v. Lund, 438 F.Supp. 47 (NDNY 1977); M. v. Board of Ed. Ball-Chatham Community Unit School Dist. No. 5, supra; In re W., 29 Cal.App.3d 777, 105 Cal.Rptr. 775 (1973); State v. Baccino, 282 A.2d 869 (Del.Super.1971); State v. D.T.W., 425 So.2d 1383 (Fla.App.1983); State v. Young, supra; In re J.A., 85 Ill.App.3d 567, 40 Ill.Dec. 755, 406 N.E.2d 958 (1980); People v. Ward, 62 Mich.App. 46, 233 N.W.2d 180 (1975); Doe v. State, 88 N.M. 347, 540 P.2d 827 (App.1975); People v. D., 34 N.Y.2d 483, 358 N.Y.S.2d 403, 315 N.E.2d 466 (1974); State v. McKinnon, 88 Wash.2d 75, 558 P.2d 781 (1977); In re L.L., 90 Wis.2d 585, 280 N.W.2d 343 (App.1979).

    Although few have considered the matter, courts have also split over whether the exclusionary rule is an appropriate remedy for Fourth Amendment violations committed by school authorities. The Georgia courts have held that although the Fourth Amendment applies to the schools, the exclusionary rule does not. See, e.g., State v. Young, supra; State v. Lamb, 137 Ga.App. 437, 224 S.E.2d 51 (1976). Other jurisdictions have applied the rule to exclude the fruits of unlawful school searches from criminal trials and delinquency proceedings. See State v. Mora, supra; People v. D., supra.”
     
  21. Bill2k1

    Bill2k1 Member

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    I hate to break it on some of you older guys, but times have changed. A child in public school has no rights. There is no search issues. If it is on school grounds it can be searched, no matter who owns it. When schools handout the student handbook, it is basically a list of what rights you gave up entering the grounds.

    It is just the way it is. I learned not to leave my guns in the car when I went to school. When we went hunting after school, I would have to stop home and grab my shotgun.
     
  22. svtruth

    svtruth Member

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    Drug dogs

    must be different than bomb dogs, aren't they. If my dog snifs something, I'd want to be confident it was drugs, not a booby trap. Though it could be both.
     
  23. V4Vendetta

    V4Vendetta member

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    As much as I've heard from this forum, I'm so glad that I've been home-schooled. I remember going to public school until 5th grade & dealing with other kids & teachers was just :barf: . I'm a loner. A nomad. A real life Solid Snake.:D
     
  24. Lonestar.45

    Lonestar.45 Member

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    How times have changed. No, it doesn't sound right to me at all. But there's not anything you can do about it more than likely. In my youth, going what you went through, I know exactly what I'd have done, and it would have involved lots of firecrackers (full of gunpower you know) stuffed into lots of faculty vehicles and placed in funny inconvenient places.

    Unfortunately it's their rules, and if you want to keep parking on campus, they will enforce those rules or you'll have to park elsewhere. Good luck man.
     
  25. Taurus 617 CCW

    Taurus 617 CCW Member

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    I suppose when I have kids, they will attend my private, non-socialist, conservative, pro-RKBA, practical, outdoor survival school.

    History will focus on events that involved firearms rather than migration and tea parties.

    Political science will be from a self-defense viewpoint.

    Physics and chemistry will involve ballistics and reloading.

    Biology is the outdoor survival course that will teach them what to eat and what to avoid.

    Mathematics will include land navigation, ballistics tables, and basic cooking measurement conversions.

    Phsyical Education would teach them the fundamentals of mountaineering and hiking.

    Bringing firearms and ammunition to my school is highly encouraged. Leave the apple for the teacher at home and supplement with a non-vegetarian MRE. :D
     
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