Bad Guys are heavily armed in Houston

[philip964]

I have been checking the paper to see if the third AK 47 BG has been arrested and it has not happened. I would suspect he has fled town. Rumors have said all three BG were from Louisiana.

While I was at the website I found this story about a man killed in his back yard near my home. Apparently a very successful attorney.

"Lassetter's laptop and cell phone were missing. It appeared someone may have forced his way into the home and valuables were moved around inside as if burglars were planning to take them. Authorities recovered one .45-caliber bullet that was shot into Lassetter's head and two others that were fired into the ground. His own .45-caliber pistol was found beside him, but testing to determine whether the bullets were fired from that weapon haven't been completed." (this could be a suicide, but they don't seem to be going in that direction, he may have been shot with his own gun by others unknown, lots of possible things could have happened)

I guess just owning a .45, does not insure you will be successful in a confrontation with BGs.

 

[philip964]

Last night Houston police nabbed seven guys on an apparent crime spree, including an attempted home invasion. This group was armed with an AK47, a couple of shot guns, two semi automatic pistols, a revolver, several shotguns and a pistol grip rifle without a shoulder stock, I didn't remember the name.

They apparently were not the die hard group their weapons indicated as no shots were fired during the arrest by HPD and the home invasion was thwarted by not opening the door.

http://www.click2houston.com/news/23075643/detail.html

 

[Rexster]

The level of firepower among Houston-area bad guys is indeed increasing lately, in my perception. I see it in the BOLOs coming to the Mobile Data Terminal in my patrol car; shotguns and AKs are trendy. Bad guys have always tended to operate in teams.

I don't know enough about the incident under discussion to say with certainty that any level of firepower and skill would have been sufficient to stop the hijacking once it started. In theory, a highly skilled shooter could have responded explosively, and poured pistol fire into the two armed bad guys, before they realized the equation had changed, and kept moving, perhaps away from the kids, and preferably in a way to line up the bad guys, to complicate the bad guys' targeting. Yes, I did say handgun. Unless a long gun is already in hand, before an incident starts, whipping it out is fantasy. The rifle in a lawnchair bag is not a bad idea, but it takes time to deploy. (I use a lacrosse racquet bag, or a snowshoe bag, myself.)

While the father in question could have theoretically popped all three bad guys in the head or throat with a 5-shot snubby, a service-type handgun would be better, IMHO. You want something that FILLS YOUR HAND and has a trigger onto which your index finger falls naturally into place, not some cute little thing that has to be held "just so," and your trigger finger delicately placed to get the pad oriented just right on the trigger face.

When my son was small, I up-gunned, making it a point to carry my duty sixgun or autopistol when we were out and about. Small-framed snubbies were for when I was alone, if then. My son is now grown, and packs his own heat, as allowed by the LEOSA, but I still pack heavy, usually at least one P229, sometimes two. My minimum is an SP101 snubby, which behaves like a duty sixgun in my not-so-large hands, and it is usually not my only weapon. (I am not quite anonymous enough to specify my long guns and plans for their use.)

I avoid ostentatious displays of wealth, because they invite unwanted attention; I will say no more about that. Well, just a bit more: I conceal my wealth, in the form of high-end pistols and gunleather, and quality ammo, Surefire lights, and high-end knives.

 

[philip964]

Yesterday in Houston, the bad guys were not heavily armed, just sort of cunning, as we made the national press again. This time it was a man in a suit and tie posing as a Census Worker, who got a teenager to open the front door. Then that enable three men with guns to get in and torture and terrorize a family for a couple of hours until the father came home and was then beaten and tortured until he died.

So you come home and surprise! Bad guys have invaded your house and are waiting with guns drawn to torture and kill you.

I certainly have never though of that particular situation before.

The BG's were looking for a safe with cash and since they did not have one, our poor victim and his family couldn't tell them where it was.

This is the second time I remember a home invasion in Houston, where a victim was tortured because "someone said they had a safe with cash". Both times there was no safe and the victim couldn't tell and so died as a result.

I guess the only tactic here is to make sure no one opens the door for anybody anytime period and especially the kids at home.

 

[General Geoff]

To the OP scenario:

Any vehicle is a far more potent weapon than a pistol or even a rifle. I don't know the exacting circumstances leading up to the shooting, but if I were in the position, I'd be one to use the vehicle to defend my family. Unfortunately, with an AK, there would likely have been injuries if the BGs opened fire on me and my family in the vehicle. I'd be pressed to try knocking them down with the vehicle so as to maximize the time I have to drive away before they can bring their firearms to bear on the vehicle.

 

[rbohm]

Of course no legal, or even perhaps moral, fault lies with the father for owning an expensive/showy item.

However, there are some points to ponder about that. Criminals do not have the right to act against you simply because you tempt them with attractive, expensive belongings. The law, and basic "morality" says you have a right to be secure in your possessions. But reality says that ostentatious displays of wealth (especially easily convertible wealth) do attract the attention of folks who have no qualms about committing violent crimes.

Part of situational awareness could be seen to concern proactive choices to not stand out and make a target of yourself. It should be perfectly safe to walk down the streets with $100 bills stapled to your clothing, but it just isn't so. If you live or routinely travel to/through a part of town where violent robbery is common, decorating your vehicle with abnormally flashy and expensive wheels isn't any more wise than hanging out at bus stops in $500 Italian loafers and a Rolex.

You have the right to sleep out under the stars on Kodiak Island, AK while using a honey-dipped porterhouse steak as a pillow. But you should know going into the situation that you're going to attract attention from creatures whose first priority isn't your continued health and well-being.

Yes, you have the right to do so, and anyone who tries to take them from you is wrong. But you can be VERY righteous and VERY dead all the same.

I do wonder if the original decision to buy (if the number is true) $2000 worth of wheels for his car has troubled his sleep as he mourns the loss of his daughter. It was his right, but it wasn't wise.

so in other words you advocate that we all drive grey sedans with stock wheels and tires, dress in blue jeans or what ever else is off the rack cheap, live in a house that only fits our needs, etc. well i am sorry that you actually believe the bravo sierra you are spouting.

as for dealing with three bad guys, one with an ak, i agree that you dont have to outgun them, but you do have to outsmart them. situational awareness is the first step in that endeavor. since he was unarmed, and surprised, he did the best he could, unfortunately the BG's are a viscous killer type. if he had a firearm himself, and took out the guy with the rifle, what were the other guys armed with? if nothing then he wins as likely the others are going to high tail it out of there. if they have guns themselves, then he has cut the odds down, and the others may still high tail it to keep from ending up like BG number one, who was probably the leader of the group.

in the end, if the guy had given up his car, and the BG's take off with the kids in the car, he might very well have lost both kids rather than just one, which is sad enough. or the BG's may have decided to pop all three anyway.

 

[Sam1911]

so in other words you advocate that we all drive grey sedans with stock wheels and tires, dress in blue jeans or what ever else is off the rack cheap, live in a house that only fits our needs, etc. well i am sorry that you actually believe the bravo sierra you are spouting.

rbohm, please believe that I don't care -- even in the slightest -- what you own, drive, wear or live in. Buy the best you can possibly afford. You only go 'round once, right?

That's not even touching on my point. You seem to be desiring to re-cover some old ground but if there is some value in that, I'm willing to discuss the matter again.

In short:

I never said anyone has a right to take your belongings. I said that some folks WILL, if they have means and opportunity.

Most serious students of security and self-defense issues recognize that there are more facets to preserving your life and belongings than simply how much firepower you can bring to bear on an attacker and how fast. Reducing your target profile is always a wise move.

A successful criminal always sizes up his prey. He has to balance risk vs. reward. He has to say, "this fool looks tough and might be too much trouble," or, "this guy is oblivious and looks easily bluffed." He also has to say, "this fool has something worth taking," or, "not him... I don't see anything I want on that guy."

What do they see when they look at you? Are they thinking that you're just too mucho hombre to take-on? Well, that's good. But are they also saying, "yeah...but look at that big gold bracelet! If I can pull this off, it will be worth the danger ... but I could use a hand -- maybe Carlos and Eddie want in on this, too!" That's NOT so good for you. Part of successful self-defense is physically resisting. A bigger part is not being chosen as prey to begin with.

If that means you drive a nondescript car and wear clothes that don't advertise your wealth, then so be it. If you perhaps don't put a huge "JL Audio" sticker across the windshield of your car, maybe that would be wise, too. If you don't arrange your living room so all the passers-by can see your solid wall of surround-sound AV equipment and your 87" plasma TV, you are reducing your target profile.

Some folks have said that houses with nicely landscaped flower gardens get broken into more often than those without due to the assumption of the probability that the owners have more upscale tastes. Does that mean you aught to rip out the wife's petunias? Naaah, probably not. But how's that security system? And do you have good area lighting? Etc.

If you wear, drive, and/or show off things that get you noticed, then you are making a compromise. That may be perfectly acceptable, but you should do so with your eyes wide open.

Walk down a Detroit alley wearing a Patek Philipe and you probably should be making an above-normal effort to boost your mindset (situational awareness is part of this) and had better have your skill set honed to a fine edge as well.

as for dealing with three bad guys, one with an ak, i agree that you dont have to outgun them, but you do have to outsmart them. situational awareness is the first step in that endeavor. since he was unarmed, and surprised, he did the best he could, unfortunately the BG's are a viscous killer type. if he had a firearm himself, and took out the guy with the rifle, what were the other guys armed with? if nothing then he wins as likely the others are going to high tail it out of there. if they have guns themselves, then he has cut the odds down, and the others may still high tail it to keep from ending up like BG number one, who was probably the leader of the group.

Yes. All that is possible. But from the safety of our computer chairs we can certainly say that, once he had become a target, AND once his situational awareness was defeated (through his own negligence or through cunning deceptions by the bad guys) the chances of him doing ANYTHING productive become extremely slim. Don't give up, of course. Don't EVER give up. But we, as detached analyzers of the scenario, must recognize that there is little if anything realistic that will bring him through such an encounter beyond an extremely fortuitous series of what can only be described as "lucky breaks."

There is no blame. There is only the question: what brought him to that point in his life and what choices can we make to avoid treading the same path?

Maybe the answer is extremely simple: "If he'd have just had a GUN!"

Maybe the answer has many parts.

 

[Warhawk83]

Kinda encourages going down in a gun fight.

Have you noticed how long people on death row end up living in prison?

Some have died of natural causes, seriously.

 

[philip964]

This pair of Houston bank robbers were armed with fully automatic AK 47's. Fortunately the Deputy Sheriff, who was hit three times and a bystander who was also hit, are expected to fully recover.

One BG was killed by an officer with his "duty rifle", the other surrendered. Glad to see that the good guys are not relying on pistols with these types.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/7017913.html

 

[TEXMEX]

It's not just Houston. We live on the border and large-scale home invasions involving as many as 10 well armed Mexicans wearing paramilitary (SWAT) type clothing and masks happens here frequently. Last one was afew days ago right down the street from us.

They hit their target houses like SWAT teams = occupants don't usually have time to access a weapon to resist.

When (if) caught, it usually turns out they are illegal aliens.

As I have said before, the only way to be sure of being able to access a gun in the event of a home invasion is to always carry one on your person. A good pocket pistol (that's always in your pocket) just might allow you time to access a shotgun or rifle. However, in the event that 3-10 BG's crash your doors, you aren't going to have much of a chance. But a 9mm in your pocket is a lot better than just relying on a shotgun or rifle stashed in another room!!!